UK UK - Claudia Lawrence, 35, Chef, York University, 18 March 2009 #16

[BryterLayter]

Sarah grew up in York and her parents still live there

Yes but what is the Halliwell link to Sarah Everard? I’m totally confused

 

[FreddieDogg]

No news again today….

 

[HCcoffee]

It seems most plausible to me that she left on the evening and took her stuff for work the next day with her. But, if she is as tidy as she is said to be, it doesn't make sense that she would leave for the night leaving a sink full of dishes. So, I feel like she may have had someone over for dinner (enough dishes and glasses for two if it isn't a reconstruction photo) and then maybe decided to leave for their place a bit spontaneously. Either way, it's odd that no-one is caught on CCTV entering or leaving.

I've always been undecided about whether she left for work or something happened in her home but your theory actually makes the most sense to me. It really does look like she had someone over and it's likely they then left together, so the "crime scene" could be the other person's house or car! It doesn't necessarily mean more than one person was involved in the act itself (a lot of you guys seem to think at least two people were responsible?) but it's very possible they told someone and/or asked for help in moving the body?

Also this thing about the "left handed smoker". I'd read Claudia's car was in the garage for repairs but police checked it and found a cigarette butt that looked like it had been used by a left handed smoker. Is this 100% confirmed? (curious how they'd even be able to tell this as well!) It's an interesting aspect when you consider the witness sighting. CL didn't smoke and apparently hated people smoking around her.

 

[tulip182]

CH has been spoken about before but appears to have been ruled out as it stands. I’m sure it could be revisited if there is any new evidence to link him.
There’s always speculation when nobody has answers but the police seem pretty certain that it was someone in Claudias group of closer friends who’s responsible. They’ve obviously got credible information to have come to that conclusion. I just hope it is solved one day soon.

 

[Woodburnbay]

I dont know its a real head scratcher. Just what do they have? because other than she she knew these people we have been given nothing to link them to events of the evening of the 18th or morning of the 19th.

The POI's are saying nothing. Even after the a CPS decided not to bring charges against them they said zilch not even a statement from a legal representative after the decision.

Whats the answer
Are they completely innocent. Did they conspire together to cause her harm OR Did they conspire together to help her get away?

just my opinions only

Or were they guilty of something lesser than murder that would have sent them away for a stretch that they didn't want to do?
IMO

 

[Woodburnbay]

Twisted double murderer 'could be linked to Claudia disappearance'

Or could it have been someone who looked like CH?

 

[Woodburnbay]

But why did the Police believe in 2014 that they had enough evidence against the 4 local York men in their 50’s to arrest them in March and April 2015.
The police must have some pretty strong evidence, what I’d give to be able to find out what it was!
I’m not buying the Halliwell connection.

Did the 4 know who the real culprits were but out of fear did not wish to say?

 

[BryterLayter]

Or could it have been someone who looked like CH?

Good point maybe they wanted them/one to crack? Never thought of that!

 

[Woodburnbay]

I've always been undecided about whether she left for work or something happened in her home but your theory actually makes the most sense to me. It really does look like she had someone over and it's likely they then left together, so the "crime scene" could be the other person's house or car! It doesn't necessarily mean more than one person was involved in the act itself (a lot of you guys seem to think at least two people were responsible?) but it's very possible they told someone and/or asked for help in moving the body?

Also this thing about the "left handed smoker". I'd read Claudia's car was in the garage for repairs but police checked it and found a cigarette butt that looked like it had been used by a left handed smoker. Is this 100% confirmed? (curious how they'd even be able to tell this as well!) It's an interesting aspect when you consider the witness sighting. CL didn't smoke and apparently hated people smoking around her.

I believe that the sighting on Melrosegate bridge was confirmed as a left handed smoker but I have seen a posting somewhere on one of these threads that included a statement from Cold case saying that they couldn't ascertain if the butt in the car was left or right handed smoker and the DNA to date has been untraceable.

 

[Nikynoo]

The Police prepared a file for CPS, there must have been pretty strong evidence for them to arrest these men, even if it didn’t progress to court?

You don't need strong evidence to arrest someone, just reasonable suspicion. The CPS assess any file passed to them by the police and will only proceed if there is a reasonable chance of a successful prosecution. I suspect, that the police had circumstantial evidence only against these men and it just didn't reach the necessary standard.

 

[Nikynoo]

Sorry, I've been away for a few days caught up with family matters - could someone please summarise what, if anything, has been revealed since this latest event started? Have the police announced anything?

No. Nada. Crickets. Am starting to think there is some kind of news blackout........

 

[Blonderabbit]

It seems most plausible to me that she left on the evening and took her stuff for work the next day with her. But, if she is as tidy as she is said to be, it doesn't make sense that she would leave for the night leaving a sink full of dishes. So, I feel like she may have had someone over for dinner (enough dishes and glasses for two if it isn't a reconstruction photo) and then maybe decided to leave for their place a bit spontaneously. Either way, it's odd that no-one is caught on CCTV entering or leaving.

