Thought and theories on Jeremy

[Etilema]

No. . .but it would mean that you aren't really answering that question. It's a dig. . .showing your anger at the offender. What the question is is a bit irrelevant.

Haven't you ever done that? It's similar in a way when, say your kids ask, "Mom, where are my shoes?" And you answer, "Idk, why don't you ask the person who put the empty milk carton back in the fridge."

You might know where their shoes are. . .but you're getting in your dig, because you are annoyed by the empty milk carton, while making it appear that you are answering their question (even though you are really not.)

There's that passive aggressive thing again.

Yep, I understand what you mean. So his answer really wasn't about who took the baby at all.

 

[dog.gone.cute]

Idk. . .it's a problem for sure.

The thing is. . .I think this JI as the one explains everything. . .from the behavior to how and why things were done the way they were. . .just everything. . .EXCEPT that he is apparently on video at work. BUT that came from JI.

I really wonder if JI refused a poly on the 5th. JI says he just asked to take a break, but I have my doubts. Is that why LE said the parents were no longer cooperating on the 6th?

ETA- and then on the 7th it was reported that they hired an attorney.

BBM: I totally agree ... I think Jeremy REFUSED a poly because he knows "something" ... :waitasec: still don't know what that "something" is yet ...

So...since this is a theory thread...

What if Jeremy HAS taken a poly and has failed? We know that he told us in the beginning that he had not taken one, but what if since then he took one and didn't pass? We surely know that LE isn't going to release any information, and we definitely know that the lawyers aren't going to tell us. For all we know he has failed one.

1st BBM: This is a good possibility ...

Now what I do NOT believe from Jeremy is his "statement" that LE told him he did NOT need to take a poly -- I call bull on that one ...

Absolutely NO way ... LE would want him in there taking a poly immediately -- even IF his "alibi" was "verified" ...

2nd BBM: :waitasec: Just thought of something after re-reading your post :

Speculating here : What IF Jeremy took a poly and failed ? That would make it where BOTH he and Deb BOTH failed polys ...

Hmmm ... JMO ... but I have no doubt that IF JI was given one, he failed it ... no doubt in my mind ...

Hmmm ... so that would be BOTH parents failing the polys ... :waitasec: no wonder they hired not 1, but 2 criminal defense attorneys ...

All JMO and MOO ...

 

[cityslick]

BBM: I totally agree ... I think Jeremy REFUSED a poly because he knows "something" ... :waitasec: still don't know what that "something" is yet ...







1st BBM: This is a good possibility ...

Now what I do NOT believe from Jeremy is his "statement" that LE told him he did NOT need to take a poly -- I call bull on that one ...

Absolutely NO way ... LE would want him in there taking a poly immediately -- even IF his "alibi" was "verified" ...

2nd BBM: :waitasec: Just thought of something after re-reading your post :

Speculating here : What IF Jeremy took a poly and failed ? That would make it where BOTH he and Deb BOTH failed polys ...

Hmmm ... JMO ... but I have no doubt that IF JI was given one, he failed it ... no doubt in my mind ...

Hmmm ... so that would be BOTH parents failing the polys ... :waitasec: no wonder they hired not 1, but 2 criminal defense attorneys ...

All JMO and MOO ...

BBM

In this scenario though, what would make you believe that JI is lying about the LDT and DB is telling the truth about the LDT? Not only that, but the 'truth' that DB is telling actually is to her detriment, not her benefit? If JI was going to lie about the LDT, why wouldn't he just say he passed it, even if he failed?

I don't think LE is under any obligation to tell someone whether they passed or failed or even be truthful in the result that they tell them. If they both failed and LE both told them they failed, why would DB be the one totally forthcoming on that but JI doesn't even say he took one?

 

[hambirg]

This is why I think JI came home, DB said something to JI after they saw BL wasn't around, something specific pertaining to SB (perhaps based on a comment that SB said to her while outside or a vibe she got from SB while outside), the first place JI goes to is SB's door? Now, why is that. We're starting to find out now (via RR) that it's not like DB and SB were life long friends. Now, you can look at that in two ways (depending on where you stand). If you believe they are guilty, you can say that DB needed to find someone to pin something on, SB is the first person that pops in her head (because that's the last person she was talking too) and tells JI this so JI goes to SB looking for BL. If you believe they are innocent, DB realized BL is gone and now something that SB told her makes her think SB took the child.

