UK UK - Claudia Lawrence, 35, Chef, York University, 18 March 2009 #11

[cortina]

not really, popejohn....he could come from anywhere, but obviously more likely from the York area....he could be your mystery boyfriend figure after all.

thats. not really. my favourite theory, though, although ill concede. it is possible....like you, I think that Claudius death was accidental, though I dont know who was responsible, in the sense that I dont know who accidentally killed her....so id say manslaughter would be the likely verdict.

I did think the jk meltdown theory was a good contender at one time, but Claudius disappearance was so professionally done that I doubt it...to my. mind it is, just about, still possible, but id firmly bet against it....claudia had involved herself with so many unsavoury figures doing unsavoury things, and she had to be either. connected to someone of influence or an illegal project and they absolutely knew what they were doing when they disposed of her

 

[Popejohn3]

This screenshot from the police website
I presume the police were taken to the spot on the Friday .
It was spotted on Thursday at about 1 pm
If it was CL bag someone might have heard her phone ringing anytime from 6 am till 12:10
Took the phone but left bag,scarf and shoes ( one in and one out of the bag )
They would know it’s stealing by finding !
This story is so confusing.
You would think someone would own up if they thought the person reporting the sighting to NH management was talking about their bag ?!

 

[Popejohn3]

not really, popejohn....he could come from anywhere, but obviously more likely from the York area....he could be your mystery boyfriend figure after all.

thats. not really. my favourite theory, though, although ill concede. it is possible....like you, I think that Claudius death was accidental, though I dont know who was responsible, in the sense that I dont know who accidentally killed her....so id say manslaughter would be the likely verdict.

I did think the jk meltdown theory was a good contender at one time, but Claudius disappearance was so professionally done that I doubt it...to my. mind it is, just about, still possible, but id firmly bet against it....claudia had involved herself with so many unsavoury figures doing unsavoury things, and she had to be either. connected to someone of influence or an illegal project and they absolutely knew what they were doing when they disposed of her

Or she was working for the police .But and imo there is a But in fact I would call my book ‘Coincidence ’

 

[cortina]

id agreed with both your points. there, popejohn

 

[keep-it-real]

Or she was working for the police .But and imo there is a But in fact I would call my book ‘Coincidence ’

My book title would have been 'The Untouchables' which would have been perfect but of course thats already taken.
So I guess 'Smoke and Mirrors' or 'Secrets and Lies'

 

[Deleted member 102539]

View attachment 263165 This screenshot from the police website
I presume the police were taken to the spot on the Friday .
It was spotted on Thursday at about 1 pm
If it was CL bag someone might have heard her phone ringing anytime from 6 am till 12:10
Took the phone but left bag,scarf and shoes ( one in and one out of the bag )
They would know it’s stealing by finding !
This story is so confusing.
You would think someone would own up if they thought the person reporting the sighting to NH management was talking about their bag ?!

Never heard of scarf and shoes. I wonder.

 

[Popejohn3]

Never heard of scarf and shoes. I wonder.

I knew someone would ask that question. I believe a scarf and one shoe was spotted but when police searched the place and I am guessing it would have been on sat or Sunday they were gone .

 

[Bird over river]

I have been studying this case for some time and have several different theories and alternative views on the case.
1. Why has David Oxer - the fellow chef - never been a suspect?
2. Did he have a cast iron alibi? What could that be, given that he started work at the same time as CL? Did his wife lie for him or was he seen on cctv?
3. I think he is lying about the mysterious CL boyfriend, either because he is a fantasist and/or he did it!
4. He often gave her lifts, would know her shifts, route to work, possibly been in her house, possibly had sexual fantasies about her. he ticks a lot of boxes.
5. Why would CL tell him intimate details of her night out with the boyfriend and that things "progressed" when he also claimed that they only had banter about thickness of carrots. Smells like BS to me.
6. His strange laughter after his stupid comments on TV made me think he is weird. He thinks it funny to say "You're looking a bit rough this morning," about an ex-colleague had disappeared and probably been murdered
7. He has never explained why he took another route to work that morning. All routes are very similar in time/distance. So why hasn't he given an explanation?
8. He knows how to use knives for dismembering bodies and even throwing it out with the rotten meat from work. Or may know farms that have pigs for devouring human corpses.
9. I know he lives very close to the river Ouse, near a secluded spot for body disposal.
10. His wife liked the Yorkshire police on her facebook
11. He has the character THE JOKER as his main photo on facebook
12. Everyone on the planet thinks his BS story of a "mysterious boyfriend" is a BS story, which he amazingly remembered a year after her disappearance, so why? You don't suddenly remember a thing like that after a year. It must be a lie.
13 Why did Snelling get his and his mother's house turned over and Oxer did not. Just because Snelling wen to the bloody Nags head and Oxer did not. You never see Oxer's name mentioned whatsoever.
14. Did he drive a Ford Focus in 2009? Snelling drives from a different direction and so his car would not be on the cctv, but Oxer's car would.
15. If he had come forward with such a tale to me about this boyfriend, I would have considered putting it in the 15 minutes of fame file, or considered he was attempting to put the police off the scent and he has a fantasy profile and could have been the perpetrator.

