UK UK - Claudia Lawrence, 35, Chef, York University, 18 March 2009 #10

[Popejohn3]

thats true, popejohn....are you saying she couldn't have met some of the suspects because they were only in heworth when she was in ac....couldnt they have met somewhere else.

I think its important for her remains to be recovered, but not as a bargaining chip to get people off any charges relating to her murder...because others would use the same tactic, apart from it being wrong in principle.

it should work the other way...you get punished if you dont reveal where the remains are.

I dont know how it works if people are living in fear of their lives for revealing things

It seems I am not making myself clear .
Let us say for arguments sake that the cig smoker ( in her car ) is responsible okay ?
Now we know the police don’t have a name for him.
Let’s say he tells them where she is without revealing his identity.
Again let’s say the police match his dna on her body and let’s be honest this might not be so after 11 years.
Her family might get some peace .
He or she must know with tenacious people like you ( cortina ) around he might have to spend the rest of his life looking over his shoulder !

 

[keep-it-real]

thats true, popejohn....are you saying she couldn't have met some of the suspects because they were only in heworth when she was in ac....couldnt they have met somewhere else.

I think its important for her remains to be recovered, but not as a bargaining chip to get people off any charges relating to her murder...because others would use the same tactic, apart from it being wrong in principle.

it should work the other way...you get punished if you dont reveal where the remains are.

I dont know how it works if people are living in fear of their lives for revealing things

Bargaining chips are used all the time if the criminal has past lesser crimes a deal may be done to allow these not to be taken into account. In the case of murder with no body every effort is made to get closure for the family and recover a body because they are the long term victims in all this and some trade off may be seen as necessary for this to happen.

A murderer will still receive the rightful sentence but it will work in his/her favour to disclose the location of the body to gain a shorter fixed period.

life imprisonment is a sentence that lasts until the death of the prisoner, although in most cases the prisoner will be eligible for parole (officially termed "early release") after a fixed period set by the judge. This period is known as the "minimum term" (previously known as a tariff), usually a few years. In some exceptionally grave cases, however, a judge may order that a life sentence should mean life by making a "whole life order."

I agree @cortina it should work the other way .. in my opinion the prison sentencing sytem has gone soft
In july 2019 Justice Secretary David Gauke recommended his smart justice approach to whoever Boris Johnson appoints as his successor. A key part of Mr Gauke’s argument for an evidence-based approach to tackling crime was the figure of £18.1 billion which research published by the MoJ on the same day revealed as the annual societal costs of reoffending

 

[Popejohn3]

Bargaining chips are used all the time if the criminal has past lesser crimes a deal may be done to allow these not to be taken into account. In the case of murder with no body every effort is made to get closure for the family and recover a body because they are the long term victims in all this and some trade off may be seen as necessary for this to happen.

A murderer will still receive the rightful sentence but it will work in his/her favour to disclose the location of the body to gain a shorter fixed period.

life imprisonment is a sentence that lasts until the death of the prisoner, although in most cases the prisoner will be eligible for parole (officially termed "early release") after a fixed period set by the judge. This period is known as the "minimum term" (previously known as a tariff), usually a few years. In some exceptionally grave cases, however, a judge may order that a life sentence should mean life by making a "whole life order."

I agree @cortina it should work the other way .. in my opinion the prison sentencing sytem has gone soft
In july 2019 Justice Secretary David Gauke recommended his smart justice approach to whoever Boris Johnson appoints as his successor. A key part of Mr Gauke’s argument for an evidence-based approach to tackling crime was the figure of £18.1 billion which research published by the MoJ on the same day revealed as the annual societal costs of reoffending

In no way have I suggested a behind the scene agreement with police and perpetrator.
But I believe a victim’s family would put finding their relative first and before finding out who did it .

 

[cortina]

oh, I see, popejohn....thanks for that explanation....the only problem is, if no one knows who the perp is, how are we going to find Claudius remains...unless they make an anonymous phone call etc.....its easy to say from where im sitting, but I think id only take the remains over the perp being brought to justice, if being brought to justice was impossible...death of perp etc.

otherwise, you have to live with the knowledge that they. might kill someone else.

thanks for the information, as usual kir.

I think anybody who knows in this case is being held back by fear...I can well understand that and I wish I could say im sure id be brave enough to act differently.

 

[keep-it-real]

oh, I see, popejohn....thanks for that explanation....the only problem is, if no one knows who the perp is, how are we going to find Claudius remains...unless they make an anonymous phone call etc.....its easy to say from where im sitting, but I think id only take the remains over the perp being brought to justice, if being brought to justice was impossible...death of perp etc.

otherwise, you have to live with the knowledge that they. might kill someone else.

thanks for the information, as usual kir.

I think anybody who knows in this case is being held back by fear...I can well understand that and I wish I could say im sure id be brave enough to act differently.

