GUILTY UK - Rebecca Watts, 16, Bristol, 19 Feb 2015 #9

[Tortoise]

no chance of me moving from my seat today then. I'd better visit the bathroom now

(and stock up on the snacks)

 

[Alyce]

The Bristol Post is reporting via Whatsapp that NM is "expected to take the stand today". Wow...!

ETA: "Our court reporter says Nathan Matthews is expected to take the stand today to give evidence. It will be a big moment in the trial".

Oh wow indeed _ I did not see that coming. Of the four, I thought he would have been the least likely to do so.

 

[Alyce]

While we're waiting ....... am just relooking at the pics of NM and SH shopping and the short video clip.
Re their child.... I dont see any evidence of a buggy which I would have expected ( child would be just 2 at this time ) so looks to me like child not with them.
So, the question is, do they have a child minder ? on the evidence we have heard so far of no friends, SH not working so no huge amounts of cash available, seems unlikely.
( am thinking along lines of could child minder be witness for SH character etc )

 

[Cherwell]

I don't think it's offensive, but I think people were finding the impersonal use of the terms rather grinding. These people are not anonymous numbers in a blind study, so no real need to refer to them using anything other than their names.

Exactly. Plus there are more than two defendants in this case, so all the more reason to use names or initials to make it clear who we are referring to.

 

[YidArmyRach]

The Bristol Post is reporting via Whatsapp that NM is "expected to take the stand today". Wow...!

ETA: "Our court reporter says Nathan Matthews is expected to take the stand today to give evidence. It will be a big moment in the trial".

Wonder if he will change his story at all - having had SH slate him and their relationship, and saying that she had wished that he would meet someone else and leave her. If he was as controlling and dominating as has been suggested, I can't imagine he would have enjoyed that. Obviously that is if he is covering up any involvement on her part.

 

[still-searching]

While we're waiting ....... am just relooking at the pics of NM and SH shopping and the short video clip.
Re their child.... I dont see any evidence of a buggy which I would have expected ( child would be just 2 at this time ) so looks to me like child not with them.
So, the question is, do they have a child minder ? on the evidence we have heard so far of no friends, SH not working so no huge amounts of cash available, seems unlikely.
( am thinking along lines of could child minder be witness for SH character etc )

Maybe at a nursery? I'm not familiar with childcare, but don't parents get "free hours" of nursery in the UK?

 

[Cherwell]

I've forgotten the order of events here. When they went shopping, had they already re-established contact with SH's mother? If so, perhaps the little girl was with her. I vaguely remember, back when that house was first in the news, that neighbours mentioned seeing an older woman and a child.

 

[Tealgrove]

Nathan will give evidence today? Wow! Based on his confession and his emotional and unstable behaviour while giving the confession, this should be very interesting. Hmm....I wonder if he's had enough of Shauna and will turn the tables on her after she said all that bad stuff about him? This could be very interesting indeed.

 

[Tortoise]

I've forgotten the order of events here. When they went shopping, had they already re-established contact with SH's mother? If so, perhaps the little girl was with her. I vaguely remember, back when that house was first in the news, that neighbours mentioned seeing an older woman and a child.

No, the shopping trips were all before they went over there for their first visit on 23rd Feb.

 

[kimlo]

Maybe at a nursery? I'm not familiar with childcare, but don't parents get "free hours" of nursery in the UK?

The child would get 15 hours of free childcare the term after they turned 2 because she was claiming as a single unemployed parent. So it would depend on when their birthday had been.

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

 

[Warwicks]

Have I missed the Prosecution laying down any statement by AG or her parents who would have dropped her back home after the hospital appointment?
From an emotional point of view, I would have liked to hear AG's interpretation of her relationship with RW, and from an evidence point of view I'd like to know whether AG felt that NM and SH behaviour that afternoon was unusual in any way.

 

[Alyce]

Maybe at a nursery? I'm not familiar with childcare, but don't parents get "free hours" of nursery in the UK?

