Trace Evidence and the Intruder Theory

[trixie]

There were some drops of saliva on her panties and a pubic hair on her blanket though. I think the reason why so little was found is because these days most people are very informed about DNA and well aware of it's ability to incriminate, so any intruders would have been very careful not to leave any. This was after all a highly planned event, not a chance happening. In my readings I came across one known pedophile who had shaved his entire body to eliminate the dropped hair problem. I think the intruders were pedophiles and that they wore gloves and full head masks. I think their head masks were black woollen ones and the black fibres found around JonBenet's crotch area came from these items while they were abusing her, rather than coming from a black cloth that was used to wipe down her dead body, which is the common belief.

Actually the common belief is that the black fibers came from John Ramseys black shirt that he wore on Christmas night. Michael Kane isn't allowed to lie to the suspects, and that's what he said the black fibers were consistent with.

 

[BBB167893]

"I have read that saliva can degrade dna, and have always believed this is the reason that it wasn't complete."

I never heard that. Besides, it doesn't make sense. JB's DNA was complete and intact.

"However, there was complete dna on "something" that seems very suspiciously "female". None belongs to anyone in the group of suspects that were compared. If you read Beckner's deposition "very carefully", you can decide for yourself why "Wolf's" dna did not need to be compared against dnax. One would expect the only "answer" to this "mystery" is that dnax is female, and the very dna that when found ,prompted the testing of Arianna. You will read,as well, that Wolf is not cleared, and neither are santa and fleet."

As well they probably shouldn't be. It's been awhile since I read Beckner's deposition. Could you tell me what part of it he talks about that in? Saves time.

But then, the way Chuck Green reported it in the paper, the DNA-x was found on something female, but it was DNA from unused panties in the pack, and no one's disputed that. Henry Lee said the same. And even Wood the Slimebucket hasn't mentioned it.

Barry Scheck was part of this case. His stock-in-trade is using DNA to free wrongly convicted people. If this DNA was of any real use, do you really think he'd keep his mouth shut about it?

 

[sissi]

There was never a mention of dnax until the Beckner deposition, where Chuck Green "flew" with it is not factual.
It certainly wasn't from panties in the pack.


Barry Scheck was hired only to keep the Ramseys from hiring him, we discussed this the other day.

 

[sissi]

There was evidence, btw, other than dna, there were fibers, scuff marks, tread marks from three different shoes, sas, hi-tec and a generic tread not identified. and....

Seargeant Witson told Your Affiant that he responded to 755 15th Street, City and County of Boulder, State of Colorado at approximately 0930 hours on December 25, 1996 in response to the report of a kidnapping. Seargeant Whitson told Your Affiant that when he arrived at the Ramsey residence, he entered through the rear exterior kitchen door. He told Your Affiant that as he entered the residence he saw what appeared to be a pry-mark in the door jam of this door. He told Your Affiant that the mark he observed was on the exterior of the house near the door knob and lock on the door, and that the damaged area appeared to have been less weathered than the surrounding surfaces on the door and door jam. Seargeant Whitson told Your Affiant that he spoke to John Ramsey who identified himself as the owner of the residence and the father of JonBenet Ramsey who he reported was now missing. Seargeant Witson told Your Affiant that Jon Ramsey stated to him that all the doors to the residence were locked when he and his family went to bed on the previous evening of December 25, 1996. Seargeant Whitson told Your Affiant that John Ramsey told him that the doors were still locked this morning when they discovered the child was missing. Detective Linda Arndt told Your Affiant that John Ramsey stated to her that his daughter is six years old and that he last saw her at approximately 2200 hours on December 25, 1996.
On December 28, 1996 Your Affiant observed that the Ramsey residence has several exterior doors and windows. Your Affiant observed that many of these potential entrances into the house are secured with locks or locking mechanisms. Your Affiant knows from personal experience and training that tools commonly known as lock picks can open locks and locking mechanisms. Your Affiant also knows from his personal experience and training that the use of tools, such as lock picks, can leave marks on the external surfaces or internal workings of a lock. Since all the doors were allegedly locked, an examination of any markings on the internal workings of their locks would provide material evidence in a subsequent criminal prosecution.

Detective Arndt also told Your Affiant that child molesters have been known to video tape the murder of their victim(s).

(remember ONE of the video cameras had been missing ,thought stolen since November)

 

[BBB167893]

"There was evidence, btw, other than dna, there were fibers, scuff marks, tread marks from three different shoes, sas, hi-tec and a generic tread not identified. and...."

Well, it's not a huge leap to think the scuff mark was left by John himself (he said he went through it, you know), the hi-tecs were identified as being from Burke, per his and Fleet White III's GJ testimony, there were fibers, but we don't know when they were even left.

OTOH, there are fibers that we know the source of and when...

"Barry Scheck was hired only to keep the Ramseys from hiring him, we discussed this the other day."

Right, but he hasn't been on the case for some time, and he probably didn't sign any confidentiality agreements.