Consider this. Everyone has been criticizing (and most of it is warranted) DB about her behavior that night. What if as the night went on, SB started making comments to her about that as well, like 'you should be checking on your kids' or 'do you think it's a good idea for you to be out all hours here drinking'. SB has also been drinking, and usually as you drink, more stuff comes out of your mouth that you wouldn't normally say. Now, I know this would be hypocrisy, since SB was doing the same thing with her own daughter, but perhaps the comments were more pointed toward BL (she's a baby, you should be checking on her more). DB goes inside, goes to sleep. JI comes home, BL is missing, it goes like this:

DB: Go check SB's house
JI: Why?
DB: Well, she was giving me crap earlier about checking on BL
JI: You think she would take her out of here?
DB: Who knows what going on in her head, she was going on and on about cheating on her husband, giving me crap about BL, etc, etc, etc.

JI goes to SB's house and knocks on the door. SB answers the door, says I got no kid. Perhaps JI doesn't believe her first and asks again, SB tells him again BL isn't there, she would never take a baby, etc.

JI calls LE. Elapsed time = 15 minutes

It's possible, but I don't find it probable because DB and SB are apparently still friends and spend time together. I think if SB was being critical of DB and DB suspected SB of taking BL she wouldn't still be friends with her.

I think JI went off to SB's to ditch the phones on the way. . .and to make it look like he was really looking for BL and suspecting that BL being at SB's was a possibility.

MOO

 

[vlpate]

Here is something that doesn't fit and it makes me wonder if the police are telling the truth about JI being on video the whole time.

They still want them both in questioning but separate.

I don't believe LE ever said Jeremy was on video that night - at least not publicly. I'm not sure where this even originated....not saying they (LE), do or don't, just that they have never said it.

 

[cityslick]

It's possible, but I don't find it probable because DB and SB are apparently still friends and spend time together. I think if SB was being critical of DB and DB suspected SB of taking BL she wouldn't still be friends with her.

I think JI went off to SB's to ditch the phones on the way. . .and to make it look like he was really looking for BL and suspecting that BL being at SB's was a possibility.

MOO

It could of been just an initial reaction by DB. Even then, it could of been where JI wasn't accusatory when he knocked on the door to look for her. SB doesn't know what DB told JI before he went to her house.

As far as them being still friends, they may still be in contact, not sure. RR mentioned that SB doesn't live there anymore, JB does (or did I get that mixed up)?

I don't JI had time to do anything with the phones, I really don't We don't know when JI knocked on the door but you got to figure that got SB's attention to where she came out of the house and JI was probably accounted for until he made the phone call. So it's not even the full 15 minutes before he called LE in order to conceal anything.

 

[cityslick]

I don't believe LE ever said Jeremy was on video that night - at least not publicly. I'm not sure where this even originated....not saying they (LE), do or don't, just that they have never said it.

There was a quote by LE that said his story checked out (of where he was that night). I think there was another story about the video so you would think using that, plus what his boss and the co worker that was with him that night told LE reaffirmed the alibi.

 

[norest4thewicked]

BBM: I totally agree ... I think Jeremy REFUSED a poly because he knows "something" ... :waitasec: still don't know what that "something" is yet ...







1st BBM: This is a good possibility ...

Now what I do NOT believe from Jeremy is his "statement" that LE told him he did NOT need to take a poly -- I call bull on that one ...

Absolutely NO way ... LE would want him in there taking a poly immediately -- even IF his "alibi" was "verified" ...

2nd BBM: :waitasec: Just thought of something after re-reading your post :

Speculating here : What IF Jeremy took a poly and failed ? That would make it where BOTH he and Deb BOTH failed polys ...

Hmmm ... JMO ... but I have no doubt that IF JI was given one, he failed it ... no doubt in my mind ...

Hmmm ... so that would be BOTH parents failing the polys ... :waitasec: no wonder they hired not 1, but 2 criminal defense attorneys ...