They do, but only Monday to Friday and this was a week end

 

[Alyce]

I've forgotten the order of events here. When they went shopping, had they already re-established contact with SH's mother? If so, perhaps the little girl was with her. I vaguely remember, back when that house was first in the news, that neighbours mentioned seeing an older woman and a child.

No they didnt make contact until Monday 24 Feb and the shopping trips were over the week end Feb 22 and 23

 

[YidArmyRach]

Oh dear, I have a feeling this will not go well for him when it comes to cross examination.

What has he got to lose though? He's admitted killing her - even a manslaughter conviction can bring a life sentence, and the way he disposed of her body afterwards wouldn't suggest a particularly short sentence even if his original story was believed. I'm not sure he can say anything which would make him sound worse than he already does.

I wonder if he wants to give evidence to defend himself against the allegations made by SH as to how he treated her?

 

[Alyce]

Have I missed the Prosecution laying down any statement by AG or her parents who would have dropped her back home after the hospital appointment?
From an emotional point of view, I would have liked to hear AG's interpretation of her relationship with RW, and from an evidence point of view I'd like to know whether AG felt that NM and SH behaviour that afternoon was unusual in any way.

I have not seen anything and agree, it would be very good to have a statement from all of them, AG in particular.


and , slightly off topic ! :wagon:

 

[YidArmyRach]

The child would get 15 hours of free childcare the term after they turned 2 because she was claiming as a single unemployed parent. So it would depend on when their birthday had been.

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

Single parent who was actually living with the father of her child and was expecting two more children by him.

Off topic, but I hope she gets done for benefit fraud. People like her are the reason there is so much hate of anyone on benefits. It doesn't help the genuine claimants who get labelled as scroungers, when people like this screw the system instead of making the effort to support themselves, let alone lie to claim more money.

Sorry, but it makes me mad when genuine single parents are threatened with cuts to the benefits they receive because they go out to work and try to support themselves.

 

[YidArmyRach]

these are my thoughts on what the jury will ponder, as evidence of her guilt -

1. being at the house after checking Becky was at home, on her suggestion (to return the cake tin) and not having a plausible reason for staying all day
2. order of 2 stun guns - more than one person requires
3. a dubious reason for not hearing anything - she could have smoked in the conservatory as it was raining and she's more than doubled the time it takes to smoke. feeding rabbit could be untrue.
4. if she was in the kitchen when she heard stomping and the door slam that can't have been NM coming down with Becky's body.
5. I haven't heard evidence of either of them leaving DNA on the body.
6. Becky had a lot of injuries before she died. was it 40 areas of bruising? that is a long fight and struggle with plenty of banging around and no doubt she would have been screeching her head off. the suffocation would take at least 5 minutes. the struggle, let's estimate another 5-10 minutes? the realisation that Becky is now dead, not planned for surely, so a pause for thought what to do now with what's happened. There is airborne blood on the spare room door frame and the forensic expert said they are not sure if the screwdriver stab wounds to the neck occurred before or after death. There was Becky's blood on her onesie. My guess is that the killer(s) did not know Becky had died and thought she may have just been rendered unconscious. To make sure of this, he/they laid her on a duvet cover on the landing and used a screwdriver to stab her. Her heart had stopped so there wasn't a circulation and she didn't bleed heavily. The plunging of the screwdriver caused the airborne blood spots. There is no concrete evidence of this happening but it is a possibility and if it did happen that's another 5-10 minutes. He/they then went to get the car boot liner to wrap her in to stop a blood trail in the house. Becky's blood and hair was found on the boot liner. Carrying Becky's body down the stairs to the car another 5 minutes to get there and back inside the house. Taking Becky's coat, laptop, phone, tablet (planning it and doing it) 5 minutes. Going around to make sure there is no sign of a struggle upstairs and straightening out her bed covers, washing blood off hands and possibly clothes before Anjie comes back, 5-10 minutes. Going back up to stomp down the stairs. I don't think all that could have occurred while SH was having a .
7. NM not looking dishevelled or injured, calmly playing a game on his tablet after all this. really? he has fibromyalgia, he would have been kicked about by Becky, she had massive swelling and bruising on the front of one shin. I think he would have been in pain after such strenuous activity, to restrain and suffocate a live person who is fighting for their life and breath.
8. Highly suspicious activity and totally unbelievable ignorance in the days and week following. If she had found out about it afterwards she didn't let the police know when she was in the safe sanctuary of the police station. That in itself casts doubt on her story about what happened on the morning of Becky's death.
9. Her DNA must have been in Becky's room but they wouldn't use that as evidence because she was a regular visitor to the house and it could have got there anytime. It's just not in Becky's blood like NM's was.

