Retrial for Sentencing of Jodi Arias - 12/11-14 ~weekend~

[krkrjx]

She was hoping the jurors would go home and watch her interview on the nightly news. She was hoping she could manipulate the verdict in the penalty phase..

That's right. Killer hoped the jurors would suddenly realize their mistake and do all they could to make things right. Lucky for her she had a juror who was anti-DP. No one was getting the death penalty on his watch!

The issue I have with this do-over is that this new jury got the cliff notes version of the guilt phase. They know what they need to know to understand and accept the guilty verdict but I am not sure they got all the information they need to vote for death. I think this will be Life or another hung jury.

 

[krkrjx]

Angelina Jolie has more class in her little finger than the entire defense team combined. Jolie, has a big family, is involved in producing thought-provoking, profound movies about the World War and genocide and travels extensively for humanitarian purposes. She has seen the effects of poverty, war etc. and has often remarked on the strength and beauty of those victims who in spite of such mind-numbing challenges are able to care for others. Contrast those real victims with this defendant who had a decent childhood... was given food, shelter and an education but decided to be a parasite. Travis gave her food and money but she bit the hand that fed her...she took away his very life. I think Jolie will pass!

I can't understand how any producer would think they might get "the facts" from the defense team, people who knew Jodi, and Jodi herself. Anyway, the only people I can think of who might want to see any production that tells "Jodi's story" are her band of followers. Anyone in their right mind would not waste their time watching--good grief if they just want to see a glamorized, sugar-coated fable about a girl killing a guy they will probably find that Lifetime garbage production rerun ad nauseam. Add that to all this bullcarpery happening in the courtroom. IMO, any citizen with a speck of intelligence will not be interested in another fictionalized account; I think Jolie would tell them to pound sand.

 

[Myvice]

I think he may not have been using it. It might have been one of the many "scrubber" programs BN testified about. He did say that he was deleting stuff from his working copy of TA's disk. If he had the copy of TA's disk plugged in to his Windows 7 (I refuse to believe even BN is using Vista; nobody ever used Vista—not on purpose, anyway) computer and he deleted it, Incinerator would show up in that $RECYCLE.BIN folder left behind on the working copy.

Skip this if it doesn't make sense, but, I was thinking part of what JM was arguing was that the recycle bin folder left behind from the incinerator program was empty making it impossible for them to duplicate BN's work to KNOW what changes he had made. Without knowing the changes he had made it can't be verified that nothing nefarious was going on.

Am I way off base?

 

[Luvrosco]

M

That's right. Killer hoped the jurors would suddenly realize their mistake and do all they could to make things right. Lucky for her she had a juror who was anti-DP. No one was getting the death penalty on his watch!

The issue I have with this do-over is that this new jury got the cliff notes version of the guilt phase. They know what they need to know to understand and accept the guilty verdict but I am not sure they got all the information they need to vote for death. I think this will be Life or another hung jury.

Well put, and I don't think she'll get the DP, either. Hope I'm wrong. It unfortunately, will also be a win for her despicable DT.

 

[Reagan]

She was hoping the jurors would go home and watch her interview on the nightly news. She was hoping she could manipulate the verdict in the penalty phase..

Not only was she hoping they'd watch, but she was trying to pull some good old reverse psychology by asking for death, and hoping the jurors would say, "Hey let's not give her what she wants. Life in prison would be more of a punishment".

 

[daisydomino]

Skip this if it doesn't make sense, but, I was thinking part of what JM was arguing was that the recycle bin folder left behind from the incinerator program was empty making it impossible for them to duplicate BN's work to KNOW what changes he had made. Without knowing the changes he had made it can't be verified that nothing nefarious was going on.

Am I way off base?

I don't know! It's so hard to tell from Twitter and liveblogged testimony. I only just last night realized that we were talking about $RECYCLE.BIN and not Recycle Bin, like the trash can.

As far as I can tell, the prosecution wants to see the copy of the drive that he started with. They want to compare it to the forensic copies that have been examined in the past. What BN gave them were 4 different work-in-progress drives, which are different from the forensic copy that has been examined in the past AND each different from the others.

BN turned over 4 drives:

1. Tony's drive, which has nothing to do with this case
2. A writable clone with live files
3. Another clone with live files which was writable
4. Another clone, writable, 20.9GB, Incinerator file found in $RECYCLE.BIN folder, deleted 10/22/14 at 10:16pm.

Perry Smith also examined Lonnie Dworkin's EnCase image, created 12/09. None of these last 3 clones exactly matched that image in size or content.

So, by the fact that none of these clones matched, they can't tell that nothing nefarious was going on. It looks like there is room for lots of doubt and there WAS something nefarious going on.

