UK - Nurse Lucy Letby, murder of babies, 7 Guilty of murder verdicts; 8 Guilty of attempted murder; 2 Not Guilty of attempted; 5 hung re attempted #37

[Furore]

I'm sure that that email from her - or one remarkably similar - has been posted here before.

Those words are just dripping with narcissistic self-agrandisement, in my view. They are utterly self-serving and attention seeking!

If you've just been wrongly investigated for mistreating babies in your care then I'd think you'd want to keep it under the radar as much as possible, quite frankly. Why on earth would you put it on an "official" footing with everyone else particularly as it's probably unlikely that many people knew the full story in any event?

As mentioned just a few posts ago - I think that her sense of reality and social awareness is strikingly off somewhere along the line!

Agreed it’s so strange and self centred - babies were dying and that had to be investigated?! All about her. What’s it got to do with the nursing staff that it was stressful for her family? She’s an adult. Lots of people speak about how meek and sweet etc she was…not in that communication!

 

[mrC]

theres nothing vaguely incriminating there

 

[joltz]

Big coincidence then isn’t it, that she wouldn’t need her grief vampire fix until such time that police interviews were kicking off

Its all just guesses isn't it because Letby "couldn't recall" why she was searching for the family. A bit like she couldn't recall anything at all from the whole baby K shift once it went to retrial. I would hazard a guess that she has a selective memory. It usually kicks in when she is asked why she has done something suspicious.

Or maybe she wouldn't get any enjoyment from the parents grief, because she didn't actually meet them. JMO

 

[joltz]

theres nothing vaguely incriminating there

Well you wouldn't expect her to spell out "I'm a baby killer" would you?
With that being said it doesn't matter to some people what she wrote, because it's still not evidence. Not even when you write down "I killed them on purpose" "i am evil, I did this"

Some people always have an excuse for Letby regardless of the circumstances. Defending the indefensible. Someone has to do it I suppose. Judging from the turn out for the protest at Liverpool, it was the great unwashed.

JMO

 

[mrC]

well thats been explored many time

 

[Sweeper2000]

Lucy Letby: Emails and private notes reveal inside story of hospital struggle to stop killer nurse - BBC News

Judith Moritz, who has covered the Letby case from the start, takes us inside the evidence to piece together how events unfolded at the Countess of Chester Hospital - and why it took more than a year to stop a killer.

www.bbc.co.uk

thats the worst animation I have ever seen and too over elaborate to be of use. frustrating as well because the notes look interesting and they too often just blank allot of it out. one interesting bit is this.


"ak their own world". is that right or is it "word" ? i think its world. i wonder why they said that.

 

[Rohmer]

Well you wouldn't expect her to spell out "I'm a baby killer" would you?
With that being said it doesn't matter to some people what she wrote, because it's still not evidence. Not even when you write down "I killed them on purpose" "i am evil, I did this"

Some people always have an excuse for Letby regardless of the circumstances. Defending the indefensible. Someone has to do it I suppose. Judging from the turn out for the protest at Liverpool, it was the great unwashed.

JMO

on what planet is ‘i am evil, i did this’ written in a notebook alongside something along the lines of ‘i am innocent, i never did this’, both of which were written after she has been investigated and accused of committing the crimes and has been advised by a psychologist to write down her feelings as a way of venting… how is that a remotely compelling piece of evidence, one way or the other?

It’s not. If anything, it actually points to her innocence if you think about it logically. Why on earth would a cold-hearted killer write down ‘I am guilty’ etc in a fit of guilt-tripping?

Was she beginning to regret her decision to kill so many babies? I’m sorry, but I don’t believe the type of person who has it in them to commit such crimes suddenly starts to feel sorry for themselves privately. I know when we think someone is an evil person, it’s easy to twist any circumstantial evidence to confirm their monstrousness, but it just doesn’t sound remotely plausible, on its own as a standalone piece of evidence.

Perhaps you can gloss over it as simply yet another abomination once you’ve decided she’s guilty. But I personally can’t imagine Harold Shipman or Jeffrey Dahmer keeping a journal in which they seem personally conflicted over their own moral rectitude and culpability.

