UK - Nurse Lucy Letby, murder of babies, 7 Guilty of murder verdicts; 8 Guilty of attempted murder; 2 Not Guilty of attempted; 5 hung re attempted #38

[Charlot123]

Don’t tell me you think a 13 stone man will place two hands on a tiny body and jump up and down in an effort to resuscitate a neonate?

Look up how resuscitation is performed on a baby

Could the air get into the body during resuscitation? What do the doctors say?

 

[Parker Knoll]

Not sure sweep …. I’m just guessing here.
It’s Letby remember !

 

[Marantz4250b]

So, the BBC doc showed up on YouTube (I don't have a TV licence - can't stand the BBC and I never watch TV anyway - so I can't, and won't, watch it on iPlayer). It was at least reasonably balanced but there was literally not a single thing new in it. Everything mentioned was already known to the defence at the time of the trials. That was pointed out repeatedly during the programme.

I thought that MM was being particularly obnoxious in refusing to give the details of the report towards the end. Sorry, but if you announce something at a presser designed specifically to get attention, then it really does come across as very bad form to refuse to answer questions on the details!

 

[Marantz4250b]

And, I've said it before (as many of us here have) and will say it again; it's incredibly easy to debate random bits of evidence in isolation and out of the context of a properly constituted trial. Any individual piece of evidence can be seemingly picked apart on its own but it's the full weight of the entirely of the evidence when examined together which matters. This is why we don't conduct criminal trials on TV fronted by Ant and Dec with a viewers phone in on a Saturday evening to settle the verdict.

She's had her opportunity to defend her case. She lost. In my opinion, rightly so!

 

[Sweeper2000]

So, the BBC doc showed up on YouTube (I don't have a TV licence - can't stand the BBC and I never watch TV anyway - so I can't, and won't, watch it on iPlayer). It was at least reasonably balanced but there was literally not a single thing new in it. Everything mentioned was already known to the defence at the time of the trials. That was pointed out repeatedly during the programme.

I thought that MM was being particularly obnoxious in refusing to give the details of the report towards the end. Sorry, but if you announce something at a presser designed specifically to get attention, then it really does come across as very bad form to refuse to answer questions on the details!

cheers marantz. checking it now. wont exoect anything new though.

 

[Marantz4250b]

From a brief read of the comments on the YT video, yet again we see the false narrative of "statistics" being continually aired.

This 3rd BBC Panorama Documentary didn't cover the Stats evidence at all. Why?It was this evidence that first pointed the finger of suspicion at LL and was a key piece of the circumstantial evidence used in court.

Completely and utterly false. It was nothing of the sort.

She came to the attention of consultants because they began to notice that she always seemed to be around when all hell broke loose. The "stats" (they obviously mean the shift rota chart) were nothing of the sort. Suspicions were not aroused because some doctors read a statistical report where an increase in deaths and collapses were highlighted. It was their own day-to-day experience which caused them to notice.

Nor was it a "key" piece of evidence - to say it was is nothing more than opinion. It was one small piece of the overall evidence. Something which I believe was mentioned something like twice during a ten month trial! The jury could place as much or as little weight on it as they saw fit.

This is what happens when you have very lengthy, complicated trials where media outlets publish misleading headlines as click-bait and repeatedly fail to get facts right, or attribute incorrect meanings to them in their articles.

 

[Marantz4250b]

So, just watched the last few minutes of that documentary - I'm at work - and MM comes over as a total hypocrite; he was basically demanding the evidence as regards the stats from LWH that breathing tubes had a rate of dislodgement 40 times higher when she was on shift, yet wasn't willing to produce his evidence on the other point I mentioned earlier!

And, as much as her supporters like to bang on about statistics that did not exist and so were never used in her trial, if that stat about tube dislodgement is anywhere close to being correct then, as both journalists appeared to be in agreement on, then I don't see how they could possibly argue against it!

As they point out, this stuff is obviously highly monitored and is exceptionally unlikely to be wrong. Obviously, it hasn't been tested in a court of law, so we will have to see where they go with that.

I'm definitely coming to the opinion that more charges are looking likely at this point.

 

[Sweeper2000]

ah interesting like really interesting piece in that documentary. words from a pro on that tube dislodgement at lwh, the question was how bad would letby ahve to be as a nurse for the tubes to dislodge at the rate they did during her time there ? "spectacularly bad or shes doing it on purpose" was the response and the guy was saying this person really understands the data. sounds very damning to me.

 

[Parker Knoll]

Ant and Dec

 

[May72031]

Some of the Letbyists are squabbling amongst themselves. We all knew that incredible and ridiculous claim from one of Shoo Lee's experts (very "eminent", of course!) about a doctor killing a baby with a needle would come back to haunt them. That's the problem conspiracy theorists have when they keep throwing out disparate "explanations" for things - they all start to contradict one another.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1955686839567954114

 

[marynnu]

Trouble in paradise it seems. Oh dear, how sad, never mind.

 

[JosieJo]

How can saying if he was the Dr he wouldn't be able to sleep at night be interpreted any other way ?

How can any last ditch attempt to save a baby be "inappropriate" ?

