GUILTY UK - Arthur Labinjo Hughes, 6, killed, dad & friend arrested, June 2020 #3

[Powermjp]

I’m expecting the verdict late Friday. I think there is one person the jury will debate about for quite some time. The other one seems to be a slam dunk guilty on all charges so won’t take much time. All my opinion only.

Agreed,

I feel like there has to be a bigger inquest into social services and how they mishandled this case. This should NEVER happen again. If people have concerns for a child’s welfare. It shouldn’t take ONE visit to establish their general circumstances.
It should be multiple visits. Visits alone with the kids. Away from parents like ET who controlled the narrative of the visit

who knows. Maybe when parents know they’re being watched they are less inclined to escalate the violence to the degree Arthur was subjected to !!

Giving evidence in the trial is not the only thing that the social services agency has to do. Huge lessons are to be learnt from this.


It angers me to think she said she “takes her job seriously “ yet look where we are ….

100%

Usually SS do talk to kids alone I believe, and they are meant to do that.

And why were they not more on the case as emma tustin had her first 2 children taken off her?

Surely they should not have taken tustins words because she had children taken before, (and we know she was worried they would take the kids, and used this to abuse Arthur) so they should have ignored what she said, and looked into it themselves.

Surely they should have looked into it more just for that, her violence with ex partner etc, not even including all the reports that family and neighbours made to them, its just unbelievable how bad social services did.

Why were they not talking to Arthur due to he was obvious a vulnerable child with his mother in prison? The police reports? The bruises? Her to not even check his back properly?? Disgusting.

There was no care at all, the social worker who came into court was just covering her own back, I don't know how she sleeps at night. If that social worker did her job he could be alive right now. She should lose her job and be face some legal action, and not get away with it.

If a lifeguard lets someone die in their pool they get legal action, and potential prison time, why do social workers get away with it.

 

[Tortoise]

I still don't have a great handle on what their respective defences to the murder charge are.

I'm going to go back over their closing speeches and summarise them in bullet points.

 

[suebaloo]

Agreed,


100%

Usually SS do talk to kids alone I believe, and they are meant to do that.

And why were they not more on the case as emma tustin had her first 2 children taken off her?

Surely they should not have taken tustins words because she had children taken before, (and we know she was worried they would take the kids, and used this to abuse Arthur) so they should have ignored what she said, and looked into it themselves.

Surely they should have looked into it more just for that, her violence with ex partner etc, not even including all the reports that family and neighbours made to them, its just unbelievable how bad social services did.

Why were they not talking to Arthur due to he was obvious a vulnerable child with his mother in prison? The police reports? The bruises? Her to not even check his back properly?? Disgusting.

There was no care at all, the social worker who came into court was just covering her own back, I don't know how she sleeps at night. If that social worker did her job he could be alive right now. She should lose her job and be face some legal action, and not get away with it.

If a lifeguard lets someone die in their pool they get legal action, and potential prison time, why do social workers get away with it.

Agreed 100%. These social workers should be tried. The same thing happened at the trial of Gabriel Fernandez. Four social workers were tried for neglecting to do their jobs. They were all acquitted!!!

 

[SpursGyal]

I still don't have a great handle on what their respective defences to the murder charge are.

I'm going to go back over their closing speeches and summarise them in bullet points.

They are just fully blaming each other.

 

[squish]

Anyone else think ET absolutely won’t survive prison? She will soon kill herself IMO.

 

[Carroll520]

Anyone else think ET absolutely won’t survive prison? She will soon kill herself IMO.

It would be just her style. If i was a prison gaurd in her prison i would make it my lifes mission to ensure she doesnt manage to do it. She needs to pay for what she did to that gorgeous boy

 

[SpursGyal]

Thursday: Judge Wall formally sends jury out to continue their deliberations
Good morning from Coventry Crown Court.

The jury is brought back in. Judge Wall formally sends them out to continue their deliberations.

We will bring you any questions they raise which are aired in court and of course their verdicts, should they reach them today


Jury in Arthur Labinjo-Hughes murder trial retires to consider verdicts


I’ll copy over anything I see.

 

[Tortoise]

ET's defence summing up in bullet points. Not all words here are exactly as those used in court, but most are.