Well said @cortina

 

[keep-it-real]

I wonder to what extent the threat that reporter Gerald Tubb received affected what he was actually prepared to disclose publicly about his investigations into the case when contributing to the Donal Macintyre's tv documentary
His disclose of the threat left me wondering.. What was the threat, how was it made made, who made it.
I presume it was reported to the police, what action did they take.

just my thoughts

 

[cortina]

gerald tubb did sound definite that he found the threat exceptional....and hes a very experienced journalist...presumably it was. more than oi you, dont come round my boozer asking those kind of questions.

it may have been anonymous....if not, then, as. you say, what did the police do....and, if he was too scared to report it, have the police contacted him since

 

[Popejohn3]

oh, I see, popejohn....thanks for that explanation....the only problem is, if no one knows who the perp is, how are we going to find Claudius remains...unless they make an anonymous phone call etc.....its easy to say from where im sitting, but I think id only take the remains over the perp being brought to justice, if being brought to justice was impossible...death of perp etc.

otherwise, you have to live with the knowledge that they. might kill someone else.

thanks for the information, as usual kir.

I think anybody who knows in this case is being held back by fear...I can well understand that and I wish I could say im sure id be brave enough to act differently.

Yes an anonymous phone call !

 

[Popejohn3]

I wonder to what extent the threat that reporter Gerald Tubb received affected what he was actually prepared to disclose publicly about his investigations into the case when contributing to the Donal Macintyre's tv documentary
His disclose of the threat left me wondering.. What was the threat, how was it made made, who made it.
I presume it was reported to the police, what action did they take.

just my thoughts

I’m more inclined to think something like “watch what you say or we’ll sue “
Or her dad is a lawyer he might sue you

 

[Popejohn3]

Is this thing working properly ?

 

[cortina]

I can't say for sure, but I think the threat was more than that, otherwise im sure he'd have said they threatened to sue and im sure hes had. that threat before....as far as I can remember, he didn't say where the threat had come from....eg, the nags, the ac, in malton or Heworth., over the phone etc...I think he did say it was local.....

 

[keep-it-real]

oh, I see, popejohn....thanks for that explanation....the only problem is, if no one knows who the perp is, how are we going to find Claudius remains...unless they make an anonymous phone call etc.....its easy to say from where im sitting, but I think id only take the remains over the perp being brought to justice, if being brought to justice was impossible...death of perp etc.

otherwise, you have to live with the knowledge that they. might kill someone else.

thanks for the information, as usual kir.

I think anybody who knows in this case is being held back by fear...I can well understand that and I wish I could say im sure id be brave enough to act differently.

 

[keep-it-real]

oh, I see, popejohn....thanks for that explanation....the only problem is, if no one knows who the perp is, how are we going to find Claudius remains...unless they make an anonymous phone call etc.....its easy to say from where im sitting, but I think id only take the remains over the perp being brought to justice, if being brought to justice was impossible...death of perp etc.

otherwise, you have to live with the knowledge that they. might kill someone else.

thanks for the information, as usual kir.

I think anybody who knows in this case is being held back by fear...I can well understand that and I wish I could say im sure id be brave enough to act differently.

Or has killed before

 

[cortina]

I think they've almost certainly killed before and probably since.

according to a newspaper report I read recently, Albanians are now in control of the uk drugs trade .....I dont know if that was true when claudia disappeared, but you certainly dont mess with them.

having said that, there are a couple of reports today about the drugs ring based in Birmingham, and. I dont think they're Albanian, but, interestingly, it says that the police are hoping to recover money from properties bought by the gang, although, officially they are in other peoples names....they seem to have been specifically buying properties in areas popular with. students near the university.....

 

[keep-it-real]

I think they've almost certainly killed before and probably since.

according to a newspaper report I read recently, Albanians are now in control of the uk drugs trade .....I dont know if that was true when claudia disappeared, but you certainly dont mess with them.

having said that, there are a couple of reports today about the drugs ring based in Birmingham, and. I dont think they're Albanian, but, interestingly, it says that the police are hoping to recover money from properties bought by the gang, although, officially they are in other peoples names....they seem to have been specifically buying properties in areas popular with. students near the university.....

The sooner we move to a cashless society the better it will be a game changer in my opinion

 

[keep-it-real]

Does anyone know if any of the 4 POI's owned property between heworth road and University road

 

[Vixey]

For the life of me I never understood why people include her girl friends in the suspicion list ?
Even lovers who are shy in coming forward are not necessarily guilty of harming her.
We know of several friends / colleagues male and female,that the police never even arrested .

Dai seems to believe they do, and are lying? Even if you knew them,was a friend and the nags was your local you still could not claim her friends (all) and those local are innocent. And even if you did, of course you would want to believe that but happens so many times! They were a friend, I have known them for years seemed a lovely caring person always helping his mother, kept himself/herself to them selves.Never seen oh yes knew them lot, good mates of mine def capable

 

[Vixey]

And the emphasis should be on giving her a decent Christian burial .

Are you Christian ? Just wondering if Claudia had moved away from religion and the church or wether she still attended or even help voluntary etc x

 

[curiosity2]

I can't say for sure, but I think the threat was more than that, otherwise im sure he'd have said they threatened to sue and im sure hes had. that threat before....as far as I can remember, he didn't say where the threat had come from....eg, the nags, the ac, in malton or Heworth., over the phone etc...I think he did say it was local.....

 

[curiosity2]

Did he deliberately give us a clue. If I remember right when Gerard Tubb reported that he had been threatened he referred to the location as a rural North Yorks market town (or something to that effect).York is a city,not a rural market town.