GUILTY TX - Alanna Gallagher, 6, Saginaw, 1 July 2013 - #5

[gitana1]

The chief said this is one of the most COMPLICATED cases he's seen in 32 years?...WHY? :moo:

I think it has to do with the unusualness of the family situation and the probable intensity of their online world, no confession, no clear pointers to any one possible perp and the very unique circumstances of how and where this baby was found. LE. Has a lot to sort through, I would imagine.

I think they know.....they are not telling, Imoo.

Hi Clu. I'm with Cherie. I think ME does know but isn't telling right now.

Earlier today there was a male reporter that said that the ME stated that she didn't die from gunshot, stabbing, or strangulation. He went on to say that the ME didn't know how she died.

My interpretation: The reporter called the ME office to get a statement or went by there...was not given the info on the COD and so he asked...was she shot? was she stabbed? was she strangled?...etc.

I do think that they know how she died but will wait until all the test results are back before they release the COD. Just my speculation and opinion though.

I believe they have a tentative COD.

But if they know how she died, why is the most complicated case ever, or whatever he said? Why say that anyway? It is not like they have to announce COD ever, before a trial. So they could just say they are not releasing it.

Strategy. Not announcing could lull the perp into a sense if safety that may cause them to reveal something.

First I wanted to thank you for this. I was trying to find a way of saying that without being completely disgusting. You did a much better job than I would have.

___________

I can think of two times when someone might stage an accidental death to make it look like a murder. One I already mentioned - if she accidentally died because of illegal drugs. Whether they were given to her by someone else, but not meant to kill her, or she found them and took them, it wouldn't be in the best interests of the owner of the drugs to just call 911. MOO

What keeps popping into my head (but doesn't usually stay there for long) is that she could have died at the home of someone who has serious problems with the lifestyle of her parents, and who believes she was neglected (whether she was or not). It could have been made to look like an abduction and sex crime to make it look like she died because of parental negligence which would serve three purposes. First it would get rid of any stigma/investigation of the person's own home/life. Second, it would possibly result in at least one of the parents serving jail time for neglect. Third it would probably get the other children removed from the home (if it had worked as planned.)

I'm not sure if I find either very plausible, even if possible. MOO

One thing I kind of am pretty sure of us that illegal, recreational drugs is not the issue in this case. I can only see drugs as COD if used to subdue her so sex abuse could take place.

This has probably been mentioned already regarding the vehicle, restraints, and where the body ended up on the road near the curb so I apologise if it has.

What if Alanna's body was on top of the vehicle, held down by restraints. Like this:

Then one of these restraints came loose and the body fell off the vehicle as it went round the corner. It kind of makes sense as to why LE took all types of restraints from the family home. Also could the picture of the "plastic thing" on page 3 actually have been one of the straps that came loose?

Here are a couple of types of restraints for loads on car roofs:

If the vehicle had a roof rack, tarpaulin and restraints then maybe LE should be looking for someone who goes camping, who holds their gear on the roof of their vehicle.

But can you really imagine someone strapping a dead body ontop of their car in broad daylight instead of stuffing it in the trunk or backseat or whatever?

Nobody staged a murder. They simply dumped a body. The cause of death wasn't even apparent.

Let's pretend for a minute that she was wandering around and saw the pool of the neighbor 3 doors down. She knocks but nobody comes to the door. She takes off her clothes and jumps in the pool in her underwear, and drowns. The neighbor comes home and finds her floating in the pool.

Hypothetically, that neighbor doesn't have homeowners insurance. He FREAKS out -- "I don't even know this kid! I'm not going to risk losing my home and everything I own because the meddling kid used my pool!" So he wraps her in a tarp, binding her legs for easier transport, drives her a mile away and dumps her, then quickly drives home and disposes of her clothes.

I think we need to consider this as a possibility! Seems entirely possible to me!

I just kind of think driving around with the dead body staged that way would be worse for the homeowner if caught than an accidental death. I think most people would feel that way. Also, see below.

But would he put a bag over her head?

Right.

 

[kkdj]

Excellent reference, thank-you.

This raises the question in my mind, of the most important unknown at this time - WHERE was the scene of Alanna's murder?

IF she was abducted, it likely was within 200 feet of her home.

We know she was found within a mile of her home.

We know the murderer used quite a few supplements in her murder. It's possible she was murdered in a vehicle, but, not probable.

The odds are quite high that Alanna was murdered in a home, within a 1 mile perimeter of her home, IMO.

That's the perimeter for this crime.

JMO

So, more than likely its someone living in her neighborhood.
Whew! I would be so scared if I lived there with young children!