All JMO and MOO ...

BBM

This is kinda what I was getting at. I think that it is totally plausible that he failed one too and that is why these two hired the lawyers so quickly, are attached at the hip and don't want anyone talking to the boys. JI doesn't even want grandma (his own mother) visiting with the boys, so there must be a good reason (in JI's mind) to keep themselves all isolated.

 

[norest4thewicked]

BBM

In this scenario though, what would make you believe that JI is lying about the LDT and DB is telling the truth about the LDT? Not only that, but the 'truth' that DB is telling actually is to her detriment, not her benefit? If JI was going to lie about the LDT, why wouldn't he just say he passed it, even if he failed?

I don't think LE is under any obligation to tell someone whether they passed or failed or even be truthful in the result that they tell them. If they both failed and LE both told them they failed, why would DB be the one totally forthcoming on that but JI doesn't even say he took one?

My opinion is that perhaps JI took the polygraph AFTER DB. Maybe DB made her comment about failing the poly before JI had taken his. Maybe this is why they cut off all communication with LE. Maybe JI had taken his and they told him he failed and he got mad and stormed out. Then, he came home and told DB that they were done. Something happened that day that changed the tone of the investigation and I don't think that LE searching in the woods for Lisa is all there is.

 

[dog.gone.cute]

BBM

In this scenario though, what would make you believe that JI is lying about the LDT and DB is telling the truth about the LDT? Not only that, but the 'truth' that DB is telling actually is to her detriment, not her benefit? If JI was going to lie about the LDT, why wouldn't he just say he passed it, even if he failed?

I don't think LE is under any obligation to tell someone whether they passed or failed or even be truthful in the result that they tell them. If they both failed and LE both told them they failed, why would DB be the one totally forthcoming on that but JI doesn't even say he took one?

JMO and speculation here :

I think that Deb "slipped up" when she stated "publicly" that she FAILED the LDT ... that is one thing your "defense attorney" does not want "out there" -- that you failed a poly ... This was a "big slip" on DB's part ...

Now as to Jeremy - who rarely speaks - could it be that since Deb had "slipped up" and let "the cat out of the bag" that she FAILED a poly, I think Jeremy's "defense attorney's" gave him some "advice" as to HOW Jeremy should answer any questions on a poly ...

Another way of looking at it is like this : IF Jeremy would have taken a poly and passed it -- he would be bragging about it -- and so would his defense attorneys ... which makes me believe that Jeremy took one and failed ...

This is what "criminal defense attorneys" do -- and -- criminal defense attorney do NOT like polys to begin with so if a client fails the poly, that is one thing that they do not want out there ...

JMO and MOO ...

 

[Elley Mae]

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/10/07/us-crime-baby-kidnapping-idUSTRE79572I20111007

"I just couldn't take it anymore," Irwin said on "Good Morning America" Friday. "I told them I had to have a break." He said the couple is still doing everything possible to find Lisa.

http://www.boston.com/news/nation/a...sing_mo_girls_parents_say_theyre_cooperating/

Irwin, 28, said he also offered to take a test but police told him it wasn't necessary.

Kansas City police spokesman Steve Young declined to comment on whether the parents have been tested, citing the ongoing investigation.

 

[Elley Mae]

http://www.ksl.com/emedia/apimage/78c76f45-6014-429c-9d8e-0ae03574787d.jpg?filter=ksl/pgallery

he has shifty eyes

 

[dog.gone.cute]

My opinion is that perhaps JI took the polygraph AFTER DB. Maybe DB made her comment about failing the poly before JI had taken his. Maybe this is why they cut off all communication with LE. Maybe JI had taken his and they told him he failed and he got mad and stormed out. Then, he came home and told DB that they were done. Something happened that day that changed the tone of the investigation and I don't think that LE searching in the woods for Lisa is all there is.

:rocker: :rocker: I think you "nailed it" here !

I totally agree that "something happened" that changed the tone of the investigation -- and it was something MAJOR !

MOO ...

 

[Dr.Fessel]

No. . .but it would mean that you aren't really answering that question. It's a dig. . .showing your anger at the offender. What the question is is a bit irrelevant.