On the other hand, I can totally imagine this being the confused and dissociated thoughts of a strung out person wrongly accused of the worst crime imaginable.

 

[Marantz4250b]

Letter from Bhandal Law to Lady Justice Thirlwall dated 17 March 2025 | The Thirlwall Inquiry

Examining the events at the Countess of Chester Hospital and their implications following the trial, and subsequent convictions, of former neonatal nurse Lucy Letby of murder and attempted murder of babies at the hospital.

thirlwall.public-inquiry.uk

iv.................This arguably led to the jury being misled on the central thesis of the prosecution case, that there had been a spike in deaths on the NNU and staff rota showed Ms Letby being on duty of the time of each incident.

This is just so wrong! That was never the "central thesis" of the prosecution case. Once again...yet again...this tired old trope of "a spike in deaths and collapses was noticed...yadda-yadda....rota...Lucy Letby, etc, etc". Give me a break!

The central thesis - and I'm not convinced that it could ever even be called that - was the entirety of the evidence and the circumstances surrounding it.

The doctors had harbored grave concerns about her for a significant period and long before it was ever brought to the attention of the police. Had they not been threatened by management to not involve the police then she would have been investigated criminally much earlier and the "spike" in deaths would have been far less pronounced. It was not a "spike" which caused her to be investigated criminally, it was her behavior and the circumstances surrounding her activity on the ward.

If this is the level of legal advice she's fallen to then I'm even more sure that she's never seeing the outside of a prison every again.

 

[Marantz4250b]

on what planet is ‘i am evil, i did this’ written in a notebook alongside something along the lines of ‘i am innocent, i never did this’, both of which were written after she has been investigated and accused of committing the crimes and has been advised by a psychologist to write down her feelings as a way of venting… how is that a remotely compelling piece of evidence, one way or the other?

It’s not. If anything, it actually points to her innocence if you think about it logically. Why on earth would a cold-hearted killer write down ‘I am guilty’ etc in a fit of guilt-tripping?

Was she beginning to regret her decision to kill so many babies? I’m sorry, but I don’t believe the type of person who has it in them to commit such crimes suddenly starts to feel sorry for themselves privately. I know when we think someone is an evil person, it’s easy to twist any circumstantial evidence to confirm their monstrousness, but it just doesn’t sound remotely plausible, on its own as a standalone piece of evidence.

Perhaps you can gloss over it as simply yet another abomination once you’ve decided she’s guilty. But I personally can’t imagine Harold Shipman or Jeffrey Dahmer keeping a journal in which they seem personally conflicted over their own moral rectitude and culpability.

On the other hand, I can totally imagine this being the confused and dissociated thoughts of a strung out person wrongly accused of the worst crime imaginable.

Again, all been gone over previously.

Those points were specifically addressed at trial and those words were not written by her on the advice of anyone. It is demonstrably untrue.

As always, if you can provide a source for your statement please do so.

 

[joltz]

I'm sure that that email from her - or one remarkably similar - has been posted here before.

Those words are just dripping with narcissistic self-agrandisement, in my view. They are utterly self-serving and attention seeking!

If you've just been wrongly investigated for mistreating babies in your care then I'd think you'd want to keep it under the radar as much as possible, quite frankly. Why on earth would you put it on an "official" footing with everyone else particularly as it's probably unlikely that many people knew the full

on what planet is ‘i am evil, i did this’ written in a notebook alongside something along the lines of ‘i am innocent, i never did this’, both of which were written after she has been investigated and accused of committing the crimes and has been advised by a psychologist to write down her feelings as a way of venting… how is that a remotely compelling piece of evidence, one way or the other?

It’s not. If anything, it actually points to her innocence if you think about it logically. Why on earth would a cold-hearted killer write down ‘I am guilty’ etc in a fit of guilt-tripping?

