Tiger kills man at San Francisco Zoo (Part 2)

[southcitymom]

I'm sure some animals can be unpredictable just look at what happened to Siegfeld and Roy. Their very own white tiger attacked one of them, can't remember which one though, sorry.

Great point, PD.

 

[Logger]

I am only going to post this once.

Tatiana was in that enclosure for YEARS (literally). She never tried to get out before. She was apparently content to stay there until something aggitated her so badly she felt the need to get out of it. YEARS and no, the zoo is not at fault. Just rememember that. She was in there for YEARS and content to stay in there for YEARS until whatever happened, happened.

It's not like she decided, "Hey! It's Christmas, maybe I'll go out and get me some human meat for a change to treat myself."

The brothers refusal to talk even to give their names indicates to me that they were guilty of causing her enough aggitation to get out of the enclosure.

It is not just Tatiana who lived happily in the enclosure for YEARS. The enclosure has been there SEVENTY NINE (79) YEARS. In addition NEVER in the history of the United States accredited zoos has a tiger or other wild animal living a zoo "jumped" or "leaped" over fencing, however many feet high it was.

The threesome must have done something to provoke the tiger. This is a very unusual situation. I don't think the zoo is responsible. I think the brothers may be responsible to contributing to the 17 year olds death.

 

[cinsbythesea]

Here's the latest from the Chron- just acting like "normal kids at the zoo" or so they say...

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2008/01/10/BAL3UD47V.DTL&tsp=1

 

[Buzz Mills]

Tatiana had a stomach full of undigested meat. Every cat I have ever had, or known, always sleeps after a full meal, the same behavior cats have in the wild.

 

[Texana]

Here's the latest from the Chron- just acting like "normal kids at the zoo" or so they say...

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2008/01/10/BAL3UD47V.DTL&tsp=1

That's what the young men say, and their mother believes them.

Right. No wonder they are in this situation--I bet she always believes her boys.

 

[Logger]

There may be federal charges since Tatiana, a Siberain Tiger, is on the endangered species list. If an investigation can prove they provoked her or threw objects into the enclosure this would be a federal crime.

 

[Logger]

Here's the latest from the Chron- just acting like "normal kids at the zoo" or so they say...

"normal kids at the zoo" would tell police and medical emergency workers their names after being rescued. They would also tell the name of their other friend who was injured and we now know dead. These are not normal kids.

 

[LionRun]

"normal kids at the zoo" would tell police and medical emergency workers their names after being rescued. They would also tell the name of their other friend who was injured and we now know dead. These are not normal kids.

I agree, Logger, and they are not boys. They are men and should have acted with some level of maturity and cooperativeness if they had nothing to hide. I do hope authorities get to the bottom of this.

I think that it is possible that since no tigers escaped for 79 years until this tragic incident something, possibly related to one or more of those young men may have sparked Tatiana's escape. But, the bottom line is that the enclosure finally did fail to contain the tiger, and it needs to be fixed.

In addition, imo zoos should perhaps be designed to keep humans and other animals out as well. Just today I saw a story on cable news about a dog now named, "Tiger" who ended up in the tiger enclosure and was injured by a tiger in a zoo in Memphis. The dog is recovering nicely, btw.

All animal zoos and sanctuaries will hopefully now take a good look at their own facilities and make changes/upgrades where they are needed. Prevention sure beats an escape where the next time an innocent 5 year old might be the target of a large predatory animal. This is but one good thing that may come from the loss of Carlos's life.

I love all animals, and one of the reasons I chose my hat was due to my love and respect for the big cats. But, I also believe in safety for both humans and animals.

Lion

 

[Morag]

I haven't been to the SF zoo in many years. Does anyone know what kind of signs are posted in and around the animal exhibits? Don't feed the animals, don't make loud noises, don't shout or try to engage the animals, don't throw things into the enclosures...things like that.

I ask because I am not sure that everyone has an innate sense of zoo etiquette. People who are drunk, retarded, immature, new to zoo visits, or even just innocent jerks- these children and adults might not realize that you shouldn't roar at the lions, or prance maniacally in front of the tiger cage, or even throw a few bits of greenery toward the moat. So if taunting is well-known to occur at zoos, then surely there are signs specifically forbidding such behavior?

Of course, almost everyone can be expected to know not to climb into the enclosure, or to shoot rocks or other projectiles...

But everyone, EVERYONE, absolutely everyone...can be expected to assume that the animals cannot escape.

Even a jerk is entitled to assume that. Even a jerk who can't read or won't obey signs.

Unless these jerks let the tiger out....they are not culpable. The zoo is 100% liable in a case like this. MOO

 

[LinasK]

I'm sure some animals can be unpredictable just look at what happened to Siegfeld and Roy. Their very own white tiger attacked one of them, can't remember which one though, sorry.

That tiger got upset by a woman in the audience. I think it was her hair that set it off.

 

[LinasK]

"normal kids at the zoo" would tell police and medical emergency workers their names after being rescued. They would also tell the name of their other friend who was injured and we now know dead. These are not normal kids.

Normal "kids" at the zoo don't roar at the lions, which we know these 3 men did.

 

[dingo]

That tiger got upset by a woman in the audience. I think it was her hair that set it off.

