UK - Nurse Lucy Letby, murder of babies, 7 Guilty of murder verdicts; 8 Guilty of attempted murder; 2 Not Guilty of attempted; 5 hung re attempted #38

[marynnu]

I never followed her case or trial very closely, so can't really know what evidence was presented against her

Are you serious?

 

[katydid23]

Are you serious?

He is talking about a different case here, and NOT Letby's case.[ He was asked about Beverly Allitt]

 

[Marantz4250b]

^ It does make you wonder though what his game is? It's really not a good look for someone hoping to be perceived as a credible voice for justice gone (so-called) wrong, to say the absolute least. Arrogance can account for some of it, certainly, but what can possibly account for the level of sheer idiocy he's prepared to expose of himself in order to keep this bizarre flag flying?

I'm guessing there's money involved. That seems to be at the root of most of what drives his and this type of 'grandstanding'.

Arrogance, opportunism, money and a greedy, self-serving eye on the gullible prize.

The world we live in, sadly, where positions as regards justice are chosen based on what's in it for them, rather than what the evidence itself says.

There is definitely something behind his actions but I'm not sure it's money. I mean, just where is the money in these cases? It's not as though these people he's fighting for have pots of cash to throw at him; Lucy Letby certainly doesn't and her parents are far from wealthy and have already reportedly spent a fortune to be close to the trial in Manchester which is miles away from where they live.

He's not earning from any public funds as legal aid won't be paying him anything as there is no active prosecution.

It's all very puzzling as to why he's doing this and how he's funding it.

 

[Marantz4250b]

He is talking about a different case here, and NOT Letby's case.[ He was asked about Beverly Allitt]

I hadn't heard that MM was claiming that BA was wrongly convicted. If true then he's even more delusional than it at first appears - not even Beverly Allitt is claiming that Beverley Allitt is innocent!

 

[Parker Knoll]

He has to be representing other defendants either privately or legally aided surely ?
Other than that he’s won the euro millions and said zip !

 

[joltz]

I never followed her case or trial very closely, so can't really know what evidence was presented against her

Right, so didn't follow case or trial closely, don't know what the evidence was but have decided it's a MOJ and she's going to get out one day?

JMO

 

[joe jones]

Right, so didn't follow case or trial closely, don't know what the evidence was but have decided it's a MOJ and she's going to get out one day?

JMO

That post was about a different case of which I hadn't followed so have no opinion, LL case I followed from the very first news report both locally and nationally from start to today

 

[joe jones]

There is definitely something behind his actions but I'm not sure it's money. I mean, just where is the money in these cases? It's not as though these people he's fighting for have pots of cash to throw at him; Lucy Letby certainly doesn't and her parents are far from wealthy and have already reportedly spent a fortune to be close to the trial in Manchester which is miles away from where they live.

He's not earning from any public funds as legal aid won't be paying him anything as there is no active prosecution.

It's all very puzzling as to why he's doing this and how he's funding it.

Maybe he is doing it because he feels a calling to, many
lawyers. solicitors and barristers work for years because they see what they feel is an injustice and want to help, Clive Stafford Smith is one such lawyer,

 

[joe jones]

My honest opinion is that if you are not very informed on this case then its a good idea to post questions here as many of the posters are old timers on the letby case and are indeed very well informed on it. Some may indeed post a reply to your questions or requests for information. It would also be a good idea to try and read up on it yourself and build a understanding of the trial and its contents which is quite a task by itself so I may recommend going through it on a charge by charge basis ie starting with baby A and then keeping it to baby A. That way hopefully you could over time build a complete picture of the letby case. Trust me it's extensive. Example I'm an old timer but I didn't fully inform myself about the enquiry afterwards.

I'm sorry if you feel hounded but this is something many feel passionate about. If I can be cheeky I'd say look at ruthbullocks input and check for the current radio silence from that poster.

"I never followed her case or trial very closely, so can't really know what evidence was presented against her"

The answer to this is as stated above, lots and lots of it, so much so it took months in court to go over. I really would recommend educating yourself in it and then posting informed and formulated questions or opinions otherwise you will get beaten down to put it bluntly or in other words bluntly beaten down with a blunt beater by a plank armed poster.

