UK UK - Claudia Lawrence, 35, Chef, York University, 18 March 2009 #19
- Thread starter KateB
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Even JK said "She said: “I understand why the police did what the police were doing because statistically it should have been one of us, statistically it probably is one of us. All I can say is hand on heart it’s not me. "
www.mirror.co.uk
Claudia Lawrence's ex-housemate makes bold claim about missing chef's pals
The former close friend of Claudia Lawrence says it's understandable to believe one of the missing chef's pals could be behind her vanishing more than 15 years ago
JimmyDurham
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Even JK said "She said: “I understand why the police did what the police were doing because statistically it should have been one of us, statistically it probably is one of us. All I can say is hand on heart it’s not me. "
Claudia Lawrence's ex-housemate makes bold claim about missing chef's pals
The former close friend of Claudia Lawrence says it's understandable to believe one of the missing chef's pals could be behind her vanishing more than 15 years ago
JK is incorrect.
Statistically, it is highly unlikely that JK killed Claudia.
Similarly, it is statistically highly unlikely that a syndicate, aka the NH4, killed Claudia and covered for one another.
I believe one of them was an ex-boyfriend. Statistically an ex-boyfriend is much more likely, but I believe this particular ex-boyfriend had moved on with his life and wasn't hankering after Claudia at all. Bear in mind that the men who kill their ex-partners are besotted with them, there is usually a history of domestic violence and they can't and won't let the ex-girlfriend move on with her life because they have a screw loose. None of this would apply to the ex-boyfriend who was part of the fabled NH4. Motive is crucial in any investigation.
It is statistically likely to be a lone man who is either an ex-partner or a current partner with a history of controlling behaviour, or a lone man known to Claudia who has taken a shine to her to the point of being besotted, or a lone man stranger. Obviously, in the event Claudia was murdered in her home or somebody else's home, then statistically that is likely to be somebody known to Claudia; in the event Claudia was murdered or kidnapped while walking to work in the morning, then statistically that increases the prospect of Claudia's murderer being a stranger.
It's hard to fathom why JK would say that when she clearly does not know what she's talking about. Maybe she likes a bit of attention and reckons she's Columbo. Dunno, don't know the lass.
I tend to agree that a lift to work person would be a good starting point, but I'd say this has all of the hallmarks of the cases you'd see on Crimewatch whereby a lone stranger has abducted a woman walking alone in the dark, with the exception of one pertinent point: in just about all of those cases a body was found nearby. That leaves me on the fence: known or unknown to Claudia, but the evidence suggests that she did set off for work that morning.
JimmyDurham
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Watch some of the old Crimewatch programmes on YouTube, you'd be surprised. There are many cases of women abducted while walking alone in the dark, often not far from people and cars. These killers take risks, they have to because there will always be people and cars not too far away.
In terms of CCTV, I don't think there were any from her front door until Melrosegate.
Don't take this the wrong way, but it would be worth having a look at what happens in the real world, as I say there are plenty of murder cases on YouTube, rather than place faith in people on social media who are regurgitating other people's gossip and Agatha Christie theories/tales. Just a suggestion.
JimmyDurham
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Any woman walking alone in the dark where there aren't many people around, is taking a risk. Doesn't matter where it is. Not a good idea at all. "York not being considered as dangerous" won't help you if you're unlucky enough to bump into the wrong person.
Interesting statistic in that of the women who go missing on the street and their bodies are found, in 98% of cases their bodies are found half a mile from where they were last seen.
On the other hand, maybe NYP should listen to Karen Edwards about Christopher Halliwell - she says he was a left-handed smoker who had been a "groundworker" up north. And if Halliwell's Father from Huddersfield died years before - who inherited his house?
"‘He used to be a groundworker up north – I know somebody who worked with him on the same building site. He would go and have a pint with the lads and then disappear."
"‘Serial killers are usually triggered by dates. That was the day that Halliwell broke up with one of his partners. Halliwell was familiar with York – his father lived in Huddersfield – and the description of Claudia’s murderer is identical to him – a left-handed smoker, 5ft 8-10in, with slightly receding hair and a skinny build."
"
For Karen, this search for the truth has become something of a vocation.
Sitting in a hotel where she had been staying to be close to the court, it is clear that this immaculately dressed woman who was praised by the judge for her dignity, now has an impressive knowledge of criminal law and a keen understanding of the various procedures by which Halliwell is expected to appeal against his life sentence."
"Since then, she has meticulously amassed boxes of evidence that would put Wiltshire Police, who bungled the initial investigation, to shame. Today, those boxes, packed with files and petitions, are stored, poignantly, behind lock and key in her daughter’s old bedroom."
"It was only because of Karen’s determination to see Halliwell pay for her daughter’s murder that he is now behind bars."
"He insisted on defending himself in court during the trial, drawing parallels with the case of Ted Bundy, the American serial killer who murdered more than 30 people."
www.dailymail.co.uk
"‘He used to be a groundworker up north – I know somebody who worked with him on the same building site. He would go and have a pint with the lads and then disappear."