"There was never a mention of dnax until the Beckner deposition, where Chuck Green 'flew' with it is not factual.
It certainly wasn't from panties in the pack."

Well, maybe you're right. They might not be the same, but I know that the police did find human DNA in pairs of panties from the plant. Could be two different things.

 

[Eagle1]

Don't forget "my" duffle bag, we never did find out the contents of. Could have belonged to one of the workers on the remodelling a month before, or, could have been new.

 

[BBB167893]

I think the workers would have brought a tool box instead.

 

[Eagle1]

I thought about it after I went to bed last night. Workers wouldn't put their stuff in the crawl space. And if the duffle bag had contained any of the childrens' play stuff, I think we'd have been told.

BTW, I can't find any JBR books around here any more, not at Borders or the public library that has a several-cities network. I can't figure out where they all went. What about you guys? Are they available where you are?

 

[trixie]

AMAZON.COM. All Jonbenet books.

 

[Eagle1]

Thanks much, Trixie.

That's a relief, but I still wonder if the books are hard to find offline everywhere. One more mystery about this case, I guess.

 

[Nuisanceposter]

I would suggest checking secondhand bookstores. I picked up DOI and Cyril Wecht's book in the local secondhand bookstore.

 

[Britt]

Also, ebay and half.com at ebay.

 

[Eagle1]

Thanks, NP and Britt. That's a good idea. We have some of those stores around here.

 

[BBB167893]

Trixie beat me to the amazon.com answer.

But Eagle1, at least I'm not alone! I can't find a single one around here! I doubt that Mr. Smith's will be here, either!

 

[Eagle1]

Trixie beat me to the amazon.com answer.

But Eagle1, at least I'm not alone! I can't find a single one around here! I doubt that Mr. Smith's will be here, either!

Our library used to have the books, so I only bought about three, and books don't usually disappear from a large library network. Some very old ones, re the JFK assassination for instance, are still there, but with at least one page of pictures missing. I forget exactly which picture I'm referring to. Question is, why would the books be missing now from libraries?

Could it mean some powerful organization or agency did this who don't want us keeping on about it? I remember one of the JFK books said all the witnesses were told that they would be blackened, the women branded as having a prostitue "past" and the men as drunks, and that it would stick.

Then most of them somehow died, within the next decade.

In a January 2006 documentary about MLK's assassination, they said all kinds of nuts infiltrate gov't agencies.

And would have the power to go into the parents' bedroom and get their fibers or do whatever, right? Just a thought. I never have any favorite theory, not locking myself into any certain one.

There's that "Mens' Association" of the original version of Stepford Wives, supposed to be fiction but who knows if there really may be one, which was humbling wives by replacing them with robot replicas. Husbands who loved their wives couldn't tell them, would not have been allowed to make a living, and I guess couldn't move to another town because maybe the Assoc. was worldwide? Conceivably, such gangs could "fear" JonBenet was going to grow up with a "big head". An "overachiever" instead of an underachiever like them, which they bragged was humility? We had a professor in art classes who used to joke, "The best thing about me is my humility."

For a while, even churches, a few of them, were saying kids needed to be taught to be humble, but, I hope this doesn't offend unbelievers because it may be a clue, and we did discuss the Psalms clues, Jesus said kids are naturally humble, an example for us instead of us teaching them. I think the trick is to give them enough confidence to succeed in the world. Just rambling as usual, not claiming to really know the solution to this case. Just possibilities. Maybe remote, maybe not.

 

[BBB167893]

"Could it mean some powerful organization or agency did this who don't want us keeping on about it?"

More likely it's that the case has become, in some minds, played out or just like a plague: no one wants to go near it. I know Woody doesn't want us keeping on about it! I imagine he has something to do with it.

 

[trixie]

THe Jonbenet Ramsey case is (nearly) 10 years old. In the meantime we've had Scott Peterson, Robert Blake, Samantha Runnion, Carlie Brucia, Natalie Holloway, you see where I'm going with this. Unfortunatly, there are always new cases to be discussed and since this one is now a cold case, 10 years old, and Patsy has died, I think it will just fade away and eventually we'll never hear anything about it. It isn't even being investigated. Eventually, after nothing comes of anything in the "legalities department"( ie: nobody is ever arrested) most of us on these JB boards will eventually drift away too. When this case is 15, 20 or 25 years old with nothing new and Patsy dead and nobody arrested ( and no DNA match, of course)I highly doubt that there will be followers like there are now. It's just going to die. It doesn't surprise me that libraries and stores don't carry books about it. Nobody cares anymore.

 

[narlacat]

I care.
But you are right, we are the only ones that seem to be interested anymore.
This case will never go away though, there will always be people who come across it and want to research it.
It is the second most [in]famous murder case in the world, Jack the Ripper coming in at No.1.
I will never forget a pretty little girl named JonBenét.

 

[BBB167893]

I will never forget her. I will never forgive those who betrayed her. I will never surrender to those who challenge me. And I will not stop until the world knows the truth.

NOT ONE STEP BACK.