• Tactics and techniques have been used to paint ET as evil, vile etc. Her side has been lost in all the anger and emotion.
• Arthur was worried TH was going to kill him at the time his bio mum was convicted, before he met ET. He was still worried about that in June 2020. No one listened. TH made threats to kill Arthur.
• The fabric of Arthur's life was destroyed by TH. TH was in charge of Arthur's life.
• The final act that caused Arthur's death was all TH's fault. TH said at the hospital "it's all my fault", he didn't say it was an accident.
• Now he has an out - Arthur died under the care of ET.
• Now everything is ET's fault. History rewritten. TH and Arthur were happy happy happy before ET.
• Everything we've heard about TH must be lies... hating confrontation, being coerced, vulnerable, Olivia was lovely, Arthur was happy; Olivia exposed Arthur to violence and domestic abuse.
• Arthur was TH's punchbag.
• TH broke up his own family.
• The bruises photographed on Arthur's back in April couldn't have been caused by ET pushing him against a wall.
• SH used to pressure point the back of ET's neck, she was a victim of DV. ET wasn't in a position to deal with Arthur.
• If ET wanted to lie she didn't have to say Arthur was kept in the hall. She could have said he was upstairs in the children's bedroom (all day).
• Some of Arthur's behaviours would have been annoying to someone with OCD. She couldn't cope so she isolated him. She's a limited human being.
• ET's had a hard life. Suicide attempt. Rebuilt life. Brought up two more children with no concerns raised about her parenting. She needs to be in a relationship no matter how bad, and this was bad.
• With anxiety and depression and being trapped in lock down with a man who attacked the doors.
• ET regularly asked TH to come home and his replies were 'just finish him' and 'take his jaw off'. She didn't do those things.
• TH admitted in police interviews he had headbutted Arthur, slammed him up against a wall, put his foot on his stomach, and other assaults. He lied to Arthur about taking him to his nan's, ripped up his football shirts and ignored him. He wanted sex with ET in the midst of all this cruelty going on.
• TH deprived Arthur of water. He controlled it.
• No one tested the sandwich for salt. ET uses salt to alleviate pain.
• TH's account of the slipper was a farce.
• Why would ET poison and kill Arthur when her children were expected back?
• Ignore what ET says happened, just watch the CCTV and read her texts during that period (when Arthur died).
• Some of Arthur's head injuries could have been self-inflicted, the shaking motion could have been as little as 2-3 seconds.
• ET says she didn't do anything to cause Arthur to die. Even if you reject that you still have decisions to make.
• Nothing ET did after Arthur's collapse contributed to his death.
• Arthur was 'it' now it's her.
• She will pay a heavy price for the cruelty she has admitted.
• TH made all the rules. He was in control of ET's household. She was pregnant. He threatened ET with what she feared the most, losing her children.
• ET was dealing with anxiety. She lost all reasoning and reality. It does not follow that ET is a murderer because she admitted cruelty.
• The evidence supports TH being the salt poisoner. If ET did not poison Arthur, how likely is it she killed him before her children were coming home?

 

[suebaloo]

Anyone else think ET absolutely won’t survive prison? She will soon kill herself IMO.

She will be very high risk. They will need to keep an eye on her.

 

[Tortoise]

TH's defence summing up in bullet points. Not all words here are exactly as those used in court, but most are.

• Think about how nervous someone would feel if they were a defendant in a murder trial.
• Remove emotion from your decision, it's not about satisfying the public. You don't have a complete picture and might have unanswered questions. Don't speculate.
• Don't feel you've failed Arthur if you find TH not guilty. Not guilty doesn't mean innocent. Probably guilty is not enough.
• Jury is within its rights to find neither guilty of the salt poisoning if they don't know who did it.
• There was no real point in TH pleading guilty to cruelty because he's in your hands.
• TH denies murder / manslaughter, deprivation of food and drink and the salt poisoning.
• TH tried to find a way of disciplining Arthur and lost sight. It wasn't bullying for bullying's sake.
• As regards ET, the word you are looking for is evil. She is manipulative, controlling, uses emotional blackmail, controls the narrative to control the way you think.
• ET is physically and intellectually aggressive. She uses evidence to support her contentions cleverly. Audio and photos. Things happen when TH is not there.
• By early 2020 Arthur was telling his uncles ET was mean. She drives wedges between people. More fool him, TH let her.
• ET creates drama and plays the victim. She is not a victim she is a predator.
• Arthur was ET's prey because Arthur had TH. She is relentlessly obsessive.
• TH turned into a disciplinarian and a bully but that's a long way from someone who was trying to harm Arthur deliberately.
• TH was ridiculously attached to ET, she was the button pusher. ET undermined all the relationships TH and Arthur had.
• ET is sly, she does things when TH isn't around she can interpret another way.
• No one ever says no to ET, you've seen how she is when she doesn't get her own way.
• Arthur was clear who caused the bruises in April, you can't trust the evidence of SS.
• ET started to set up a narrative when she started recording Arthur.
• ET controlled the food. She deliberately created drama with SH coming round. She wound up TH deliberately just before he would come home.
• TH vents with bad language and threats. They were not threats that were going to be carried out.
• The picture of a taser was dark humour. If he did search for pressure points at the same time it was because of pressure from ET.
• By end of May ET starts reporting that Arthur is throwing himself into things. Disguising the fact that she is being violent to Arthur.
• TH played into her hands by breaking the door. Now she can say she's scared of him.
• On June 16th ET snapped and although she won't face up to it, she killed Arthur.
• TH accepted everything after the van journey. She plays the card that she's got the unborn baby.
• TH is stupid and he can live forever knowing he let down Arthur.
• There's no evidence he knew about the salt.
• ET feared Arthur was going to spoil her birthday.
• There is no evidence he knew what ET was doing.