"‘Serial killers are usually triggered by dates. That was the day that Halliwell broke up with one of his partners. Halliwell was familiar with York – his father lived in Huddersfield – and the description of Claudia’s murderer is identical to him – a left-handed smoker, 5ft 8-10in, with slightly receding hair and a skinny build."
"
For Karen, this search for the truth has become something of a vocation.
Sitting in a hotel where she had been staying to be close to the court, it is clear that this immaculately dressed woman who was praised by the judge for her dignity, now has an impressive knowledge of criminal law and a keen understanding of the various procedures by which Halliwell is expected to appeal against his life sentence."
"Since then, she has meticulously amassed boxes of evidence that would put Wiltshire Police, who bungled the initial investigation, to shame. Today, those boxes, packed with files and petitions, are stored, poignantly, behind lock and key in her daughter’s old bedroom."
"It was only because of Karen’s determination to see Halliwell pay for her daughter’s murder that he is now behind bars."
"He insisted on defending himself in court during the trial, drawing parallels with the case of Ted Bundy, the American serial killer who murdered more than 30 people."
Police dig up garden of double-murderer Christopher Halliwell
Police are excavating two gardens outside the killer's former home in Swindon, Wiltshire after the detective in his investigation told a court he believed the taxi driver had murdered 'more victims'.
JimmyDurham
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Aye, but a connection needs to be made to York. Yorkshire's a big place. I'm not from Yorkshire but even I know that you're looking at a decent drive from Huddersfield to York, maybe an hour give or take. It's not enough to make a connection to Huddersfield and then suggest it's relevant to a murder in York.
The other point worth mentioning is that I reckon people underestimate the amount of men out there who want to hurt other people. There are far more men out there willing to do that than a well known serial killer. It can easily be a local man with a screw loose who wasn't on the radar of the police.
Former senior detective who arrested Halliwell said
" Wiltshire police have said they will now examine if he may have killed others, but Steve Fulcher, the ex-detective superintendent who tracked down Halliwell in 2011, claimed much of the information that pointed to him being a serial killer was available five years ago but had not been acted on.
Speaking to the Guardian, he said: “He was quite apparently a serial killer. We had 43 packs prepared for each of the forces across the country detailing everything we knew about Halliwell with a view to putting him against outstanding inquiries. We did timelines, we knew his vehicles, his associations.”
Calling for an inquiry into police handling of the case, he said: “All the information was there in May 2011 but no investigation was conducted by Wiltshire police. There needs to be an inquiry asking why. It is utter madness that this wasn’t done.”"
www.theguardian.com
"Karen Edwards, whose 21-year-old daughter Becky Godden was strangled to death by Halliwell in 2003, said it was possible her killer is linked to Claudia's disappearance. Claudia was 35 when she was last seen in March 2009 and her mum Joan, 79, has previously begged police to further investigate Halliwell."
"Karen, 62, agreed, saying a witness close to the killer told her he wanted to relocate to Yorkshire, the Mirror reports. She said: “One witness said he always wanted to move to York or Yorkshire."
"Former Det Supt Steve Fulcher believes Halliwell could be a serial killer and in 2016 claimed the killer told him “police want to interview me about eight murders”. Karen said she had been approached by numerous witnesses who claimed Halliwell stalked them in Yorkshire and Bath, Somerset."
"Before being jailed, Halliwell worked in Yorkshire for a building firm based in his home town of Swindon. At night, he was said to disappear while colleagues went out for a drink."
www.examinerlive.co.uk
" Wiltshire police have said they will now examine if he may have killed others, but Steve Fulcher, the ex-detective superintendent who tracked down Halliwell in 2011, claimed much of the information that pointed to him being a serial killer was available five years ago but had not been acted on.
Speaking to the Guardian, he said: “He was quite apparently a serial killer. We had 43 packs prepared for each of the forces across the country detailing everything we knew about Halliwell with a view to putting him against outstanding inquiries. We did timelines, we knew his vehicles, his associations.”
Calling for an inquiry into police handling of the case, he said: “All the information was there in May 2011 but no investigation was conducted by Wiltshire police. There needs to be an inquiry asking why. It is utter madness that this wasn’t done.”"
Police accused of failing to investigate if Christopher Halliwell is serial killer
Former detective says he believes double murderer has strong connections to other cases and may have had a date on which he habitually struck
"Karen Edwards, whose 21-year-old daughter Becky Godden was strangled to death by Halliwell in 2003, said it was possible her killer is linked to Claudia's disappearance. Claudia was 35 when she was last seen in March 2009 and her mum Joan, 79, has previously begged police to further investigate Halliwell."
"Karen, 62, agreed, saying a witness close to the killer told her he wanted to relocate to Yorkshire, the Mirror reports. She said: “One witness said he always wanted to move to York or Yorkshire."