I don't know who looked at MesaPD's 2008 image. I can't tell from either Twitter or Beth Karas' notes.

Reading BK's notes again just now, I see recycle.bin written with the dot and 3 letter extension and I completely overlooked that detail.

 

[rose222]

That's right. Killer hoped the jurors would suddenly realize their mistake and do all they could to make things right. Lucky for her she had a juror who was anti-DP. No one was getting the death penalty on his watch!

The issue I have with this do-over is that this new jury got the cliff notes version of the guilt phase. They know what they need to know to understand and accept the guilty verdict but I am not sure they got all the information they need to vote for death. I think this will be Life or another hung jury.

M
Well put, and I don't think she'll get the DP, either. Hope I'm wrong. It unfortunately, will also be a win for her despicable DT.

I don't think 12 jurors in this case will unanimously decide to vote for life or death. I think we should mentally prepare ourselves for a hung jury. It will certainly be a win for the defense lawyers. Arias might ride high till sentencing day. Once she actually hears the Judge sentence her to 'Natural life' it's game over for Arias. She'll try to draw attention to herself and 'live it up' behind bars but I really don't care about that. She will soon become old news. She already is for most people. As long as she is caged in prison for the rest of her life it will be okay. This trial has got to end soon. One way or another it better end. I have fears of it never ever ever ending. :scared:

 

[daisydomino]

In case anyone would like to re-read some of the Tweets I captured from Perry Smith's testimony in the hearing last Thursday, I've pasted them behind the spoiler button:

