Retrial for Sentencing of Jodi Arias - 1/15 thru 1/20 Break

[Shadowboy]

If ANYTHING cha cha de la Rosa is the only person on the DT that hasn't performed effectively.

I've wondered for some time if M de la Rosa's behavior is part of the DT strategy. Especially since the DT seems to have "used up" many appealable foundations in the first and second phases of the trial.

 

[ohreally]

If 1 or more mitigation witnesses refuse to come to court and testify can they be made to do so by her defense team? And if no, how does that help JA during the appeals process (if her attorneys can't force witnesses to testify in her defense?)

JSS has told Nurmi one of the remedies is that he can subpoena them.

 

[mydirtysecret]

Ok I just read the ruling. My original opinion still stands. In my original opinion, I stated it would have to substantive. She received a new trial because they failed to call a witness that stated she was previously abused by the victim, and a BWS expert. Those are not character witnesses, that is substantive testimony in a BWS case. While I disagree with the judge who ordered a new trial but preserved the original conviction, I can see how he may have thought she wasn't able to fully defend herself. Susan Wright's case has always boggled me anyways.

 

[bsk]

What I truly found chilling was the article mentioned on his/her twitter(anyone want to send a copy to JA's mom/dad, perhaps it will resonate...):

"This may be what #JodiArias family was dealing with, to a greater or lesser degree"

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/05/13/magazine/can-you-call-a-9-year-old-a-psychopath.html?pagewanted=all&_r=1&

That is one of the creepiest/scariest things I've ever read.

 

[Caylee Advocate]

:seeya: I agree with both of the above ... I'll try to explain:

1st BBM: As LinasK names above, absolutely she would have gone after one or maybe more of the names listed above IF she had not gotten arrested.

JMO but I think the first one on her list was Det. Flores because he did NOT fall for her BS: the "little girly voice," batting her eyes, flinging her hair, etc. JA KNEW that Flores was not buying any of her carp and she was po'd that he did not believe her.
2nd BBM: And yes, I think after she went after one of the named above, she was going to try to flee to Mexico. By that point, everyone knew she was suspect #1, and no one to give her alibi -- oh, I mean no one to "grind on" !

She is one seriously dangerous :silenced:

She would have had no way to go after Flores at the time she was planning to flee, she was basically "in custody" at the time he was grilling her. But, I do know of a case wherein a female was in custody and a gun actually went off in holding cell. She had snuck it in via her va-ja-ja... true story! I'll see if I can find a link for it and will post if I find it.

http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.html?b=1&f=5&t=433014

 

[MeeBee]

Ok I just read the ruling. My original opinion still stands. In my original opinion, I stated it would have to substantive. She received a new trial because they failed to call a witness that stated she was previously abused by the victim, and a BWS expert. Those are not character witnesses, that is substantive testimony in a BWS case. While I disagree with the judge who ordered a new trial but preserved the original conviction, I can see how he may have thought she wasn't able to fully defend herself. Susan Wright's case has always boggled me anyways.

Just to be clear, I'm not just talking about character witnesses. I'm not sure if that's even necessary. I'm talking about them not calling someone to support an argument they have or have not made or not making an arguemnt that should have been made for mitigation.

 

[mydirtysecret]

I've wondered for some time if M de la Rosa's behavior is part of the DT strategy. Especially since the DT seems to have "used up" many appealable foundations in the first and second phases of the trial.

I myself have as well, from everything I've read on the role of the mitigation specialist chacha has not only failed jodi at, but failed miserably. She on the other hand, is an excellent accountant/best friend/prison smuggler. I'm not sure if those things would stand up to scrutiny in court though

 

[Hope4More]

How far can the judge push it? Could she say, "I find you in contempt and fine you $1,000/day until you have requested subpoenas for 13 witnesses (not including the Kiwi one). And if they are not completed in two days, the fines will continue and you will be placed in jail until such time as they are completed."

1. The judge doesn't decide for the DT who will or will not testify.
2. There aren't 14 reluctant mitigation witnesses.
3. There might be a couple of witnesses who will present via affadavit or the like. Or not. If not, it will be for strategic reasons that have nothing to do with laying the groundwork for an ineffective counsel appeal.
4. Failure by counsel to do adequate mitigation is grounds for successful appeal. But what is most often meant by that is a DT either didn't investigate possible mitigators or it failed to present significant mitigating evidence.

Worry if you so choose, but there's no point in it. This DT has gone above and beyond to investigate, create, and present mitigation. Not hearing imaginary friends praise her tracings just isn't relevant.

Adding. Reread JSS ruling. She states explicitly that the DT has already brought testimony in from one or more of those nameless witnesses via the testimony of Dr. F and Dr. Geffner.

That's the most painless route of all for the DT and they've used it.

 

[mydirtysecret]

Meebee, being that JSS herself oversaw COA cases (not as a judge) has considered the role or lack thereof of cha cha. Or maybe during doc dumps we'll see that jss came down hard on DT to instruct chacha to do her job and get those darn witnesses to appear?

 

[RickshawFan]

the torturing pets sidebar @ :19 of 1:59 Juan says "if this is the chart that they are going to be using I've already established that the family of origin issue is involved"

This refers to ALV's chart, right? ALV wanted to paint TA as having "family of origin issues" that would fit into a pattern that pushed him towards being an abusive person. At the same time, JA had testified that she was an abused child and had it hard growing up. I think JM's point was, in that case, JA fit ALV's pattern of abuser-in-the-making. In the JA column there was also the matter of animal abuse, stalking, escalating violence, verbal abuse..... JSS wouldn't let JM bring in the animal abuse category.