 

[Donjeta]

I wonder....Has there been another case where a child's body was found in the street? Or one where the child drowned, or died in a hot car, or ate something toxic and it was covered up to look like a murder? There are thousands of child murders that have happened over the years, the majority of which we have never heard of. Maybe it has happened before, and the case just faded away into obscurity. It would be interesting to find a case with one of those scenarios, and see who the perp was, and what exactly took place.

I think the trouble with that is being sure what really happened...

I mean, let's assume that a child drowns and a panicked person stages it to look like a sexual pervert's crime. Then they're arrested and put to trial. Then they tell the court, yeah, I'm not a sexual pervert, honestly, the child drowned and I didn't hurt her, I swear... How many people are going to believe that? Is the jury going to believe that unless they've got Baez as their lawyer? Or are the jury going to say that in the context of sexual perversion the child was drowned and put the person to jail for murder? Many people who are charged for murder will swear to their dying day that they didn't do it so they would need rather compelling evidence that it was an accident if it can be proved that they're the ones who dumped the naked and bound body on the roadside.

 

[jjenny]

I think the trouble with that is being sure what really happened...

I mean, let's assume that a child drowns and a panicked person stages it to look like a sexual pervert's crime. Then they're arrested and put to trial. Then they tell the court, yeah, I'm not a sexual pervert, honestly, the child drowned and I didn't hurt her, I swear... How many people are going to believe that? Is the jury going to believe that unless they've got Baez as their lawyer? Or are the jury going to say that in the context of sexual perversion the child was drowned and put the person to jail for murder? Many people who are charged for murder will swear to their dying day that they didn't do it so they would need rather compelling evidence that it was an accident if it can be proved that they're the ones who dumped the naked and bound body on the roadside.

Nobody is going to believe that (unless Baez is the lawyer). Which is why it would be extremely stupid to do something like that. Which presumably rational person is going to realize and not do.

 

[kkdj]

I know both fathers have spoken to media.
has the mother?

 

[CHERIE.T]

I wonder....Has there been another case where a child's body was found in the street? Or one where the child drowned, or died in a hot car, or ate something toxic and it was covered up to look like a murder? There are thousands of child murders that have happened over the years, the majority of which we have never heard of. Maybe it has happened before, and the case just faded away into obscurity. It would be interesting to find a case with one of those scenarios, and see who the perp was, and what exactly took place.

We've followed cases where murdered children were found in cars, under buildings, in buildings, in fields and near water but IMHO I cannot remember a child being found in the street. Scares the begezzes out of me....I think the killer Imoo watched Alanna's body being discovered by the teens and LE.

 

[Wondergirl]

This has probably been mentioned already regarding the vehicle, restraints, and where the body ended up on the road near the curb so I apologise if it has.

What if Alanna's body was on top of the vehicle, held down by restraints. Like this:

Then one of these restraints came loose and the body fell off the vehicle as it went round the corner. It kind of makes sense as to why LE took all types of restraints from the family home. Also could the picture of the "plastic thing" on page 3 actually have been one of the straps that came loose?

Here are a couple of types of restraints for loads on car roofs:

If the vehicle had a roof rack, tarpaulin and restraints then maybe LE should be looking for someone who goes camping, who holds their gear on the roof of their vehicle.

Thanks, Dandan.

You reminded me that I am so focused on Alanna falling out of a red truck, that I haven't explored that other ways her body could have fallen out of, or off a vehicle (and also that the red truck could be a red herring)

Your strap to the roof scenario is plausable.

Thanks!

 

[Wondergirl]

We've followed cases where murdered children were found in cars, under buildings, in buildings, in fields and near water but IMHO I cannot remember a child being found in the street. Scares the begezzes out of me....I think the killer Imoo watched Alanna's body being discovered by the teens and LE.

I agree.

Did the killer(s) listen to the police scanner also?

 

[eileenhawkeye]

I think the trouble with that is being sure what really happened...

I mean, let's assume that a child drowns and a panicked person stages it to look like a sexual pervert's crime. Then they're arrested and put to trial. Then they tell the court, yeah, I'm not a sexual pervert, honestly, the child drowned and I didn't hurt her, I swear... How many people are going to believe that? Is the jury going to believe that unless they've got Baez as their lawyer? Or are the jury going to say that in the context of sexual perversion the child was drowned and put the person to jail for murder? Many people who are charged for murder will swear to their dying day that they didn't do it so they would need rather compelling evidence that it was an accident if it can be proved that they're the ones who dumped the naked and bound body on the roadside.

But if the autopsy shows no sign of prior sexual abuse, I am not sure how the prosecution would charge the defendant with those type of charges? If the COD is drowning, then the prosecution would basically be claiming that the child was drowned on purpose, while the defence would say it was an accident, right? Would there be certain types of injuries on a child if they were drowned on purpose?