Spoiler

09:34AM	@TrialDiariesJ	Juan calls Perry Smith he works in computer forensics for Mesa PD #jodiarias #3tvarias	Twitter
09:35AM	@TrialDiariesJ	Perry says he's been working on computers since he was a teen #jodiarias #3tvarias	Twitter
09:35AM	@WildAboutTrial	Smith goes over his background now. He's never had a store bought computer, he has always made his own. #JodiArias	Twitter
09:37AM	@TrialDiariesJ	Perry joined Mesa PD in 2009 #jodiarias #3tvarias	Twitter
09:38AM	@TrialDiariesJ	Perry says he had 9 months of training and testing and then an exam to see if he retained the knowledge #jodiarias #3tvarias	Twitter
09:40AM	@michaelbkiefer	Smith looked at the drive. He is referring to the wrong drive that was accidentally sent to Mesa by defense expert Neumeister.	Twitter
09:40AM	@TrialDiariesJ	Perry- The drive had nothing to do with the case. The name on the data was for a Tony #jodiarias #3tvarias	Twitter
09:40AM	@michaelbkiefer	Then Smith says he found "live files" that could be changed.	Twitter
09:40AM	@michaelbkiefer	Sidebar.	Twitter
09:41AM	@monicalindstrom	State expert explaining what a "live file" is. The second hard drive given to the state had live files on it, not just an image #JodiArias	Twitter
09:42AM	@michaelbkiefer	Perry says the defense experts incorrectly conducted their investigation. Hard to follow right now. #JodiArias	Twitter
09:42AM	@monicalindstrom	Expert - investigation is supposed to be make an image of the evidence, it freezes the evidence in time, no "live files" #JodiArias
10:01AM	@michaelbkiefer	Willmot says that was on a working drive that Neumeister was using to do analysis. She says it has nothing to do with whether was found	Twitter
10:02AM	@monicalindstrom	Willmott argues that these drives and working files have nothing to do with the missing files on TA's computer #JodiARias	Twitter
10:03AM	@michaelbkiefer	Martinez says "That's why he destroyed them," of files Neumeister said were wiped. Willmott says to look at original.	Twitter
10:03AM	@monicalindstrom	#JenniferWillmott says the original evidence has not been changed #JodiArias so this line of questioning is irrelevant	Twitter
10:03AM	@michaelbkiefer	Mr. Neumeister worked on these copies, because he's supposed to, Willmott says. Martinez argument irrelevant. Objection overruled.	Twitter
10:08AM	@william_pitts	But it sounds like his evidence to support that has nothing to do with Travis Alexander's actual hard drive… Only the copy. #jodiarias	Twitter
10:08AM	@TrialDiariesJ	Perry- That folder was present on drive and then deleted. There isn't any info at all, no data in the file. #jodiarias #3tvarias	Twitter
10:08AM	@TrialDiariesJ	Juan- So it could have been 70,000 files? Perry- Yes we just don't know. It was modified in the recycle bin #jodiarias #3tvarias	Twitter
10:09AM	@william_pitts	And if those 70,000 files are the incinerator program, then where did neumeister get the links he displayed?#jodiarias	Twitter
10:09AM	@WildAboutTrial	Willmott continues to object that this isn't relevant but judge is all "psschhhht.. exhibit admitted" #JodiArias	Twitter
10:10AM	@michaelbkiefer	Wiillmott again points out that these things have nothing to do with the original drive, only the versions that Neumeister was working on.	Twitter
10:12AM	@michaelbkiefer	Smith says almost 9,000 files were modified on working clone. Willmott's irrelevance objection again overruled.	Twitter
10:12AM	@WildAboutTrial	Juan asks Smith to explain what a hash value is. It's a fingerprint of electronic data. #JodiArias	Twitter
10:13AM	@TrialDiariesJ	Perry says 9,000 files have been modified on the working clone #jodiarias #3tvarias	Twitter
10:14AM	@SKrafftFox10	Perry Smith of Mesa PD says thousands of files were changed on hard drive clone used by defense's computer expert. #jodiarias	Twitter
10:15AM	@william_pitts	But again so far none of this proves anyone actually knew about it and covered it up. #jodiarias	Twitter
10:15AM	@TrialDiariesJ	The registry won't hold what a person is doing day to day. If a person is punching the keys is it in the registry? #jodiarias #3tvarias	Twitter
10:15AM	@TrialDiariesJ	Perry-No....that is in history #jodiarias #3tvarias	Twitter
10:16AM	@michaelbkiefer	Smith says that just because something is on the registry, it doesn't mean the user went there. It could be the anti-virus program.	Twitter
10:16AM	@WildAboutTrial	Commands being given by the computer involving certain sites would show up in the registry. Not things a person did on the cpu. #JodiArias	Twitter
10:17AM	@TrialDiariesJ	Perry- No..it has more to do with anti virus and commands. It doesn't mean the user was going there #jodiarias #3tvarias	Twitter
10:17AM	@monicalindstrom	Q: if theres an indication of website on registry is that an indication the user went to that website? A: No. #jodiarias	Twitter
10:18AM	@michaelbkiefer	Smith says that the drive was damaged. Martinez is done.	Twitter
10:18AM	@WildAboutTrial	Juan has no more questions. Willmott asks for a short break. Judge gives her 10 min recess. Hit the pit yall! #JodiArias	Twitter
10:18AM	@TrialDiariesJ	Juan- What happened when you went to make an image from TA hard drive? Perry- It was damaged #jodiarias #3tvarias	Twitter
10:43AM	@TrialDiariesJ	Perry says you can wake a computer out of sleep and it could be added to the guidelines. #jodiarias #3tvarias	Twitter
10:44AM	@monicalindstrom	Waking up computer changes files, could delete files depending on types of programs running, cont.	Twitter
10:55AM	@WildAboutTrial	Smith goes over the registry, and that they are commands and doesn't indicate that a person went to that link. #JodiArias	Twitter
10:55AM	@michaelbkiefer	Martinez redirect: Smith repeats that list of sites on registry doesn't mean the user went there.	Twitter
10:56AM	@WildAboutTrial	Juan wants to know if the general guidelines address defense attorneys and them handling computers. No it does not says Smith. #JodiArias	Twitter
10:56AM	@TrialDiariesJ	Juan- You were asked about Mesa PD guidelines. Does it address def attorney's and their right to look at computers? Perry- No. #jodiarias	Twitter
10:57AM	@TrialDiariesJ	Juan- Does policy in 2013 talk about waking a computer from sleep Pery- No it does not #jodiarias #3tvarias	Twitter
10:57AM	@michaelbkiefer	Martinez repeats that the incinerator file in the recycle.bin file could have been 70,000 deleted files.	Twitter
10:58AM	@TrialDiariesJ	Juan- You found the incinerator on the working copy correct? Perry- Yes. #jodiarias #3tvarias	Twitter
10:58AM	@TrialDiariesJ	Juan- It could have erased 70,000 files? Perry- Yes it could have been anything #jodiarias #3tvarias	Twitter
10:58AM	@michaelbkiefer	Back to changes on Neumeister's working copy versus the original. Martinez calls it tampering.	Twitter
10:59AM	@TrialDiariesJ	Juan- Couldn't it be tampering by having this incinerator program on there? Perry- Yes #jodiarias #3tvarias	Twitter
11:00AM	@WildAboutTrial	Willmott continues to object, same as before. They still have the original, these working copies have nothing to do with it. #JodiArias	Twitter
11:00AM	@michaelbkiefer	Willmott objects that Martinez has the original and that the working clones are not relevant. Martinez calls them files that were changed.	Twitter
11:00AM	@michaelbkiefer	"Counsel, please approach."	Twitter

Fingers crossed that JSS sees that none of this is appropriate penalty phase material and tells Jodi to wait to use this in her appeals.