 

[Popejohn3]

I have been studying this case for some time and have several different theories and alternative views on the case.
1. Why has David Oxer - the fellow chef - never been a suspect?
2. Did he have a cast iron alibi? What could that be, given that he started work at the same time as CL? Did his wife lie for him or was he seen on cctv?
3. I think he is lying about the mysterious CL boyfriend, either because he is a fantasist and/or he did it!
4. He often gave her lifts, would know her shifts, route to work, possibly been in her house, possibly had sexual fantasies about her. he ticks a lot of boxes.
5. Why would CL tell him intimate details of her night out with the boyfriend and that things "progressed" when he also claimed that they only had banter about thickness of carrots. Smells like BS to me.
6. His strange laughter after his stupid comments on TV made me think he is weird. He thinks it funny to say "You're looking a bit rough this morning," about an ex-colleague had disappeared and probably been murdered
7. He has never explained why he took another route to work that morning. All routes are very similar in time/distance. So why hasn't he given an explanation?
8. He knows how to use knives for dismembering bodies and even throwing it out with the rotten meat from work. Or may know farms that have pigs for devouring human corpses.
9. I know he lives very close to the river Ouse, near a secluded spot for body disposal.
10. His wife liked the Yorkshire police on her facebook
11. He has the character THE JOKER as his main photo on facebook
12. Everyone on the planet thinks his BS story of a "mysterious boyfriend" is a BS story, which he amazingly remembered a year after her disappearance, so why? You don't suddenly remember a thing like that after a year. It must be a lie.
13 Why did Snelling get his and his mother's house turned over and Oxer did not. Just because Snelling wen to the bloody Nags head and Oxer did not. You never see Oxer's name mentioned whatsoever.
14. Did he drive a Ford Focus in 2009? Snelling drives from a different direction and so his car would not be on the cctv, but Oxer's car would.
15. If he had come forward with such a tale to me about this boyfriend, I would have considered putting it in the 15 minutes of fame file, or considered he was attempting to put the police off the scent and he has a fantasy profile and could have been the perpetrator.

Welcome !
You certainly don’t mince words do you ? But no 10 ???
PS I think your numbered bullets is an excellent idea ... one can praise or challenge specific points.

 

[cortina]

hello gladioli and bird over river.

just thinking, popejohn,...I dont know much about local York people of influence, so the only person I can think of from York who has a high public. profile and an image to lose is Judi Dench...I know I said it could be anyone, but surely this is ridiculous

and then there all those olympic athletes from Yorkshire....but they'd have all been children back then.

I think many excellent points have been made, but ive gone completely off the idea of a lone, normal, perp....I just dont think the clear up operation would have been organised so efficiently, or that so many. people would have been willing to put their necks on the line...I think something was planned by several people but killing claudia was not part of it...something went very wrong...but there were enough involved to sort out a so called disappearance

 

[Deleted member 102539]

My book title would have been 'The Untouchables' which would have been perfect but of course thats already taken.
So I guess 'Smoke and Mirrors' or 'Secrets and Lies'

We don't know enough to even have a matching book title, if it shouldn't be very vague. "Sex & Drugs & Salsa" - maybe creative, yes, but nothing confirmed by now.

 

[ArcadeFire]

Some people on here say it was a professional clean up job. Not necessarily. The killer could have just got lucky. It does happen. For those few days afterwards he would have had time to dispose of a body and get rid of any incriminating evidence.

 

[Popejohn3]

Re BOR post mainly on DO.
If I was DO and innocent I would be here with guns blazing surely ?
Perhaps @Angleterre could help us here as a bonafide LE agent.If you were in charge of this case would you give DO permission... after eleven long years...to come here and defend himself ?

 

[cortina]

arcade fire....well, maybe there was luck involved in the clean up, but from all the vehicles etc we've been asked to. identify, I think it was a heck of a coincidence if there was. just one person involved in it.

as ive said, the. only kind of person I can really imagine engineering this as a sole perp is someone with enough influence to scare the heebie jeebies out of people to make them work with him or her or someone with enough money to have hired a crack team to execute the clean up.

if do wants to come on here to defend himself, im sure he'd be very welcome, but I think he'd be unwise to do so.