 

[89leanne89]

I imagine the jury have made their decision on one person already and this time is being taken up by deliberations about the other.

 

[leehull]

I imagine the jury have made their decision on one person already and this time is being taken up by deliberations about the other.

Completely agree

 

[Rhino1895]

I just hope the Jury don't fall for the "poor me" story TH put out.

He knew in his first police interview he had been copped and admitted to everything. Only when he found out ET committed the actual assault then he saw a way out.

I was disappointed in his brother and I feel it could really sway the jury especially they way Arthur would shout out for him to rescue him.

I know families often find ways to justify things after events like these. But to call him a good dad that was just caught up by a woman and it was Arthur and TH against the world is just not true in any logical sense.

He was a frustrated man-boy who lived in his parents garage. He took full custody of Arthur and had abused, tortured and killed him within a year.

There is no doubt in my mind that there was alot of abuse going on in that annexe way before they left for ET house and the family knew it albeit not the full extent. Thats why they had a big bust up at Christmas.

TH was the main abuser. He may have done it to please ET but it was clear he was setting the rules and dishing out the punishment.

To pretend TH was a victim of any sort is really a disservice to Arthur's memory.

 

[89leanne89]

If you had to choose verdicts what would you go for ?
For me ET Guilty on all Counts
TH Guilty of Manslaughter and all other charges apart from the salt poisoning .

 

[Scratchingmyhead]

If you had to choose verdicts what would you go for ?
For me ET Guilty on all Counts
TH Guilty of Manslaughter and all other charges apart from the salt poisoning .

I second that!

 

[Rhino1895]

If you had to choose verdicts what would you go for ?
For me ET Guilty on all Counts
TH Guilty of Manslaughter and all other charges apart from the salt poisoning .

Murder for both of them. It was completely premeditated. They were going to kill him at somepoint and they just didn't care. They were starving him and poisoning him. You don't think Arthur would have complained that his food was salty? But apparently TH was walking around in a cloud and had no idea.

They cared so little that they incriminated themselves by recording the abuse.

 

[Powermjp]

I just hope the Jury don't fall for the "poor me" story TH put out.

He knew in his first police interview he had been copped and admitted to everything. Only when he found out ET committed the actual assault then he saw a way out.

I was disappointed in his brother and I feel it could really sway the jury especially they way Arthur would shout out for him to rescue him.

I know families often find ways to justify things after events like these. But to call him a good dad that was just caught up by a woman and it was Arthur and TH against the world is just not true in any logical sense.

He was a frustrated man-boy who lived in his parents garage. He took full custody of Arthur and had abused, tortured and killed him within a year.

There is no doubt in my mind that there was alot of abuse going on in that annexe way before they left for ET house and the family knew it albeit not the full extent. Thats why they had a big bust up at Christmas.

TH was the main abuser. He may have done it to please ET but it was clear he was setting the rules and dishing out the punishment.

To pretend TH was a victim of any sort is really a disservice to Arthur's memory.

#

I dont think they will, if they do they would be very stupid. But i trust the average person to see this case for what it is.

I think her storytelling and lies dont matter, the evidence should make an easy choice in my opinion. The fact Arthur could not have done it himself, her cctv footage, her own recordings and texts all damn her. The fact she changed her story on the stand etc.

 

[Rhino1895]

#

I dont think they will, if they do they would be very stupid. But i trust the average person to see this case for what it is.

I think her storytelling and lies dont matter, the evidence should make an easy choice in my opinion. The fact Arthur could not have done it himself, her cctv footage, her own recordings and texts all damn her. The fact she changed her story on the stand etc.

I'm not worried about ET that's a slam dunk case. I'm worried about TH getting the lesser charge. I hope the jurors dont fall for his story.

 

[Powermjp]

I'm not worried about ET that's a slam dunk case. I'm worried about TH getting the lesser charge. I hope the jurors dont fall for his story.

Ah i see, i missread, i do worry the same

 

[Tangled Spaghetti]

Anyone else think ET absolutely won’t survive prison? She will soon kill herself IMO.

I’d put money on it that someone else gets in there first. I hope she survives whatever’s coming and lives in fear for the rest of her days. Unkind I know, but she has zero sympathy form me