GUILTY UK - Lindsay Birbeck, 47, teaching asst, found deceased, Accrington, 12 Aug 2019 *teen arrested* #5

[Roostercat]

It’s going to be really hard for the jury I think. I think he’s not done the murder but I also don’t believe the stranger story I believe someone known to him was involved. But the jury can only go of what has been said in the court and the evidence and not to speculate so I’m really not sure where it’s going to go.

because there are quite a few blanks in this case, and unanswered questions I think the jury will find it difficult not to speculate and will possibly look to fill those blanks in themselves. It may simply come down to whether they believe the boy in the Dock is capable of murder rather than just focusing on what evidence they have been presented with.

 

[Sera]

My brother in law was on the jury of this trialhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-scotland-tayside-central-41346177
He passed out when seeing the exhibits of the murder weapon!
The guy has since seriously hurt someone whilst in prison.

Wow! I've never actually read about that case before. I bet the evidence the jurors saw was horrifying.

 

[Jartykarate]

My brother in law was on the jury of this trialhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-scotland-tayside-central-41346177
He passed out when seeing the exhibits of the murder weapon!
The guy has since seriously hurt someone whilst in prison.

I’ve always wanted to be called up, but you sort of forget

a) how boring most trials are
b) how traumatic some of the more interesting ones must be for the jury

 

[Roostercat]

[

Wow! I've never actually read about that case before. I bet the evidence the jurors saw was horrifying.

Yes, I imagine so, I am ure he said it was pretty clear cut. It had to be moved from Dundee to Edinburgh CC, there was a lot of ill feeling amongst the families and when the verdict was announced it apparently kicked off in the court room.

 

[Sally4x]

I would like at this point to thank @Alyce and @SpursGyal for their reporting of this case. It has been excellent and very appreciated.
My thoughts today are with Lindsay’s family and friends.

 

[Mommysleuth11]

I would like at that point to thank @Alyce and @SpursGyal for their reporting of this case. It has been excellent and very appreciated.
My thoughts today are with Lindsay’s family and friends.

Adding my thanks too, I sometimes skim through and forget to like or respond and just add my random musings after catching up but the updates in one place make it so much easier to follow. Thank you guys.

 

[Emmalt]

I've said this all along, I also find it strange that she got changed to go for a walk into what appears to be a collared shirt? Seems a little odd...

The asda cctv of her she had a shirt on.. but I do remember at the beginning the clothes she was last seen in were different to what was on cctv.

 

[Legally Bland]

2:24pm

There has been no signs of the jury reaching a verdict as of yet

2:24pm

The judge and jury are now being brought back into the courtroom to discuss a 'technical problem'

LIVE: Verdict imminent as jury decide teen's fate in Lindsay Birbeck murder retrial

 

[Whitehall 1212]

I’ve always wanted to be called up, but you sort of forget

a) how boring most trials are
b) how traumatic some of the more interesting ones must be for the jury

You forgot the third possibility....a fraud trial....long....painful.....torture

 

[Legally Bland]

14:24
Jury coming back into court
Good afternoon from Preston Crown Court.

We have just been informed that the judge and jury will be coming back into court in a few moments to address some “technical issues”.

Defence barrister Mark Fenhalls said the jury are having problems playing some CCTV on a laptop they were provided.

Lindsay Birbeck murder retrial at Preston Crown Court - updates

 

[Flowergirl1]

Hi everyone - first time I’ve posted anything , please be gentle with me. I’ve been following this trial (both trials) from the beginning and I find all your comments very interesting. My feeling is the defence summing up made a lot of the defendant’s autism, but he must have been examined before going to trial and thought fit and able to stand trial in a Crown Court. If I was on the jury I’d be feeling this is unfair to say that it is now a factor. Also they started to “suggest” that LB was meeting someone she knew, how can they do that if it wasn’t presented as evidence?! I’ve been called for Jury Service three times! Once to the Old Bailey during the time the Levi Bellfield trial was going on (although I wasn’t on that jury). In my experience a decision takes 2 - 6 hours, but I’ve not been on a jury for a trial as complicated as this. I’m hoping LB’s family get the justice they deserve.