As I have posted previously I have followed case from first local and national news story. Have read all online transcript from trial, so I feel I know most of the information on the public domain

 

[joe jones]

Poor defence ?
The latest podcast from the DM with the two journalists who covered the case day in day out this week described Ben Myers in court during the trial of Letby as like “ a dog with a bone “
Any suggestion her defence was somehow incompetent or poor is staggeringly wide of the mark.
He had the unenviable task of defending Letby of multiple murder and attempted murder charges and he had success in some of the charges being returned as either not guilty or no verdict.
He via her advised her on whether or not to call experts and she didn’t want to put them on the stand.
She KNEW what would happen when they were cross examined.
That’s exactly why the appeal will go absolutely nowhere.
She’s got exactly what she deserves with McDonald steering this leaky ship.

I held my nose and have listened to DM podcasts, I have a visceral aversion to that news organisation but it is important to listen and read (although I my fingers will never click on the website, they don't get a penny from me in click bait advertising revenue,) all the available information, but the DM is only one view of the trial, and IMO it is never to be the sole arbitrator for the truth

 

[joe jones]

True, but one cannot reliably give an opinion about medical cases when not a trained medical expert and state them as facts. Saying that premature babies are 'seriously ill' just because they are 5 weeks early is NOT factual. Then basing an opinion that a convicted killer must be released, upon non-experienced medical beliefs and stating them as facts is problematic. We have members here who are licensed medical professionals working in this field so that is who we rely upon for important information.

It is true that different opinions can be shared here but they cannot be set forth as if they are factual statements. And people get upset because Nurse Letby has been fairly and reliably convicted of some very gruesome murders upon innocent babies. Most of us are relieved that she is safely locked away from us now.

So when someone comes along and says she should be released, based upon erroneous medical opinions, some of us take on the challenge to refute those claims.

My opinions are not erroneous, neither are yours, they are opinions based on what I have read and researched as I am sure are yours, once again I do not make any personal comments about anybody, I can very easily hold a different opinion to somebody without disparaging that opinion,

 

[joe jones]

If it was true that Letby had an ineffective, inept defense counsel, and was convicted even though the evidence was faulty and thin, and she was innocent, then it would not be difficult to find reputable barristers to fight for her. IMO

How many people do you know who work for free. just getting up to speed on this vast, complex case would take a huge amount of time, unless it is live legal proceedings such as appellate proceedings there is no legal aid, and I doubt she or her family can afford to pay a solicitor or barristers fees.
There are solicitors and barristers who do the work for free but they do it alongside there fee paying work. Some chambers also provide free legal work which is a credit to them, so I imagine there are few crusaders coming to her rescue from the legal field.

 

[joe jones]

If it was true that Letby had an ineffective, inept defense counsel, and was convicted even though the evidence was faulty and thin, and she was innocent, then it would not be difficult to find reputable barristers to fight for her. IMO

How many people do you know who work for free. just getting up to speed on this vast, complex case would take a huge amount of time, unless it is live legal proceedings such as appellate proceedings there is no legal aid, and I doubt she or her family can afford to pay a solicitor or barristers fees.
There are solicitors and barristers who do the work for free but they do it alongside there fee paying work. Some chambers also provide free legal work which is a credit to them, so I imagine there are few crusaders coming to her rescue from the legal field

I'll give you some tips on how to read the information you will see in the media. 1, as with all media don't believe everything you see. 2. Understand that allot what you see will be basically a shortened version of a broader base of information, example I've yet to see one article that gave a really in depth picture of any one case in particular let alone all of them. 3. There's plenty in the media that isn't accurate so preferably don't use it to build a picture of the trial. 4 plenty of articles make a bigger deal of things than they should recently we've seen plenty saying there's lots of doubt when there isn't not really.

FYI a letbyist is someone who thinks she is innocent and are often willing to die on that hill. Most if not all on this thread are opposed to that idea.