She must have had one wild haircut

 

[LinasK]

She must have had one wild haircut

I think it was more in the order of a wig like helmet hair!:crazy:

 

[Buzz Mills]

Evidence in car may point to drug use, tiger taunting, documents state

The San Francisco City Attorney's Office contends the car of the two brothers who survived the tiger attack at San Francisco Zoo contains "apparent evidence of drug use" and may have evidence linking the men to objects found inside the tiger's enclosure, according to court documents. That could help show the victims pelted or taunted the tiger that escaped and killed a San Jose teen, the documents state. The survivors have denied any wrongdoing.

While a police investigation into such accusations has been described as "inactive" by city officials, any evidence that the survivors teased the big cat could be used to defend the city and zoo against any lawsuits filed by the victims, said a spokesman for the City Attorney's Office. Also in the new documents is an account by a zoo security guard, who said two young men in hooded sweatshirts sought to take the car from the zoo parking lot the day after the Christmas Day attack. They were denied entry by security guards, according to a statement a guard filed Thursday in San Francisco Superior Court.

The young men who tried to retrieve the car described themselves as friends of Paul Dhaliwal, 19, and Kulbir Dhaliwal, 23 - brothers who were injured in the attack that killed Paul Dhaliwal's close friend, 17-year-old Carlos Sousa Jr. After security guards refused requests to release the car, the two hooded young men asked if they could retrieve belongings from the black BMW M3, including a cell phone, according to the statement by Lamar Harris-Walker, the guard. The two young men left the security post immediately after they were asked for their names and contact information, Harris-Walker said.

Those disclosures come as the City Attorney's Office is seeking a court order allowing them to search the Dhaliwal brothers' car and cell phones, which police confiscated after the attack. A hearing is scheduled in San Francisco on the issue Friday, although attorneys for the Dhaliwals contend state law requires the issue be decided by a judge in Santa Clara County, where the two brothers reside.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2008/01/10/BAD9UDG16.DTL&tsp=1

 

[dingo]

I think it was more in the order of a wig like helmet hair!:crazy:

helmet hair

 

[Floh]

Evidence in car may point to drug use, tiger taunting, documents state

The San Francisco City Attorney's Office contends the car of the two brothers who survived the tiger attack at San Francisco Zoo contains "apparent evidence of drug use" and may have evidence linking the men to objects found inside the tiger's enclosure, according to court documents. That could help show the victims pelted or taunted the tiger that escaped and killed a San Jose teen, the documents state. The survivors have denied any wrongdoing.

While a police investigation into such accusations has been described as "inactive" by city officials, any evidence that the survivors teased the big cat could be used to defend the city and zoo against any lawsuits filed by the victims, said a spokesman for the City Attorney's Office. Also in the new documents is an account by a zoo security guard, who said two young men in hooded sweatshirts sought to take the car from the zoo parking lot the day after the Christmas Day attack. They were denied entry by security guards, according to a statement a guard filed Thursday in San Francisco Superior Court.

The young men who tried to retrieve the car described themselves as friends of Paul Dhaliwal, 19, and Kulbir Dhaliwal, 23 - brothers who were injured in the attack that killed Paul Dhaliwal's close friend, 17-year-old Carlos Sousa Jr. After security guards refused requests to release the car, the two hooded young men asked if they could retrieve belongings from the black BMW M3, including a cell phone, according to the statement by Lamar Harris-Walker, the guard. The two young men left the security post immediately after they were asked for their names and contact information, Harris-Walker said.

Those disclosures come as the City Attorney's Office is seeking a court order allowing them to search the Dhaliwal brothers' car and cell phones, which police confiscated after the attack. A hearing is scheduled in San Francisco on the issue Friday, although attorneys for the Dhaliwals contend state law requires the issue be decided by a judge in Santa Clara County, where the two brothers reside.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2008/01/10/BAD9UDG16.DTL&tsp=1

The two young men left the security post immediately after they were asked for their names and contact information, Harris-Walker said.

I'm sure they did!

 

[Buzz Mills]

Geragos wants a day in court - in San Jose

Mark Geragos, the high-profile attorney for the brothers who survived the tiger attack on Christmas Day, wants his day in court - in San Jose.

Tuesday, San Francisco City Attorney Dennis Herrera obtained a court order allowing the police to temporarily retain the car and cell phones of Kulbir and Paul Dhaliwal of San Jose. Today, a hearing will be held in San Francisco Court for arguments on whether the city attorney and the San Francisco Zoological Society will be allowed to inspect the items.

But Geragos believes the matter should be heard in Santa Clara County Superior Court in the county where the Dhaliwal brothers live. So a hearing on the same issue is scheduled at 9 a.m. Wednesday before Judge Socrates Manoukian. No determination has been made on which court will ultimately decide the issue.

Herrera has said that photos and text messages on the phones may shed light on what happened when a Siberian tiger got loose and killed 17-year-old Carlos Sousa Jr. and injured the brothers.

http://www.mercurynews.com/news/ci_7937715

 

[MrsMush99]

They are speaking about this case now on Mike and Juliet in the morning.

 

[Taximom]

Fox says authorities have matched evidence from the victims' car to evidence found in Tatiana's enclosure. This was just a tease for a story coming up later, so they didn't elaborate.

 

[Taximom]

Well, that was definitely worthless. The car belongs to the brothers. LE found evidence of drug and alcohol use in the car. I'm not sure how that relates to what was found in the tiger's enclosure though.