I suspect he. knows what. happened, even if he wasn't directly involved, but this isn't a court of law...these are just our opinions that we kick around here ...I can understand if they're hurtful, but its up to the police to ascertain whether they
contain any truth....after all, if we can't speculate, there's no point coming on here.

if these forums are considered too much of a risk then the laws of, in most of our cases, Britain, should state that anyone found posting on them would be doing something illegal...it. wouldn't stop everyone using them, but it would stop people like me

 

[Angleterre]

Re BOR post mainly on DO.
If I was DO and innocent I would be here with guns blazing surely ?
Perhaps @Angleterre could help us here as a bonafide LE agent.If you were in charge of this case would you give DO permission... after eleven long years...to come here and defend himself ?

Hi PJ3
I personally think that a lot of work has taken place behind the scenes that we will never be privy to and that DO would have already been looked at and alibis checked etc
Just because he is not considered as or indeed shows ‘normal’ behaviour traits according to BOR perspective, and he has the joker as his profile and his wife likes the Yorkshire Police page and he inappropriately laughs , again BORs perspective, doesn’t make him suspect number 1.
He probably doesn’t need to come forward all these years later because either he has been ruled out of the enquiry based upon what the investigation team know or he could still be a potential suspect - who knows ? We are not given the privilege of being part of the investigation team and we don’t know what they do or don’t know.
And wether we like it or not, we have to put our trust in them that they know what they are doing and who knows what intelligence they have in their system or what any cold case leads may be followed up.
We will probably never know unless either further evidence comes to light or NYP decide to tell us. DO could well be a very small part of the overall larger picture and be a jigsaw piece that currently slots into place ....
DO is under no obligation to come forward publicly any more than you or I but having said that, how do you know that these discussions and interviews haven’t taken place behind closed doors? How do we know just what investigation has taken place in and around DO? It’s all speculation on our part because we are not part of the investigative team. Hope that helps to answer your question PJ3 although I suspect it leaves you with no answers or further avenues to go down without NYP showing their cards ....

 

[Popejohn3]

Hi PJ3
I personally think that a lot of work has taken place behind the scenes that we will never be privy to and that DO would have already been looked at and alibis checked etc
Just because he is not considered as or indeed shows ‘normal’ behaviour traits according to BOR perspective, and he has the joker as his profile and his wife likes the Yorkshire Police page and he inappropriately laughs , again BORs perspective, doesn’t make him suspect number 1.
He probably doesn’t need to come forward all these years later because either he has been ruled out of the enquiry based upon what the investigation team know or he could still be a potential suspect - who knows ? We are not given the privilege of being part of the investigation team and we don’t know what they do or don’t know.
And wether we like it or not, we have to put our trust in them that they know what they are doing and who knows what intelligence they have in their system or what any cold case leads may be followed up.
We will probably never know unless either further evidence comes to light or NYP decide to tell us. DO could well be a very small part of the overall larger picture and be a jigsaw piece that currently slots into place ....
DO is under no obligation to come forward publicly any more than you or I but having said that, how do you know that these discussions and interviews haven’t taken place behind closed doors? How do we know just what investigation has taken place in and around DO? It’s all speculation on our part because we are not part of the investigative team. Hope that helps to answer your question PJ3 although I suspect it leaves you with no answers or further avenues to go down without NYP showing their cards ....

Thank you for such a quick response and I see you’ve been working on the night shift ! Lol
I wonder what DO would make of your answer if he was able to see it that is ?

 

[cortina]

obviously, I think that any innocent person who is considered as a suspect here would be champing at the bit to answer....I dont mean I think that do is innocent...as ive said, ive no idea who dealt the fatal blow, or whatever it was...but just as a general principle.

but I think that it would be very unwise of them to do so....anything they say apart from saying im innocent, could. be twisted and used against them in any future trial.

with all that we've heard, I really dont think this is an. ordinary individual acting totally alone, and only because they were sexually betrayed by claudia in some way, getting incredibly lucky in the context of the clean up....as ive said, nothing is impossible but this would be highly improbable

 

[Popejohn3]

This is from March 2016 “ refusal or reluctance “
Was it because they lost the respect of the police ?
Did the police get info but not in a written statement?
Did these people ask for legal representation at the time ?
And have they come forward since then hence the use of The word ‘reluctance ‘?

 

[cortina]

from this, I understand that some have come. forward, but some haven't.

I suspect, from what ive read, there's a mixture of fear of people they think may be involved and lack of respect for the police.

I hope those who came forward got legal representation, but whether they did and whether that info was written, we dont know

 

[Popejohn3]

You see even her mother had no respect towards the police at least in the first few years .