Trial Thread 8 May 2012 Wrapping up Closing Arguments

[Sillybilly]

When TLM plead guilty she was saying MTR killed Tori wasn't she? If she'd gone to trial they may have proven that she killed Tori. At the time she was saying he killed her.

Unless I'm remembering wrong.

Yes, she did say it was MTR back then. At that time when she pled guilty, she had legal representation, so would or should have known that it didn't matter whichever one of them actually killed Tori, they would both be guilty of first degree under the circumstances.

JMO

 

[CarrieBean]

It is foolish to believe that TLM wrote to a gang member using gang symbols and not be a gang member.

Why is that foolish to believe. There are all kinds of wannabes out there.

 

[nursebeeme]

9:57 [Comment From Marlene Marlene : ]
Beings as no court on the weekend, if Jury came to a decision would they have to wait until Monday morning.
9:58 Mike Knoll: @Marlene - in that case, the verdict would be delivered more or less immediately - not on the Monday. Tuesday May 8, 2012 9:58 Mike Knoll

here was the (albeit confusing tweet) about deliberations over the weekend and what happens if they come down with a verdict on the weekend

 

[Sillybilly]

It is foolish to believe that TLM wrote to a gang member using gang symbols and not be a gang member.

First time i've been referred to as being foolish, but ...

 

[~n/t~]

I hope Rodney didn't have to witness any of those eyerolling theatrics before he left the courtroom..

My heart goes out to Tori's whole entire family....

I was thinking the same thing, nurse. Imagine having to sit there watching your baby girl's accused murderer rolling his eyes as if to make a mockery of the details of her horrific murder? I think they'd have to strap me down in that court room.

Seeing the autopsy photos of his little girl's fractured skull must be unbearable. We all get emotional. Imagine her loved ones? :tears:

 

[CarrieBean]

Question for anyone....if the Crown is finished by thrusday and the Judge explains to the jury the law etc and it runs into the evening or the weekend, which IMO I don't think it will, will they tweet the verdict in either circumstance?

I would think (hope) the reporters would be ready to go once they heard a verdict is in.

 

[Flowercb]

How absolutely disrespectful - whether he is guilty or not. To roll your eyes at this point, at this description. His lawyer should reach through that glass and give him a good smack for forgetting his manners, in my opinion.

Salem

This guy forgot his manners a longgggg time ago. If he ever had any in the first place. MOO!!!

 

[nursebeeme]

10:02 [Comment From Marlene Marlene : ]
So if a verdict is reached on ther weekend, then the Crown, Defence and Rafferty would have to come to the court room
10:03 Mike Knoll: @marlene - yes.

another clarifying post about the weekend


(caveat: if the Crown rests after lunch tomorrow, that means the jury won't get this case until thurs afternoon or friday at the latest since instruction can take up to two days per earlier tweets today)

 

[JayFriend]

I don't know.....If I were charged with this serious offence, rolling my eyes would not be an appropriate response if I were innocent. The fact that he is repeating the same action almost signals a guilty person covering up his crime.

I wonder what body language experts would say about this.MOO!

I don't know. Maybe his gesturing is as meaningless as his not guilty plea, but what is the jury to think of it. Hopefully the judge instructs then to pay no attention to anything he communicates while not testifying under oath. But they can't un-see what the saw. They can either interpret it as protestations of innocence, or a brat making faces behind a teacher's back.

 

[Tahorn]

Why is that foolish to believe. There are all kinds of wannabes out there.

KS and JS are gang members, their father was original gang member ... And TLM was pretending to them that she was too ... Doesn't make sense to me


http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Crime/2010/08/13/15011991.html

 

[Sailor Bug]

Mike Knoll: here's Hank Daniszewski's lunch update:

Crown attorney Kevin Gowdey said Michael Rafferty drove several hours to the perfect crime scene in an area north of Guelph that he knew well.

He said the isolated farm lane was hundreds of metres off the main road.

"Where no one will hear her (Tori's) screams," he said.

Rafferty, 31, has pleaded not guilty to first-degree murder, kidnapping and sexual assault of eight-year-old Tori Stafford in 2009.

Gowdey said Terri-Lynne McClintic had no reason to direct Rafferty down the lane and could not find it afterwards.