How can they say fresh blood in the needle is proof of hitting the liver when they also say the baby was bleeding in the abdominal cavity ?????

 

[joltz]

How can saying if he was the Dr he wouldn't be able to sleep at night be interpreted any other way ?

How can any last ditch attempt to save a baby be "inappropriate" ?

How can they say fresh blood in the needle is proof of hitting the liver when they also say the baby was bleeding in the abdominal cavity ?????

They are just seeking media attention with the frivolous claims. I think they hope that with the amount of misinformation and BS they spread, the actual truth will be lost, or just so hard to determine that a jury or anyone that matters won't be able to decipher it.

JMO

 

[Tortoise]

Journalists are undermining the justice system and perpetuating a fraud on the public. There ought to be repercussions for the sheer irresponsibility, while the police have announced there are fresh charges under review. IMO

 

[Parker Knoll]

One hundred percent @Tortoise

There is a piece in the Spectator by Christopher Snowdon ( I don’t think I can link it here sadly ) which is very interesting and worth having a look at which discusses the latest TV documentary and goes through her appeal to the CCRC and dismantles it - not skewed nor hysterical- just facts proven in Court, also Deb Roberts is also very interesting to follow on X who without fan fair debunks these wild claims so easily.

The way I view this now is that it is purely a PR campaign which incredibly has a PR firm attached it it, run by her “ legal “ team and I use that term loosely as I’m staggered he hasn’t been reported to the Bar Council months ago who has many many axes to grind here and he’s wasting no time as IF new charges come he will have to pipe right down.

He doesn’t give two hoots about Letby - this is just a vehicle for him and his “ innocence project “ to gather some kind of publicity for his crappy practice which is made up entirely of serial killers without a hope in hell of getting their convictions overturned and a bunch of freaks over in the US on death row.
Letby is a GIFT.

So let’s muddy the waters of the appeal which has more holes than a lump of Swiss cheese by holding grotesque pressers, interviews and briefing certain journalists to spread lies and misinformation and BINGO …. The narrative in certain MSM outlets are skewed slightly.
They don’t have anything credible so let’s run with the “ look over there … don’t look over here “ old chestnut.
She’s making utter fools of all of them.

It’s shameful.

JMO

 

[marynnu]

One hundred percent @Tortoise

There is a piece in the Spectator by Christopher Snowdon ( I don’t think I can link it here sadly ) which is very interesting and worth having a look at which discusses the latest TV documentary and goes through her appeal to the CCRC and dismantles it - not skewed nor hysterical- just facts proven in Court, also Deb Roberts is also very interesting to follow on X who without fan fair debunks these wild claims so easily.

The way I view this now is that it is purely a PR campaign which incredibly has a PR firm attached it it, run by her “ legal “ team and I use that term loosely as I’m staggered he hasn’t been reported to the Bar Council months ago who has many many axes to grind here and he’s wasting no time as IF new charges come he will have to pipe right down.

He doesn’t give two hoots about Letby - this is just a vehicle for him and his “ innocence project “ to gather some kind of publicity for his crappy practice which is made up entirely of serial killers without a hope in hell of getting their convictions overturned and a bunch of freaks over in the US on death row.
Letby is a GIFT.

So let’s muddy the waters of the appeal which has more holes than a lump of Swiss cheese by holding grotesque pressers, interviews and briefing certain journalists to spread lies and misinformation and BINGO …. The narrative in certain MSM outlets are skewed slightly.
They don’t have anything credible so let’s run with the “ look over there … don’t look over here “ old chestnut.
She’s making utter fools of all of them.

It’s shameful.

JMO

I'm sure someone reported him a while back, but just got a generic letter in return.
His current licence runs out at the end of April, just saying.

 

[Sweeper2000]

didnt see it posted so DR Michael Hall has some beef with the panels findings. is paywalled.

"Lucy Letby’s defence expert says appeal case has ‘serious flaws’​

Neonatologist Dr Mike Hall has cast doubt on new explanations for the deaths of babies put forward by the killer nurse’s legal team"

https://www.thetimes.com/uk/crime/article/lucy-letbys-defence-expert-says-appeal-case-has-serious-flaws-8hhmlnl2r

to quote mcdonald "i have 23 EXPERT reports from 24 EXPERTS from EIGHT different countries"

its like its got sugar on but is bitter as hell anyways.

 

[Parker Knoll]

It’s a castle built on sand.

 

[JosieJo]

didnt see it posted so DR Michael Hall has some beef with the panels findings. is paywalled.

"Lucy Letby’s defence expert says appeal case has ‘serious flaws’​

Neonatologist Dr Mike Hall has cast doubt on new explanations for the deaths of babies put forward by the killer nurse’s legal team"

https://www.thetimes.com/uk/crime/article/lucy-letbys-defence-expert-says-appeal-case-has-serious-flaws-8hhmlnl2r

to quote mcdonald "i have 23 EXPERT reports from 24 EXPERTS from EIGHT different countries"

its like its got sugar on but is bitter as hell anyways.

I liked Hall in the documentary he seemed fair and grounded ...can fully understand why he's not part of McDonald's team despite having a huge insight into the case

 

[Parker Knoll]

One would think he would have been approached though ?
I would personally love to know if he has.