I think she may yet be convicted for murder. And there is a possibility NM will tell all.

Don't forget, she was also present when the items used for the disposal of Becky's body were purchased.

 

[iclaudia]

I agree that NM taking the stand can't do anything to hurt him. His primary motivation may well still be to protect SH so that one of them can keep their child so he may in fact do what he can to back up her assertions regarding his abusive behaviour towards her.

 

[Edinlass]

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=qWCwj2K8WZU

SH 3rd police video. Looks a bit worse for wear.

Did I hear incorrectly or does the police officer mistakenly call her becky at the end? Shocking if so.

 

[Clio]

I've forgotten the order of events here. When they went shopping, had they already re-established contact with SH's mother? If so, perhaps the little girl was with her. I vaguely remember, back when that house was first in the news, that neighbours mentioned seeing an older woman and a child.

No they didnt make contact until Monday 24 Feb and the shopping trips were over the week end Feb 22 and 23

Contact with SH mother was 4:40pm on Monday 23rd and yes the joint shopping trips were at the weekend prior to that.

Fri February 20:
12:00pm NM gets message from a friend saying he needs help. NM leaves SH with AG at Crown Hill for ~ 4 hours (from SH’s statement on 28/2)
12.20pm - NM buys two bottles of drain cleaner from the Rajani superstore in Bristol.
12.51pm - NM purchases a MacAllister circular power saw, face masks, gloves and goggles from B&Q in Horfield, Bristol.
2.18pm SH texts that memory cards and PS4 stickers have arrived
3.10pm - SH texts NM: 'What time do you finish work LOL? Hugs and kisses'.
4pm NM returns to Crown Hill after helping "friend"
4pm - Becky's father reports the teenager missing to police.
5:30pm SH puts message on FB “Hi, can you keep an eye out for Becky Watts and if you see her message me because she is missing.”
6.25pm - Police arrive at Becky's home and speak to Mr and Mrs G, NM and SH. The couple claim they heard Becky leave the previous morning.
 
NM/SH Return to CML. SH smells bleach and NM tells her the toilet is blocked and she cannot use the bathroom (From SH statement after arrest)
8.45pm - A Chinese takeaway is ordered to Cotton Mill Lane.
9pm - A device of NM and SH searches 'Do you want to hide a body?' on YouTube.
Late Evening NM waits for SH to go to sleep, then takes bag into bathroom and puts body in bath. NM pours drain cleaner down the toilet and locks the bathroom door. (from NM’s statement at 22:24 on 2/3)

Sat February 21:
12:15pm CCTV shows NM/SH go to Asda in Bedminster and buy black bags, rubble sacks, rubber gloves, bleach and three rolls of cling film. They purchase £20 of electricity from a local shop.

Sun February 22: NM/SH buy black rubble sacks, tape and a sponge from a 99p store and a Wilko at the Broadmead shopping centre in Bristol city centre, then tape and cling film at Sainsbury's in Brislington.

Mon February 23: Police attempt to enter Cotton Mill Lane but no one answers the door.
4.38pm - A mobile phone belonging to SH and NM searches for 'Find Becky Watts' on Google.
4.40pm - SH rings her estranged mother, LD, and stepfather KS and arranges to visit their home in Wilton Close, Southmead, saying they’d be there about 30-40 minutes later.
5:37pm CCTV of NM/SH at McDonalds
5:40pm NM asks KS to tell anyone who is looking for them that they (NM/SH/KS/LD) are all going out for a meal later that evening.
6pm - Detectives return to Cotton Mill Lane but NM and SH are not at home. They later speak to the pair at Wilton Close.
SH agrees police can search their home the following day.