I think she is innocent but am not a Letbyist, I have come to that conclusion all by myself as I am sure you have to your opinion, and I don't feel the need to use a disparaging term to lump all the guilty people under
I tend not to rely on any one story in media, be it papers, blogs, TV news, social media etc, the transcript is the best source I find, plus reports from, experts where there are commonalities and differences,

 

[Marantz4250b]

I held my nose and have listened to DM podcasts, I have a visceral aversion to that news organisation but it is important to listen and read (although I my fingers will never click on the website, they don't get a penny from me in click bait advertising revenue,) all the available information, but the DM is only one view of the trial, and IMO it is never to be the sole arbitrator for the truth

The DM is a superb publication as far as criminal trial reporting goes. Their coverage of the Letby trial was by far the best, most in depth and even handed of all the media outlets. It's "trendy" to bash them due to them being perceived as right wing but people tar all their reporting with the same brush which is not right.

Media outlets don't get to express a "view" one way or another as regards ongoing criminal trials in this country. That's a potential contempt of court. The DM's reporting was factual and very thorough, far much so than other outlets.

 

[joltz]

Maybe he is doing it because he feels a calling to, many
lawyers. solicitors and barristers work for years because they see what they feel is an injustice and want to help, Clive Stafford Smith is one such lawyer,

Is that the same calling he felt when he took on the cases of Michael Stone and Ben Geen. Surprised he didn't bag Colin Norris.

JMO

 

[Marantz4250b]

I think she is innocent but am not a Letbyist, I have come to that conclusion all by myself as I am sure you have to your opinion, and I don't feel the need to use a disparaging term to lump all the guilty people under
I tend not to rely on any one story in media, be it papers, blogs, TV news, social media etc, the transcript is the best source I find, plus reports from, experts where there are commonalities and differences,

Yet you haven't produced anything which contradicts her convictions. No "new and compelling" evidence or serious procedural errors which might lean towards an unfair conviction. Nothing.

Not one single person, not MM, not his panel of "experts", no one, has produced anything of substance to refute the evidence presented at trial.

 

[Tortoise]

Honestly! Let's do away with jury trials and cross-examination of experts in a court of law eh. Disregard two juries who were sure, and put a vote to the public who can decide without any new "expert" meeting any legal standards. Be done with the KCs' fees.

 

[Anxala]

There is definitely something behind his actions but I'm not sure it's money. I mean, just where is the money in these cases? It's not as though these people he's fighting for have pots of cash to throw at him; Lucy Letby certainly doesn't and her parents are far from wealthy and have already reportedly spent a fortune to be close to the trial in Manchester which is miles away from where they live.

He's not earning from any public funds as legal aid won't be paying him anything as there is no active prosecution.

It's all very puzzling as to why he's doing this and how he's funding it.

Perhaps he's being privately funded by those who support his bid to overturn this grave injustice...

 

[Marantz4250b]

Perhaps he's being privately funded by those who support his bid to overturn this grave injustice...

Ah yes, that'll be it. She'll have a legion of millionaires behind her.

They they are - cleverly disguising their outstanding combined wealth by cunningly dressing as train-spotters and middle-aged "Student Gwant" (Google it) type characters. They'll have parked the Bugatti's a few streets away so as to not arouse suspicion.

Demonstrators Take To Streets in Support of Lucy Letby - Healthcare Newsdesk

Written by Harry Turnbull Demonstrators in Liverpool yesterday turned out to support Lucy Letby, the nurse convicted of murdering seven babies and attempting to murder seven others. The group calling…

healthcare-newsdesk.co.uk

 

[Sweeper2000]

How many people do you know who work for free. just getting up to speed on this vast, complex case would take a huge amount of time, unless it is live legal proceedings such as appellate proceedings there is no legal aid, and I doubt she or her family can afford to pay a solicitor or barristers fees.
There are solicitors and barristers who do the work for free but they do it alongside there fee paying work. Some chambers also provide free legal work which is a credit to them, so I imagine there are few crusaders coming to her rescue from the legal field

I think she is innocent but am not a Letbyist, I have come to that conclusion all by myself as I am sure you have to your opinion, and I don't feel the need to use a disparaging term to lump all the guilty people under
I tend not to rely on any one story in media, be it papers, blogs, TV news, social media etc, the transcript is the best source I find, plus reports from, experts where there are commonalities and differences,

Could you explain why you think she us innocent on any one case? Say for example baby e. Your reasons and supporting info.