 

[RickshawFan]

ITA with you, Linda.

Imo, Arias is not the typical murderer by a long shot. Some say women have made Arias into something she isn't and I take issue with that. Other women haven't made her into anything other than what she truly is. We haven't created anything when it comes to Arias. She and she alone has created all the facts from the moment she murdered Travis and right through this resentencing phase. She is what she is and its frightening to know psychopaths like Arias have actually walked among us leaving countless victims in their wake. Even the way she relishes in defaming Travis for years is not typical for a run of the mill murderer.

Your post brought something else to my mind though and now I cant get it out of my head.

I remember when Dr. DeMarte did the MPI evaluation on Arias she tested high on one particular part on the scale but for the life of me now, I cant remember what category it was. I recall it having something to do with deviancy or perversion maybe. I could have it all wrong though. I do know at the time we discussed it at length.

Juan never touched much on that particular highly elevated area though from what I can recall.

Do you or any of our other posters remember?

Thanks in advance to anyone that knows the answer.

Wasn't that the psychopathy scale that was so elevated? But Demarte, IIRC, either wasn't allowed to talk about it or said something like there's not much reliable research data associated with it. Didn't JW on cross bring up that high score and pretty much stepped in it? I'll bet Demarte will be freer to comment on that number this time around. In Devault's trial, she had no trouble at all calling D a psychopath (maybe sociopath, I can't recall).

 

[TexMex]

Jodi's WaMu transactions June 3rd

 

[mydirtysecret]

Guys, I just accidentally stumbled on the support fb page. I read it for Less than 5 minutes. I think I have PTSD now. I need to hug a puppy to get rid of what I just read. How can people like that, survive past childhood?

 

[MeeBee]

Wasn't that the psychopathy scale that was so elevated? But Demarte, IIRC, either wasn't allowed to talk about it or said something like there's not much reliable research data associated with it. Didn't JW on cross bring up that high score and pretty much stepped in it? I'll bet Demarte will be freer to comment on that number this time around. In Devault's trial, she had no trouble at all calling D a psychopath (maybe sociopath, I can't recall).

Neither. JW was trying to question her on numbers on the tests suggesting she ignored them in making her diagnosis even though Willmott was misinterpreting the numbers. She would find a high number, point to it and in that snotty I'm catching you in a lie voice she'd ask what is this, Demarte would tell her, and then Willmott would say you didn't consider THIS significant? The she pointed to an elevated number labelled PD and asked with her head cocked what it was. And Demarte responded it's psychopathic deviance. Willmott ignored it and very quickly moved on. Juan never brought it up because tests were not meant to be interpreted in that way. He probably could have if he was so inclined.

 

[Caylee Advocate]

I have to recant the aspersions I cast about JA's lack of friends.

Upon further reflection, I think it entirely possible that Marissa DeVault and Casey Anthony would be willing to testi-lie on her behalf.

If they're not too frightened of her, that is.

A little resemblance?????

 

[Val1]

In reviewing old David Lohr versions, I thought something about tire slashing did get in, but I could be wrong. It was in JA's diaries, so that could have opened the door. I don't recall.

Speaking of JA's journals, Vol.3 -p.18, she refers to an "experience" she recalled when she lived in Monterey and how her deposit covered the damages and then on p.19 says it's "only one of many" that she recalls. Was that when she lived with DB, MM, BJ or perhaps another female roommate that may have refused to go lock herself in her room?

Sounds like there may be witnesses out there that don't include "would never betray me" ex-bf's, family, or anti-DP supporters.

 

[mydirtysecret]

A little resemblance?????

View attachment 67770

Weren't they locked up together? In my personal opinion, I think devault was instrumental in helping jodi concoct this ludicrous defense and accusations since they were locked up together at the time of story#3 evolving. Pathetic jodi isn't even smart enough to come up with her own lies she needs another psychopath to help her

 

[dog.gone.cute]

She would have had no way to go after Flores at the time she was planning to flee, she was basically "in custody" at the time he was grilling her. But, I do know of a case wherein a female was in custody and a gun actually went off in holding cell. She had snuck it in via her va-ja-ja... true story! I'll see if I can find a link for it and will post if I find it.

http://www.ar15.com/archive/topic.html?b=1&f=5&t=433014

:seeya: Yes, she was in custody, but sorry, I didn't explain it correctly

IIRC, JA called Det. Flores and tried to act all "innocent" and help find Travis' killer ... by that time, everyone knew it was JA and no doubt, Flores knew it as well.

Flores was on to her lies the minute she opened her mouth -- and she knew it. Good thing LE acted when they did !

 

[Colie]

Serious question...If you represent yourself, pro se, can you win an appeal based on ineffective counsel? Meaning your own counsel, not those that the court may have appointed to guide you.

Nah JSS said no to that. In addition say cannot go back to Pro se.

 

[MeeBee]

Meebee, being that JSS herself oversaw COA cases (not as a judge) has considered the role or lack thereof of cha cha. Or maybe during doc dumps we'll see that jss came down hard on DT to instruct chacha to do her job and get those darn witnesses to appear?

That's not really her job, I think. Her job is to investigate potential mitigation and interview potential witnesses and help put together a case. She very well may have done all of that. After all, she is the one who calls the investigator to come testify in the hearing. We're not seeing all she's doing. We wouldnt be. It's up to the defense to pursue this stuff legally and to compel people to testify. MDLR can't issue subpoenas.