 

[Emmalt]

What motive could there have been then?

I have no idea what the motive would be. There's no motive for the lad on trial now for it.

The lad Zoe described isn't the defendant I don't believe.. maybe she did see Lindsays killer. Maybe he was purposely trying to scare her so she would hurry away from the area.. maybe it was a planned attack as the police stated at the beginning when they told the locals the public... esp women were safe and they didn't believe it to be a random attack. JMO of course

 

[Alyce]

14:30
Technical problems with laptop now fixed
The Judge is now in court and has been informed that the “technical problems” with the laptop have now been fixed.


Lindsay Birbeck murder retrial at Preston Crown Court - updates

 

[Sera]

Hi everyone - first time I’ve posted anything , please be gentle with me. I’ve been following this trial (both trials) from the beginning and I find all your comments very interesting. My feeling is the defence summing up made a lot of the defendant’s autism, but he must have been examined before going to trial and thought fit and able to stand trial in a Crown Court. If I was on the jury I’d be feeling this is unfair to say that it is now a factor. Also they started to “suggest” that LB was meeting someone she knew, how can they do that if it wasn’t presented as evidence?! I’ve been called for Jury Service three times! Once to the Old Bailey during the time the Levi Bellfield trial was going on (although I wasn’t on that jury). In my experience a decision takes 2 - 6 hours, but I’ve not been on a jury for a trial as complicated as this. I’m hoping LB’s family get the justice they deserve.

Welcome and thank you for posting! I agree with the points you made with regards to the defence. What would your verdict be for this trial, given what we know?

 

[Jartykarate]

I would like at this point to thank @Alyce and @SpursGyal for their reporting of this case. It has been excellent and very appreciated.
My thoughts today are with Lindsay’s family and friends.

Here here

 

[sunflower22]

After the verdict is given what happens then? Does he come back on a different day to be sentenced. Sorry if I sound thick ha

 

[Leamar]

I mentioned this video the yesterday and that it had disappeared of YouTube where I watched it.
From what I remember it shows a male walking down swinging a jacket or bag from between end terraced house 332 and bungalow 330 (footage is taken from behind). The date was 12th Aug 19 and time was around 11pm.

Hi I have this video, just double checked the time on the CCTV states 22.23

 

[Flowergirl1]

Welcome and thank you for posting! I agree with the points you made with regards to the defence. What would your verdict be for this trial, given what we know?

I believe he is guilty of murder (I do not understand the introduction of manslaughter). MOO

 

[Whitehall 1212]

Hi everyone - first time I’ve posted anything , please be gentle with me. I’ve been following this trial (both trials) from the beginning and I find all your comments very interesting. My feeling is the defence summing up made a lot of the defendant’s autism, but he must have been examined before going to trial and thought fit and able to stand trial in a Crown Court. If I was on the jury I’d be feeling this is unfair to say that it is now a factor. Also they started to “suggest” that LB was meeting someone she knew, how can they do that if it wasn’t presented as evidence?! I’ve been called for Jury Service three times! Once to the Old Bailey during the time the Levi Bellfield trial was going on (although I wasn’t on that jury). In my experience a decision takes 2 - 6 hours, but I’ve not been on a jury for a trial as complicated as this. I’m hoping LB’s family get the justice they deserve.

Welcome and thanks for posting.

As all defendants are presumed innocent until found guilty the onus is entirely on the prosecution to prove guilt.

This allows the defence to introduce supposition, particularly during the summing up, without any evidential basis and to create doubt in the jury's mind. This is why a guilty verdict is such a high bar to get over.

I ask myself why the defence did not call any expert witnesses to testify on the real presentation of his autism?

Could it be that although he has communication difficulties, he has abilities and attributes that would support his capability to form the intent to kill LB and dispose of her in the manner he did?

OMI

 

[Jartykarate]

After the verdict is given what happens then? Does he come back on a different day to be sentenced. Sorry if I sound thick ha

I think sentencing is now usually at a later date so that pre sentence reports can be produced.