UK UK - Suzy Lamplugh, 25, Fulham, 28 Jul 1986 #5

[lee sumner]

Maybe 'expensive lifestyle' meant that she had unexplained income as her earnings were not in proportion to her lavish outgoings but she wasn't in debt.

When it was said she was 'living beyond her means' then what I'd like to know was in what way was that proven - did she have debts or loans? - or were people noticing that there's no way she could be surviving on rental income from her lodger and her estate agency earnings alone?

Has this always been a hint that she was earning on the side somehow? As opposed to a suggestion that she was flying by the seat of her pants.

there is a lot we dont know. SLP comes across as being quite mysterious, and as you probably know, they thought she was on the game. what made them think she was a prostitute or escort.

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

there is a lot we dont know. SLP comes across as being quite mysterious, and as you probably know, they thought she was on the game. what made them think she was a prostitute or escort.

Just because a woman has extra money and an off the charts social life doesn't mean she's a prostitute or escort IMO.

She could have been moving around cocaine. She could have been giving insider secrets to property speculators. She could have been matching people up with dodgy estate agency valuers (believe me they were very real, I used to work for one - they submit either stupidly low or stupidly high Report and Valuations to mortgage lenders). She could have been helping money launderers pass off their money into real estate or helping overseas people bring their money in unlawfully (still happens in estate agency even today). That's where the big money would be, taking percentages or one off cash payments.

Being on the game is pretty hard work for not much money unless she was the sort liked a man to take her 'shopping' for jewellery and stuff. I think people would have noticed that sort of thing? Esp her flat mate.

 

[lee sumner]

Why would she sell perfectly good bricks and mortar and not rent it out whilst it gained in value every year? That's what most people in the estate agency trade would know to do. Once you've got a decent property, you hold on to it. You only 'flip' properties if you bought them in poor condition, did them up, and then sell so you can go on do the same again.

Was she in serious debt to someone? Someone who felt it wasn't looking like they were going to recover their money after all?

i thought the same. why was she selling after living there only 2 yrs. you are correct, why not hold on to it as its value goes up. its weird. what do you think. debt maybe,

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

i thought the same. why was she selling after living there only 2 yrs. you are correct, why not hold on to it as its value goes up. its weird. what do you think. debt maybe,

Maybe she wasn't going to sell but wanted shot of the lodger and it was an excuse?

Or maybe her parents had said to her 'you're over-extending yourself with all these expenses' and she made an excuse that she's going to sell her property and downsize if push comes to shove.

Maybe she had her heart set on a way more fancy and expensive location and couldn't get the mortgage lending without selling her current property in order to have a hefty deposit but all the same, more evidence she was making grand plans and playing with big money, not downsizing or being forced to sell. Also, anyone in estate agency knows that's not the way to go about things.

 

[WestLondoner]

i thought the same. why was she selling after living there only 2 yrs. you are correct, why not hold on to it as its value goes up. its weird. what do you think. debt maybe,

Leverage, in a word. If property is going up 10% a year then you want to own as much as you can. If you are borrowing 90% of the price you are in effect doubling your (own) money every year. You couldn't afford not to buy the priciest place possible.

You could not let property out in 1986. There was no such thing as a buy to let mortgage until 1996 and the law allowing shorthold tenancies did not come in until 1988. Before then you were stuck with the Landlord & Tenant Act which meant you couldn't get your property back. No mortgage lender would allow you to let on that basis.

I think the speculation about SJL being on the game came from the fact that DL tried to suppress evidence of her having had a sex life at all. DL would have regarded any form of extra marital sex as disgraceful, hence her getting the police, AL and others to suppress what she got up to. It could have been completely innocuous - she was pretty and had slept with a few blokes - or she could have been a courtesan about town, but either way DL would have been horrified.

 

[Pinkizzy]

It would be interesting to hear the true version of events from AL

 

[Terryb808]

Just because a woman has extra money and an off the charts social life doesn't mean she's a prostitute or escort IMO.