Was she beginning to regret her decision to kill so many babies? I’m sorry, but I don’t believe the type of person who has it in them to commit such crimes suddenly starts to feel sorry for themselves privately. I know when we think someone is an evil person, it’s easy to twist any circumstantial evidence to confirm their monstrousness, but it just doesn’t sound remotely plausible, on its own as a standalone piece of evidence.

Perhaps you can gloss over it as simply yet another abomination once you’ve decided she’s guilty. But I personally can’t imagine Harold Shipman or Jeffrey Dahmer keeping a journal in which they seem personally conflicted over their own moral rectitude and culpability.

On the other hand, I can totally imagine this being the confused and dissociated thoughts of a strung out person wrongly accused of the worst crime imaginable.

There's absolutely no evidence to suggest that Letby wrote this down because her therapist told her to. She was asked about the notes in court and she never offered this opinion. The idea that she did this comes from a newspaper article from Sarah Knapton in which "a source says" she did. That's it. Letby has never offered this reasoning so I think its a bit of a jump to accept this as fact.

Are you actually being serious though?

So now Letbys writing down "I killed them on purpose" is a sign that she's innocent.

What you can imagine and what is fact is probably two different things. Maybe your imagination is rejecting any evidence against Letby and your default reaction is to look for innocent explanations for everything. It makes absolutely no sense to continually give Letby the benefit of the doubt over and over again.
JMO

 

[Tortoise]

on what planet is ‘i am evil, i did this’ written in a notebook alongside something along the lines of ‘i am innocent, i never did this’, both of which were written after she has been investigated and accused of committing the crimes and has been advised by a psychologist to write down her feelings as a way of venting… how is that a remotely compelling piece of evidence, one way or the other?

It’s not. If anything, it actually points to her innocence if you think about it logically. Why on earth would a cold-hearted killer write down ‘I am guilty’ etc in a fit of guilt-tripping?

Was she beginning to regret her decision to kill so many babies? I’m sorry, but I don’t believe the type of person who has it in them to commit such crimes suddenly starts to feel sorry for themselves privately. I know when we think someone is an evil person, it’s easy to twist any circumstantial evidence to confirm their monstrousness, but it just doesn’t sound remotely plausible, on its own as a standalone piece of evidence.

Perhaps you can gloss over it as simply yet another abomination once you’ve decided she’s guilty. But I personally can’t imagine Harold Shipman or Jeffrey Dahmer keeping a journal in which they seem personally conflicted over their own moral rectitude and culpability.

On the other hand, I can totally imagine this being the confused and dissociated thoughts of a strung out person wrongly accused of the worst crime imaginable.

A transcript here of Letby's police interviews regarding her post-it note, which she says was written in July 2016, with detailed context given for every line written, when she was redeployed because she was told her competences needed to be tested, before she'd been investigated, two months before she heard what the accusations were (in Sep 2016), almost a year before police were involved. She explains why she thought police might become involved and that she hadn't talked to anyone about her feelings, not even her best friend or her parents.

In her own words, as read to the jury.

Anyone who says she was advised to write down her feelings by a psychologist, when she wasn't even seeing one at that time, is creating a defence for her, one she hasn't used herself in the witness box, in the police station, or in her defence statement. No one came forward to her defence team during her trial to testify to this. What would motivate anyone to literally make up a defence for a convicted serial killer?



In September 2016, Letby says, she received a letter from the Royal College of Nursing about the "true reason" for her redeployment, that she was being held responsible for the deaths of babies on the neonatal unit.
She says she was putting in a grievance procedure about being redployed.
She says she did not know, at that time, how many babies she was being held responsible for.
She says she felt it was "sickening" to be held as a person responsible for the deaths of babies.
"I don't think you can be accused of anything worse than that."
"I just changed as a person, my mental health deteriorated, I felt isolated...from my friends on the unit."
Recap: Lucy Letby trial, Tuesday, May 2 - defence begins

 

[JosieJo]

A transcript here of Letby's police interviews regarding her post-it note, which she says was written in July 2016, with detailed context given for every line written, when she was redeployed because she was told her competences needed to be tested, before she'd been investigated, two months before she heard what the accusations were (in Sep 2016), almost a year before police were involved. She explains why she thought police might become involved and that she hadn't talked to anyone about her feelings, not even her best friend or her parents.