He said McClintic did help create a detailed map of the crime scene and gave a graphic account of a sexual assault on Tori, which included her surrendering the pleading girl to Rafferty.

"You could not make that up," said Gowdey.

Defense lawyer Dirk Derstine suggested his client walked away from the car and was horrified to come back and find Tori dead at the hands of McClintic.

But Rafferty did not testify and Gowdey said there was no evidence to back that story.

He said McClintic's accurate description of the area was consistent with a passive observer.

Gowdey said it was clear that Rafferty and McClintic worked together to cover and carry Tori's body and conceal it with heavy rocks.

Gowdey said the body was well hidden and too decomposed for DNA evidence of sexual assault but he said it was the obvious reason why Tori's body was found naked from the waist down.

Rafferty seemed agitated during Gowdey's presentation, rolling his eyes and mouthing words.

Gowdey continues his final arguments this afternoon

 

[Jezbel]

It is foolish to believe that TLM wrote to a gang member using gang symbols and not be a gang member.

It's not foolish at all, ever heard of a 'wannabe'. I'm wearing blue today, but I'm not a member of the crips. Many a teenager these days trys to portray themselves as 'tough' and 'streetsmart'.
I have a young cousin who pretends he is thuggish, pants low, oversized shirts, red bandana hanging from his back pocket, pictures showing some sort of gang gesture and more, is he a member of a gang? Nope he sure isn't, just thinks he's a tough boy, it's a persona he puts on.

 

[Sailor Bug]

rafferty's mother there today?

Mike Knoll: - VERY common question today. I did not see her and either did our photographer who was standing in front of the courthouse all morning.



Will there be a live tweet page ready to refresh to know if a verdict is to be read over the weekend or do we have to just keep up on the news articles?

Mike Knoll: @guest - no there won't be a page to refresh. I suggest getting on twitter and following @RaffertyLFP @LFPress and @RandyRatLFPress - most media will tweet once a verdict is reached.

 

[Yody04]

another clarifying post about the weekend


(caveat: if the Crown rests after lunch tomorrow, that means the jury won't get this case until thurs afternoon or friday at the latest since instruction can take up to two days per earlier tweets today)

will we hear anything from these instructions or is the public out of this? I don't know anything about Courts...thankfully

 

[nursebeeme]

will we hear anything from these instructions or is the public out of this? I don't know anything about Courts...thankfully

idk.... the jury will be present so I would think we would hear this part? I am not sure...

(in the US we hear this part... and it is very dry at times... to put it lightly)

 

[impatientredhead]

It's not foolish at all, ever heard of a 'wannabe'. I'm wearing blue today, but I'm not a member of the crips. Many a teenager these days trys to portray themselves as 'tough' and 'streetsmart'.
I have a young cousin who pretends he is thuggish, pants low, oversized shirts, red bandana hanging from his back pocket, pictures showing some sort of gang gesture and more, is he a member of a gang? Nope he sure isn't, just thinks he's a tough boy, it's a persona he puts on.

Huge difference between being a wannabe at your local high school and claiming false affliation with a gang in PRISON. One will make people laugh at you behind your back and the other will get you seriously hurt.

 

[snoofer]

AM980_Court "There was no need to drive so far from home," Gowdey says. Unless you want to take her "where no one will hear her screams".

they wanted to hear her scream IMO

 

[Alison]

I doubt we will be finished reading all the disclosure that was not realeased before the verdict is in. IMO will not take them long. Millhaven get MR a bed ready he's a comming...

 

[CarrieBean]

Do we know TLM is affiliating herself with a gang now?

...and where were all her gang members when she needed help getting out of her predicament? It sure doesnt look like any came to help cover her azz.

ETA: Please excuse my typos. My "E" key keeps falling off. /

 

[Tahorn]

It's not foolish at all, ever heard of a 'wannabe'. I'm wearing blue today, but I'm not a member of the crips. Many a teenager these days trys to portray themselves as 'tough' and 'streetsmart'.
I have a young cousin who pretends he is thuggish, pants low, oversized shirts, red bandana hanging from his back pocket, pictures showing some sort of gang gesture and more, is he a member of a gang? Nope he sure isn't, just thinks he's a tough boy, it's a persona he puts on.

TLM and KS(known gang member) were both in communications through letters, using gang terminology and symbols, discussing revenge on others ...