 

[Confusion]

I wonder....Has there been another case where a child's body was found in the street? Or one where the child drowned, or died in a hot car, or ate something toxic and it was covered up to look like a murder? There are thousands of child murders that have happened over the years, the majority of which we have never heard of. Maybe it has happened before, and the case just faded away into obscurity. It would be interesting to find a case with one of those scenarios, and see who the perp was, and what exactly took place.

There could be plenty of them that don't just dump the body on a city street corner. There are a lot of children (and adults) who disappear and their bodies are never found. There are also a lot who are found, but there's not enough evidence to find a suspect, let alone convict anyone. If any of those cases were actually accidents which were covered up for whatever reason, who would know? In spite of that, I don't think her death was accidental, suicide or natural causes. I just like to look at all sides as much as possible.

 

[momrids6]

Makes me want to cry that her little clothes weren't ironed for her photo. ( The lavender outfit with the green brica brac).

To be fair- 98% of my elementary school pics were taken after gym or recess. My great-grandmother ironed every outfit, my grandmother did my hair ( usually with those awful old fashioned curlers worn over night ), and my pics showed none of that care & concern.

 

[CHERIE.T]

gitana1, thanks for your replies. I always appreciate your post!

 

[CHERIE.T]

I agree.

Did the killer(s) listen to the police scanner also?

I didn't think about a scanner.....a real psychopath may have.

 

[Donjeta]

But if the autopsy shows no sign of prior sexual abuse, I am not sure how the prosecution would charge the defendant with those type of charges? If the COD is drowning, then the prosecution would basically be claiming that the child was drowned on purpose, while the defence would say it was an accident, right? Would there be certain types of injuries on a child if they were drowned on purpose?

Sexual abuse may and does happen without evidence of physical injury although it may be harder to prove.

In a purposeful drowning the victim might have defensive injuries but I think that at least in some states an apparent accident that leads to a person's death connected to felonious activity that you were engaged in at the time may be prosecuted as a homicide anyway.

 

[Dr. Know?]

Alanna's body was covered by the tarp after she fell out or her body fell out of or off a vehicle or was pushed out and dumped from a vehicle. Or to take it farther, her body was walked out of a home nearby, out a back fence possibly and placed there. She was not visible to passing vehicles body wise. Just a tarp in the road with something under it. chills.

What made the driver panick and not just get out of their vehicle and pick her back up?

Flee factor? Or I want to watch this on the news factor?

I can see why the LE said it was complicated. I think they have two different possibilites and the tests are weighing on the results to exclude one or the other.


Just thinking out loud.

 

[MsFacetious]

There are a couple of others cases of kids found in/next to the street.
They just didn't get as much publicity.

Most were just "tossed out" so where they landed was not a conscious choice.


Tennielle Big Day was found dead on a highway
Mom had pushed her out of the vehicle.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=192601&highlight=hit+car



Alijah was left on the side of the road, by his father

http://www.khou.com/news/local/Trav...ce-for-slaying-3-month-old-son-130360933.html



Baby Crystal was found just off the road, Mom put her there.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=87834&highlight=katie+stockton



Baby Boy Horry also found on the side of the road, left by a parent it's assumed (unidentified)

http://www.carolinalive.com/news/story.aspx?id=832393#.Ud-5Mm2AxLw

 

[Donjeta]

In the UI forum you see quite a few bodies that were dumped in the road side but the openness seems a little unusual, leaving her in a residential area, in broad daylight, in the middle of the road, to be found so soon. A little off in the bushes or on the side of the highway where people don't stop and walk and the skeletal remains may be found months or years afterwards when the next maintenance crew comes.

 

[greengables]

MOO is that the perp either wanted to make an impact and wanted her to be found reasonably quickly or that he/she was on their way to a preferred dump site but unintentionally lost Allanah on the way there. I do have a gut feeling that the perp is someone known to the child and may have been watching/planning the abduction and I certainly hope LE are looking into everyone that the family was in contact with via the church, camping trips, neighbours and possibly any "special interest" groups that the family were involved with, that might explain why the case is complex, I suppose if they had many associates who also lived an alternative lifestyle then there could be a number of different people to investigate.

Sorry if my post is confusing but I am trying to be careful not to break any forum rules.

 

[Dr. Know?]

I forgot to say, I think this perp(s) have gone back to their own locale. Ft. Worth maybe? Or small subdivision.

 

[FLtwinmom]

I guess LE is admitting they don't have any suspects. So basically there is a sadistic child killer running lose with in 15 minutes of where I live. I am scared for every child in this area.

http://dfw.cbslocal.com/2013/07/11/vigil-held-in-memory-of-alanna-gallagher/


At least the community of Saginaw is pulling together and letting the perp know, they will never give up, bless them all for their effort.

My heart aches for this sweet little girl, she was precious!