She could have been moving around cocaine. She could have been giving insider secrets to property speculators. She could have been matching people up with dodgy estate agency valuers (believe me they were very real, I used to work for one - they submit either stupidly low or stupidly high Report and Valuations to mortgage lenders). She could have been helping money launderers pass off their money into real estate or helping overseas people bring their money in unlawfully (still happens in estate agency even today). That's where the big money would be, taking percentages or one off cash payments.

Being on the game is pretty hard work for not much money unless she was the sort liked a man to take her 'shopping' for jewellery and stuff. I think people would have noticed that sort of thing? Esp her flat mate.

Of the many possible scenarios related to SJL’s disappearance this fits with RT the car enthusiasts account of seeing a BMW and two white Ford Fiestas in SR.
Additionally EH (the elderly lady) said the saw two men sitting in a large dark coloured saloon, looking straight ahead and not speaking.
It isn’t inconceivable that RT’s BMW & EH’s large saloon are one and the same.
In this scenario SJL was targeted by several perpetrators and not just by JC & JT.
Whatever she was into resulting in the need for her to be silenced very urgently.

 

[Terryb808]

It would be interesting to hear the true version of events from AL

Yes it would, but if DV’s account in his book is correct you’d need to have already worked out what happened to SJL before he’d open up.

 

[Pinkizzy]

Who is JT?

 

[Officer Dibble]

I come back to the fact that CV in the pub, if you look at the AS book, or his wife, on the phone, told SL to come at 6pm to the POW to pick up her things. This is overlooked.

She had a 6pm apt in the diary and wouldn't have agreed to the time for this reason. Asking when the apt was made, the 6pm, would have been important.This was later glossed over and become the 'evening' or similar, but someone who turned up early for every apt she'd ever made would not have suggested a time to CV which was when she was expected elsewhere. After a year the pub narrative was effectively altered by CV. AS expounds around this.

This has always niggled me! It just didn't ring true to me. JMO MOO

 

[Officer Dibble]

SL Doc last night and JD mentioning intel that JC had access to a BMW at time in the hostel. Brought to mind:

1. Car buff (RT) said that the BMW he saw outside 37s Shorrolds was likely early to mid 70s - similar to 4 door 518 . He saw the BMW between 12:30 and 1pm. Navy blue. Older BMWs, said police at time, like this one were distinctive and relatively unusual.

2. Jogger witness who came forward AT THE TIME, said JD, to a pop up, temporary police station in Stevenage and gave evidence that was later lost or not passed on. RE: BMW.

He said he saw a BMW with someone pressing a hand on the horn, poss latterly realised left hand drive, and woman passenger was under duress, fighting, laughing or screaming. Poss he realised this by position of man and woman in car and 'fight' taking place? Near Stevenage Road.

The police were checking ALL owners re: relevant BMWs but abandoned this project half way through, apparently. It strikes me that as BOTH BMWs were relatively unusual, one older model that the police said was rear and one (LHD), could they have been one and the same?

3. IF you add in the man that saw a 'right ruck' and another that saw a row around the barrier on Stevenage Road, possibly a picture emerges. A woman in trouble at least. We know the BMW WAS there, (older one in Shorrolds) did police appeal for owner to come forward? Couple in the van that had to avoid an earlier swerving fiesta too, if credible evidence and witness. Makes for a pattern.

You mention a SL doc last night. What channel please so I can find it. Thanks.

 

[Terryb808]

This might be of interest to some who post here.

Who is Jill Dando and what happened to her? Details explored ahead of Netflix's true crime documentary — Sportskeeda

Who Killed Jill Dando is an upcoming docuseries from Netflix that explores the mysterious murder of famous British broadcaster Jill Dando. The series will examine one of Britain's most well-known murder investigations through interviews with members of Dando's family, reporters, and investigators.

apple.news

 

[WestLondoner]

This has always niggled me! It just didn't ring true to me. JMO MOO

I think it's an important point. If she were contacted by the bank midmorning and spoke to the pub to arrange a pickup, she'd have had to call back to rearrange this when the request for a 6pm viewing came in. If that 6pm viewing appointment already existed before she spoke to the pub, then we know she never intended to go there at 6pm at all. In the latter case she presumably intended to go at lunchtime all along.