 

[krkrjx]

I don't think 12 jurors in this case will unanimously decide to vote for life or death. I think we should mentally prepare ourselves for a hung jury. It will certainly be a win for the defense lawyers. Arias might ride high till sentencing day. Once she actually hears the Judge sentence her to 'Natural life' it's game over for Arias. She'll try to draw attention to herself and 'live it up' behind bars but I really don't care about that. She will soon become old news. She already is for most people. As long as she is caged in prison for the rest of her life it will be okay. This trial has got to end soon. One way or another it better end. I have fears of it never ever ever ending. :scared:

I agree. A "win" for her defense team is not necessarily a win for her, imo. The attorneys want to walk away from this with people believing they tried and if she does not get DP they can send that message a lot easier. But for the killer, this is the end of the road either way.

 

[katydid23]

I agree. A "win" for her defense team is not necessarily a win for her, imo. The attorneys want to walk away from this with people believing they tried and if she does not get DP they can send that message a lot easier. But for the killer, this is the end of the road either way.

I will see it as a 'win' if we get to keep the GUILTY verdict. The way the DT is playing fast and loose with the facts, and the way the Judge seems to ignore it, makes me very nervous. [The Guilty verdict in the Phylicia Barnes case got set aside before the sentencing because of a motion made by the DT for prosecutorial misconduct, and not revealing pertinent info about a states witness. The killer is having a retrial now, one year later. I am probably just being paranoid....I hope]

 

[sharpar]

I believe that the jury will find death. She slaughtered Travis. Her lack of remorse; the anguish of his family. She had sex and then murdered him. Which she admitted. The jury will have brothers uncles cousins sons husbands brother in laws and can realize what a void their murder would have on their families.
Juan is going to wrap up his case in a neat clear package for them. It will be impossible to ignore.
I dont see Mr. Nurmi connecting with the jury or giving reasons which would justify allowing her life to continue.
Her trip to murder has to factor heavily in their delibrations. Cant make anything she did ok under any circumstances. Nothing Travis did justified a murder sentence. NOTHING! !!!!!!!
Jodi and her " team" are odd and unlikeable.
Moo

 

[rose222]

I agree. A "win" for her defense team is not necessarily a win for her, imo. The attorneys want to walk away from this with people believing they tried and if she does not get DP they can send that message a lot easier. But for the killer, this is the end of the road either way.

I will see it as a 'win' if we get to keep the GUILTY verdict. The way the DT is playing fast and loose with the facts, and the way the Judge seems to ignore it, makes me very nervous. [The Guilty verdict in the Phylicia Barnes case got set aside before the sentencing because of a motion made by the DT for prosecutorial misconduct, and not revealing pertinent info about a states witness. The killer is having a retrial now, one year later. I am probably just being paranoid....I hope]

I don't see how her first-degree murder conviction can ever be overturned. I've never seen a case with so much rock-solid evidence. There is no question about whether the defendant murdered the victim. As Juan said in his opening statements, 'this is not a case of 'who dunnit.' She did it. We have photos of the crime as well as DNA evidence. In addition, there is no doubt that this was premeditated. You can even put aside the staged burglary and gas cans but it is a fact that she murdered him in three different ways. The autopsy photos speak clearly. It was done with malice aforethought.

As for all latest accusations they serve only to delay the trial. has nothing to do with this case. Juan Martinez is impeccable when it comes to his work. Misconduct on his part? Never. Could she get off on some technicality? I think it's highly unlikely.

 

[krkrjx]

I will see it as a 'win' if we get to keep the GUILTY verdict. The way the DT is playing fast and loose with the facts, and the way the Judge seems to ignore it, makes me very nervous. [The Guilty verdict in the Phylicia Barnes case got set aside before the sentencing because of a motion made by the DT for prosecutorial misconduct, and not revealing pertinent info about a states witness. The killer is having a retrial now, one year later. I am probably just being paranoid....I hope]

Of course there is always a chance of some technicality being uncovered by an appeals court. That's just the nature of the game here. I hope you don't lose sleep over this. It is not likely to happen but if it does, it does. We have bigger issues to worry about now--will she ever face a penalty for her crime? She's been found guilty; that's not changing anytime soon. But she has not received her fate yet and so still has a voice. There are more things wrong with this picture than I could possibly put into words.