In her own words, as read to the jury.

Anyone who says she was advised to write down her feelings by a psychologist, when she wasn't even seeing one at that time, is creating a defence for her, one she hasn't used herself in the witness box, in the police station, or in her defence statement. No one came forward to her defence team during her trial to testify to this. What would motivate anyone to literally make up a defence for a convicted serial killer?



In September 2016, Letby says, she received a letter from the Royal College of Nursing about the "true reason" for her redeployment, that she was being held responsible for the deaths of babies on the neonatal unit.
She says she was putting in a grievance procedure about being redployed.
She says she did not know, at that time, how many babies she was being held responsible for.
She says she felt it was "sickening" to be held as a person responsible for the deaths of babies.
"I don't think you can be accused of anything worse than that."
"I just changed as a person, my mental health deteriorated, I felt isolated...from my friends on the unit."
Recap: Lucy Letby trial, Tuesday, May 2 - defence begins

It's easy to forget how damning her own testimony was until you relisten

 

[Rohmer]

iv.................This arguably led to the jury being misled on the central thesis of the prosecution case, that there had been a spike in deaths on the NNU and staff rota showed Ms Letby being on duty of the time of each incident.

This is just so wrong! That was never the "central thesis" of the prosecution case. Once again...yet again...this tired old trope of "a spike in deaths and collapses was noticed...yadda-yadda....rota...Lucy Letby, etc, etc". Give me a break!

The central thesis - and I'm not convinced that it could ever even be called that - was the entirety of the evidence and the circumstances surrounding it.

The doctors had harbored grave concerns about her for a significant period and long before it was ever brought to the attention of the police. Had they not been threatened by management to not involve the police then she would have been investigated criminally much earlier and the "spike" in deaths would have been far less pronounced. It was not a "spike" which caused her to be investigated criminally, it was her behavior and the circumstances surrounding her activity on the ward.

If this is the level of legal advice she's fallen to then I'm even more sure that she's never seeing the outside of a prison every again.

what behaviour and circumstances surrounding her activity on the ward? It was her proximity to a perceived spike in deaths driven by a faulty understanding of probabilities and confirmation bias.

 

[Rohmer]

Again, all been gone over previously.

Those points were specifically addressed at trial and those words were not written by her on the advice of anyone. It is demonstrably untrue.

As always, if you can provide a source for your statement please do so.

‘I am evil I did this’: Lucy Letby’s so-called confessions were written on advice of counsellors

Prosecutors used densely written Post-its to build case against nurse, but she was told to write down her feelings to cope with extreme stress, sources say

www.theguardian.com

 

[mrC]

they were written by her on adive from her therapist they were part of her therapy sesions

 

[Tortoise]

they were written by her on adive from her therapist they were part of her therapy sesions

Where did Letby say this?

I'm not interested in unnamed sources making up stuff after her trials, that hasn't been tested in court. We can all make up stories.

 

[Parker Knoll]

They were not.
She never mentioned any therapist in court and neither did her counsel.
This was a lie spun by Sarah Knapton ( amongst others ) at the Telegraph.

 

[Tortoise]

They were not.
She never mentioned any therapist in court and neither did her counsel.
This was a lie spun by Sarah Knapton ( amongst others ) at the Telegraph.

It didn't even make it into the CCRC application.

 

[Sweeper2000]

Learned that today, wasn't the occupational health lady kind of giving her that as well? doesn't need to be a trained therapist. what was lucy's reasoning for writing it down then? yeh though if she did that without prompting its genuinely strange.

eta was it the whole cathartic emphasis we hear from her?

 

[Moll]

Where did Letby say this?

I'm not interested in unnamed sources making up stuff after her trials, that hasn't been tested in court. We can all make up stories.

Apart from the facts, am I right in recalling that the prosecution did not make a great deal of these notes - certainly did not depend on them?