CV's account at the time was that she was to come that evening and never turned up. He could not then have known she wasn't in a position to come over that evening, in which case when did she really arrange to come, and what happened to her? This could be why, a year later, he became vague about the time and introduced new information about supposed phone calls.

Of course this is MOO and there are other explanations for CV's accounts, but this must be part of DV's thinking.

 

[lee sumner]

Maybe she wasn't going to sell but wanted shot of the lodger and it was an excuse?

Or maybe her parents had said to her 'you're over-extending yourself with all these expenses' and she made an excuse that she's going to sell her property and downsize if push comes to shove.

Maybe she had her heart set on a way more fancy and expensive location and couldn't get the mortgage lending without selling her current property in order to have a hefty deposit but all the same, more evidence she was making grand plans and playing with big money, not downsizing or being forced to sell. Also, anyone in estate agency knows that's not the way to go about

 

[lee sumner]

she must have discussed her plans with her parents or friends. NB would also know.

 

[lee sumner]

I still believe she went to Shorrolds Road that day as there has never been any suggestion she would make up false appointments to skive off work but if they did go though the house at SR it is strange no finger prints were found.

same here. i also think SLP went to shorrolds rd that day. i think she had the keys and paperwork.

 

[Salah11]

I never knew that it may be suspected she was on the Game.

She had a pretty hectic job so that seems crazy to me.

If she did like to sleep around I can see why her family would want to protect her image to an extent as back then she would have been highly judged and torn apart. It would have been bad enough she had been murdered let alone the tabloids then calling her a Sl**.

It must of been a sign of the times that her parents could sway a police investigation that’s insane and they should have been allowed nowhere near it. IMO

 

[lee sumner]

Leverage, in a word. If property is going up 10% a year then you want to own as much as you can. If you are borrowing 90% of the price you are in effect doubling your (own) money every year. You couldn't afford not to buy the priciest place possible.

You could not let property out in 1986. There was no such thing as a buy to let mortgage until 1996 and the law allowing shorthold tenancies did not come in until 1988. Before then you were stuck with the Landlord & Tenant Act which meant you couldn't get your property back. No mortgage lender would allow you to let on that basis.

I think the speculation about SJL being on the game came from the fact that DL tried to suppress evidence of her having had a sex life at all. DL would have regarded any form of extra marital sex as disgraceful, hence her getting the police, AL and others to suppress what she got up to. It could have been completely innocuous - she was pretty and had slept with a few blokes - or she could have been a courtesan about town, but either way DL would have been horrified.

thanks for the info. you seem to know a lot about the property game.

 

[Officer Dibble]

I never knew that it may be suspected she was on the Game.

She had a pretty hectic job so that seems crazy to me.

If she did like to sleep around I can see why her family would want to protect her image to an extent as back then she would have been highly judged and torn apart. It would have been bad enough she had been murdered let alone the tabloids then calling her a Sl**.

It must of been a sign of the times that her parents could sway a police investigation that’s insane and they should have been allowed nowhere near it. IMO

Cocaine was rife in 1986 in London. I knew a very well spoken young woman who used to supply Middle Eastern men in very rich neighbourhoods in London. You wouldn't expect it of her. She also had a Sugar Daddy. There was a lot of money around in the 80's. However, being on the game just seems outdated for that period and a bit typecast tbh. MOO

 

[Terryb808]

Cocaine was rife in 1986 in London. I knew a very well spoken young woman who used to supply Middle Eastern men in very rich neighbourhoods in London. You wouldn't expect it of her. She also had a Sugar Daddy. There was a lot of money around in the 80's. However, being on the game just seems outdated for that period and a bit typecast tbh. MOO

Agreed, SJL was adventurous and it does seem a much easier (if risky) was to make money on the side.
The question is did her possibly involvement in the drug trade result in her death.
Like all the possibilities in this case, there’s no evidence to support this scenario.