There’s a problem with that thinking. Claudia was single, she had her own house, no lodgers and work in the morning - why would she need or want to go elsewhere - you are also digesting she left unseen - by the back alley perhaps. She doesn’t need to skulk about - she’s single. Left yo elsewhere is a possibility of course, however - the sink - points to a visitor, a couple of drinks and something to eat - maybe supper, maybe breakfast. What I am thinking is - if you are one of the perps - I’d be looking at one another - someone’s got a loose tongue and the cops are on to you - IMO (of course )

 

[Blonderabbit]

How are you vom

I have been giving some thought on the night of the 18th vs the morning of the 19th.

I'm leaning more towards hte morning of the 19th, mostly because there is lack of evidence of anything untoward (that we know of) in Claudia's home.

HOWEVER.

If it was the 18th, I think the suspect would be more likely to be female, with help from a male to cover up.
If it was the 19th, I think the suspect would be more likely to be male.

ing to the conclusion of male and female given the time of day?

 

[Grouse]

We think CL is right handed

RSBM - on various CCTV images of her walking home from work on 18th she has her rucksack slung over her left shoulder --> https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0057/2240/7021/files/Claudia6_2048x2048.jpg?v=1570196688

Others may do differently, but I'm right handed and whenever I carry a rucksack like that, just slung casually over one shoulder, I always pick it up with my right hand and wear it on the right, it would just feel wrong on the left.

That said handedness is not always a binary thing, in some it's more like a spectrum Edinburgh Handedness Inventory - Wikipedia

 

[Novosti]

In my view, too much weight in the initial inquiry, or at least the publicity aspect of the initial inquiry, was given to the Melrosegate bridge and 'arguing couple' sightings. Both appear to be pretty vague reports, and even then have no very direct relation to her disappearance.

By contrast, the CCTV sightings in Heworth Place (released much later) are much more relevant and sinister.

I believe that the sighting on Melrosegate bridge was confirmed as a left handed smoker but I have seen a posting somewhere on one of these threads that included a statement from Cold case saying that they couldn't ascertain if the butt in the car was left or right handed smoker and the DNA to date has been untraceable.

 

[YaYa_521]

<modsnip - quoted post was removed>

RSBM
These links will help.
Rules - Etiquette & Information
Best Practices - Dealing with your fellow posters
The Rules

 

[Nikynoo]

How are you vom

ing to the conclusion of male and female given the time of day?

Ah, I need to read responses properly

It's just the feeling I get when I look at the dishes and the hair dye, together with the missing straighteners (I don't think she would take them to work).

 

[Grouse]

i agree with you about the rucksack - though I do alternate if it’s something heavy

If it's heavy (or hiking as opposed to casual wear) it has to be both straps on for me. Definitely thinking CL may not be fully right handed.

 

[Meatball]

My theory is that she was at her home on the night of the 18th and that night / afternoon she possibly had a female guest

I think this due to the hair dye, and that there was a whole bottle of brown dye, peroxide , powder AND a highlight kit. In the linked article it states that Claudia would touch up her hair with a chestnut dye between visits. I wonder did she put the brown dye on her own hair and whilst she was waiting for that, she used the blonde and highlights on someone else, as this seems way too much to put on one person's hair especially as Claudia did not appear to have very long or thick hair- thus the wineglass in the sink and meaning the pint glasses may belonged to Claudia as in pictures she always seems to be holding a pint of cider

Just my own opinion, sorry if this has already been said this is my first post on here

Hair straighteners missing

Missing chef Claudia no longer blonde

 

[tigerowl]

There’s a problem with that thinking. Claudia was single, she had her own house, no lodgers and work in the morning - why would she need or want to go elsewhere - you are also digesting she left unseen - by the back alley perhaps. She doesn’t need to skulk about - she’s single. Left yo elsewhere is a possibility of course, however - the sink - points to a visitor, a couple of drinks and something to eat - maybe supper, maybe breakfast. What I am thinking is - if you are one of the perps - I’d be looking at one another - someone’s got a loose tongue and the cops are on to you - IMO (of course )

Are you suggesting that single people never go anywhere but home in an evening? I think it's far more likely a single person going out to be with someone else than it is someone part of a couple. Young, single people hook up with others all of the time - even with work in the morning. We have reason to believe that CL had an active social/love life (which I have no problem with, btw) so feel it's perfectly reasonable that she might have been entertaining at home and then left with that person. Maybe they lived closer to her work. Maybe they had booze at theirs and CL had run out. Maybe they were out of condoms. Who knows, but plenty of reasons to decamp to another house if you're young and in love and having a good time.

We also didn't see anyone else on the CCTV so by the above assumption of yours, do you mean the only way anyone went in/out was via the alleyway?