 

[MeeBee]

I think he may not have been using it. It might have been one of the many "scrubber" programs BN testified about. He did say that he was deleting stuff from his working copy of TA's disk. If he had the copy of TA's disk plugged in to his Windows 7 (I refuse to believe even BN is using Vista; nobody ever used Vista—not on purpose, anyway) computer and he deleted it, Incinerator would show up in that $RECYCLE.BIN folder left behind on the working copy.

But I thought Travis could not have used that scrubber because it only came out after he died.

 

[BritsKate]

I don't see how her first-degree murder conviction can ever be overturned. I've never seen a case with so much rock-solid evidence. There is no question about whether the defendant murdered the victim. As Juan said in his opening statements, 'this is not a case of 'who dunnit.' She did it. We have photos of the crime as well as DNA evidence. In addition, there is no doubt that this was premeditated. You can even put aside the staged burglary and gas cans but it is a fact that she murdered him in three different ways. The autopsy photos speak clearly. It was done with malice aforethought.

As for all latest accusations they serve only to delay the trial. has nothing to do with this case. Juan Martinez is impeccable when it comes to his work. Misconduct on his part? Never. Could she get off on some technicality? I think it's highly unlikely.

RBBM

Oh but it could be. Remember appeals are usually granted as a result of a legal error. Granting an appeal is not the same as exoneration, though. She'd quite likely face another trial and quite probably be convicted all over again. Either way, it's a long shot and far into the future. It isn't as easy as some may think to be granted an appeal in the first place - I've seen appeals denied for ineffective assistance of counsel in which the defense attorney was literally sleeping in trial. Nurmi & Willmott's vigorous, if vile, defense amidst Jodi's periods of pro per doesn't even come close to qualifying.

JMO and FWIW

 

[daisydomino]

But I thought Travis could not have used that scrubber because it only came out after he died.

My understanding was that his Windows XP computer could not have had the recycle.bin folder.

The actual location of the Recycle Bin depends on the type of operating system and file system. On older FAT file systems (typically Windows 98 and prior), it is located in Drive:\RECYCLED. In the NTFS filesystem (Windows 2000, XP, NT) it is Drive:\RECYCLER. On Windows Vista and Windows 7 it is Drive:\$Recycle.Bin folder.[14]
​

I don't know what version of Incinerator was found in the $RECYCLE.BIN folder that Perry Smith found. I don't know the version history of Incinerator. Maybe you're right.

 

[MeeBee]

My understanding was that his Windows XP computer could not have had the recycle.bin folder.

The actual location of the Recycle Bin depends on the type of operating system and file system. On older FAT file systems (typically Windows 98 and prior), it is located in Drive:\RECYCLED. In the NTFS filesystem (Windows 2000, XP, NT) it is Drive:\RECYCLER. On Windows Vista and Windows 7 it is Drive:\$Recycle.Bin folder.[14]
​

I don't know what version of Incinerator was found in the $RECYCLE.BIN folder that Perry Smith found. I don't know the version history of Incinerator. Maybe you're right.

They said it was version 2.3. I looked it up and it looks like that version came out in 2010 but it's hard to find solid info on that.

 

[bsk]

Skip this if it doesn't make sense, but, I was thinking part of what JM was arguing was that the recycle bin folder left behind from the incinerator program was empty making it impossible for them to duplicate BN's work to KNOW what changes he had made. Without knowing the changes he had made it can't be verified that nothing nefarious was going on.

Am I way off base?

That's absolutely correct. If the forensics had been done properly, there would have been no need to remove any viruses. In fact, removing those is improper as well, because one would want to investigate whether any other nefarious results could be explained by the viruses that were found.

 

[bsk]

I agree. A "win" for her defense team is not necessarily a win for her, imo. The attorneys want to walk away from this with people believing they tried and if she does not get DP they can send that message a lot easier. But for the killer, this is the end of the road either way.

This is such a tough case for the state because an 11-1 final vote for the DP would be considered a win for the defense. All it takes is one soft or stealth juror who, despite what they say before the trial, decides they just can't award the DP to anyone other than maybe some mass murderer when it comes times to vote. It will be hard to be critical of the jury in that case, unless it turns out (like in the original trial) that a juror played the system.

 

[krkrjx]

This is such a tough case for the state because an 11-1 final vote for the DP would be considered a win for the defense. All it takes is one soft or stealth juror who, despite what they say before the trial, decides they just can't award the DP to anyone other than maybe some mass murderer when it comes times to vote. It will be hard to be critical of the jury in that case, unless it turns out (like in the original trial) that a juror played the system.

I would not consider it a win for the defense if Killer does not get DP. I would consider it a win if she got possibility of parole, or if she is awarded a new trial somewhere down the road. But if she goes to prison for Life, and then stays there until she dies, she does not win, IMO.