Haven't you ever done that? It's similar in a way when, say your kids ask, "Mom, where are my shoes?" And you answer, "Idk, why don't you ask the person who put the empty milk carton back in the fridge."

You might know where their shoes are. . .but you're getting in your dig, because you are annoyed by the empty milk carton, while making it appear that you are answering their question (even though you are really not.)

There's that passive aggressive thing again.

I wonder if it was a dig based "hey I told you to stay away from her". No spouse wants their partner hanging around someone who is a cheater.

 

[Whisperer]

BBM

This is kinda what I was getting at. I think that it is totally plausible that he failed one too and that is why these two hired the lawyers so quickly, are attached at the hip and don't want anyone talking to the boys. JI doesn't even want grandma (his own mother) visiting with the boys, so there must be a good reason (in JI's mind) to keep themselves all isolated.

The odd thing is JI has no problem with Phil, a 20 yr. old who some say has absolutely nothing to do with this.

Instead of JI/DB wanting to be soothed in the loving arms of a parent, they run to a kid's house and spend the month. This goes against every grain of thought regarding what a young parent would do in an emergency. The grandparents would nurture the young boy, be available for baby-sitting, cooking, laundry and the press.

This is one more oddity to add to the list. What was the reason they ran to Phil, a young man barely out of his teens? This flails in the face of logic. For Jeremy to allow this boy in at such a critical time in his life shows a closeness or trust in him. Exactly what does Phil N know about what happened on Oct.3? They had to do some talking while there.

The fact that neither parent wanted to be nurtured at this critical time sends up red flags. DB didn't even go to her Dad's or Grandpa's either.

The fact that Jeremy didn't even call his mother when Lisa vanished is unheard of. He must have real hatred for them. These two parents have some problems that we will hear about in the future. DB talking about completing "Our" family is just nonsense. JI rejects his family and I see no signs of him wanting Lisa to have a family...unless you consider five people, now four, closely tied inside of a house and not talking, except with attorneys and maybe Phil, "Family".

 

[hambirg]

I wonder if it was a dig based "hey I told you to stay away from her". No spouse wants their partner hanging around someone who is a cheater.

Maybe, but I think it was the way he was looking at DB too. Add in his body language towards DB in those early days, and I think he was referring to DB and not SB.

MOO

 

[Dr.Fessel]

In this interview Deb admits she was drunk but still Jeremy jumps in when Deb is asked a question. I thought at the time he was just defending Deb and her being drunk but you know I think he is really promoting that window as being the entry point.

ALEXANDER: When Jeremy got home just before 4 in the morning , he says he found the front door unlocked, several lights on, and a window screen tampered with. Police have tried to recreate how an abductor might have broken into the home through that window. Does it seem feasible to you that someone could have gotten in while you and your two boys were sleeping and you wouldn't have heard a thing?

Mr. IRWIN: Our bedroom is on the exact opposite corner of the house, and she sleeps with the fan on high.

Ms. BRADLEY: Yeah, but they must have been doing it much quieter than the police were.

Mr. IRWIN: Yeah, quieter.


http://today.msnbc.msn.com/id/44927...m-i-was-drunk-when-she-vanished/#.T0gHbHorxXY

 

[Whisperer]

How close is Jeremy and Phil? Since DB is extremely close, did Jeremy feel the same way? Maybe, maybe not. Jeremy didn't go to his folks when Lisa vanished. DB never went to her folks. They both found refuge with a kid barely out of his teens.

Phil HAS to know something. Locked up with these two for a month? Unless Phil moved out and stayed somewhere else, he had to get an earful.

 

[Dr.Fessel]

Why is Jeremy so focused on that window when we have a garage door unlocked and a front door unlocked.

He goes to extremes putting his family sleeping at the other edge of the universe compared to that window.

I think he is doing it because he knows if the person came in the front door then odds are it was a family member and that would point to him.

 

[Elley Mae]

And she admits she forgot to close the window in the computer room, which she believes is the likely entry point for an intruder, and "that's something I have to live with."


http://www.starpulse.com/news/index.php/2011/10/23/missing_baby_lisa_irwins_mother_we_hav