"Former Det Supt Steve Fulcher believes Halliwell could be a serial killer and in 2016 claimed the killer told him “police want to interview me about eight murders”. Karen said she had been approached by numerous witnesses who claimed Halliwell stalked them in Yorkshire and Bath, Somerset."
"Before being jailed, Halliwell worked in Yorkshire for a building firm based in his home town of Swindon. At night, he was said to disappear while colleagues went out for a drink."
Mum of Christopher Halliwell victim fears he killed Claudia Lawrence too
Karen Edwards, mum of murdered Becky Godden, said it was possible the killer also murdered the York chef
Last serial killer who made a hoax call in York was the Yorkshire Ripper I believe so it's not known for serial killers. And he certainly travelled between Yorkshire cities. York is known for it's nights out, especially at week-ends. People travel to York from Newcastle for Hen nights etc. Leeds is a quick easy drive to York. Huddersfield perfectly doable.
JMO
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JimmyDurham
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Aye, but you have to demonstrate the connection for it to be meaningful. You can't just say: "Huddersfield perfectly doable and that renders this a theory of equal worth". It doesn't. It's a non-starter unless you can demonstrate he spent time in York.
There are confusing reports about where Halliwell's Father lived. Quite a few newspaper reports quoting Detective Fulcher say his Father had lived in Huddersfield and also York. You would think Fulcher would know about this, having prepared 40 detailed packs about Halliwell for other police forces.
MOO
"Mr Fulcher, who revealed this weekend that Halliwell’s father lived a few streets away from Claudia’s father in Heworth, added: “My issue was no investigation has occurred. We were aware of Claudia Lawrence, we were aware particularly of Linda Razzell."
www.yorkpress.co.uk
MOO
"Mr Fulcher, who revealed this weekend that Halliwell’s father lived a few streets away from Claudia’s father in Heworth, added: “My issue was no investigation has occurred. We were aware of Claudia Lawrence, we were aware particularly of Linda Razzell."
Murderer Christopher Halliwell 'could have killed more'
DETECTIVES are keeping an “open mind” as they continue to investigate the double murderer linked to missing chef Claudia Lawrence.
North Yorkshire Police say it was incorrect that Halliwell's Father lived in York - but their information came from Wiltshire police.
"It was claimed that Halliwell's father lived closed to Heworth, where Claudia went missing, in 2009.
However, in an article in the York Press, the force said that this was "incorrect".
In the article, the force said that Halliwell's father was not a resident or York or North Yorkshire and that he had actually passed away in 1992.
The force were quoted as saying: "It can be confirmed that on the information provided by Wiltshire Police, there are no known links between Halliwell and the Claudia Lawrence case."
www.examinerlive.co.uk
But CL's Mother still wants them to investigate it seems - understandably.
JMO
"It was claimed that Halliwell's father lived closed to Heworth, where Claudia went missing, in 2009.
However, in an article in the York Press, the force said that this was "incorrect".
In the article, the force said that Halliwell's father was not a resident or York or North Yorkshire and that he had actually passed away in 1992.
The force were quoted as saying: "It can be confirmed that on the information provided by Wiltshire Police, there are no known links between Halliwell and the Claudia Lawrence case."
Murderer Christopher Halliwell and the Claudia Lawrence search
The twisted double murder was widely connected to the case for a time - but police said the timelines don't add up
But CL's Mother still wants them to investigate it seems - understandably.
JMO
I keep repeating this Claudia was 5’6 so the witness is not correct unless they stood on very uneven roadQuoting from @Angleterre in post 956 thread no 3
The man seen in the hoodie seen talking to a woman had a cigarette in his left hand. (One of the couples on CL's route to work)
"Last week detectives said they wanted to speak to a man and a woman who were seen by a cyclist on Melrosegate Bridge at 0535 GMT on Thursday, 19 March.
Police said so far no one had come forward with any information about the pair.
The man is described as skinny and about 5ft 6in tall. He was wearing dark trousers and a dark hooded top with the hood up and was holding a cigarette in his left hand.
The woman is described as smaller than the man, with mousy-brown hair. She was wearing a blue, waist-length jacket."
Thank you.
JimmyDurham
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Eyewitness testimony is notoriously unreliable.
This is the Guardian quote which says her bike was in the kitchen - to the person who was asking.
"The slippers were there, neatly tucked away," said Forman. "The sofa was empty. Her bike was in the kitchen because it was a nice day and she was walking into work."
Reading this Guardian piece, it shows that her house was locked - they needed her Father and his keys to get into the house. All looking as if she had left that morning.
www.theguardian.com
"The slippers were there, neatly tucked away," said Forman. "The sofa was empty. Her bike was in the kitchen because it was a nice day and she was walking into work."
Reading this Guardian piece, it shows that her house was locked - they needed her Father and his keys to get into the house. All looking as if she had left that morning.
Patrick Barkham: Missing Claudia Lawrence - Ten days of helplessness
On Wednesday 18 March, Claudia Lawrence went to work, phoned her parents, texted a girlfriend. Then she vanished from her family and friends' lives - leaving them distraught, and the police with a job to do
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