Found Deceased NY - Jennifer Ramsaran, 36, Chenango County, 11 Dec 2012 - # 4

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Regarding WebEx Conf someone mentioned above.. I do WebEx quite often. There are generally two options for WebEx Training, login and dial in or login and use a PC microphone. My office PC microphone is awful, so I usually do login/dial in and put my phone on mute. During the sessions I rarely speak. I login, type in chat or do a voice report by phone that I am present and request the PDF transcript when done, in case I missed something. No one knows if I am logged in and at my PC or not, they only know that I am logged in. And to be honest about 50% of the time during my WebEx training sessions I am in and out of the office doing other things that require my attention; agents who need my help, clients who request me, etc. So personally for me a WebEx training session is not a good alibi.
 
What is the closest city that has a population of homeless, with more available shelters for them? Could Jennifer have chosen to literally abandoned her life that way, if despondent?
( not that a shelter will disclose that a missing person utilizes their services- at most they will tell that person to contact LE in the area they are missing from...if they wish)

I wish LE would disclose if her purse, or rather, any ID is missing- it sure would help with 'out of the box' thinking
 
Gosh, I hope they have checked shelters by now...I thought that was one of the first things done with a missing adult.
 
I don't know Clucian, what the LE protocol is ...I was once told by a higher up with a large ministry in Atlanta, if I provided a flyer of a person, and that person was there, the most they could do would be to ask that person to contact LE regarding their status, if they chose to.

(ETA that higher up is a personal friend, I do not doubt their word)
 
sreshowtime said:
I don't know Clucian, what the LE protocol is ...I was once told by a higher up with a large ministry in Atlanta, if I provided a flyer of a person, and that person was there, the most they could do would be to ask that person to contact LE regarding their status, if they chose to.

(ETA that higher up is a personal friend, I do not doubt their word)
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I would really hope that they would find some "off the record" way to let LE know that a missing person was alive and well in their shelter. I'm not saying whether or not they'd do this, b/c I don't know, but I would sure HOPE they would. It would be pretty bad to allow resources to be expended looking for a person, when someone knew for a fact (or even thought) that this person was alive.

On the other hand, I'm sure there are tons of people who don't even know Jennifer is missing.
 
Angelonline said:
Regarding WebEx Conf someone mentioned above.. I do WebEx quite often. There are generally two options for WebEx Training, login and dial in or login and use a PC microphone. My office PC microphone is awful, so I usually do login/dial in and put my phone on mute. During the sessions I rarely speak. I login, type in chat or do a voice report by phone that I am present and request the PDF transcript when done, in case I missed something. No one knows if I am logged in and at my PC or not, they only know that I am logged in. And to be honest about 50% of the time during my WebEx training sessions I am in and out of the office doing other things that require my attention; agents who need my help, clients who request me, etc. So personally for me a WebEx training session is not a good alibi.
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THanks for this info, Angel. Sounds like this kind of computer work would provide the perfect alibi for someone who was off doing other things and wanted people to think that his alibi was rock-solid for a prolonged period of time.

Thanks also to whoever explained above that he could have been logged in from his phone, while the IP address made it appear that he was at home (I think I understood that correctly).

I believe it's been stated by GR/Lavanda that Jennifer left for the mall at 10:30am. Is his time accounted for between the time the kids left for school to the time she supposedly left for the mall? I somehow doubt it.
 
JENNIFER, if by chance you are out there some where, and should stumble across this thread about you, please, please consider calling Law Enforcement at 607-334-2000 and let them hear from you. If you choose to, it can remain confidential and they must respect your wishes to remain 'missing', but can say you ARE located. Please do something.
 
Lavanda Dolce said:
I've narrowed to 2 "greater" possibilities:

One: Despondent and left; afraid of peers/family to come forward
Two: carjacked (possibly by multiple people.)
She goes to use her phone..they snatch it...turn it off...took her somewhere...harmed her. drove around all night or stayed somewhere else with her in van. Now need plan on what to do with her...in morning after their drugged craze wore off....drives down route 23
Pulls into mud by dirt mound...tosses phone...phone hits rock which turns back on and lands in mud to cushion glass. Intentions to put her in the water..realizes that it is not a good place as water is clearly visible to bottom (you can see all the rocks at bottom) and decide not a good place after all...peels out...mud splashes..drives further down road...2 or 3 other ponds between the two places....maybe placed her in one of those that was not as clear... and finally abandons van at apartment and maybe van not even abandoned that day. Maybe not until day after.

We drove many roads and none were thick with mud. Ironically the only mud place was where the cell was found. (and one other possible road near Morris, NY called LIEB Road was muddy. No others...not enough to have vehicle look like mine did....and hers.)
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BBM

With all due respect, I just want to clarify- the theory is that the iPhone hit a rock which turned it on and landed in mud which cushioned its fall after that?
 
Lavanda Dolce said:
<rs>

the majority of men will tell you that if a wife truly let her husband have an "affair" with someone else...would he?
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BBM
Please cite the statistics concerning how many women in this country
would truly let their husband have an affair?
 
The 'there's no doubt in my mind that we're not going to see her again' statement weirdos me out well and truly.

I understand that it's not what he meant to say, in that that would be crazy, especially with the part about giving them hope. I don't buy the double negative intention 'we're not not going to see her again' so I figure either he was planning to go with 'I don't believe we're not going to see her again' or something like that but tried to change it to sound more forceful and messed up, or else it's a weird Freudian slip. Either way I think it's weird that the news left it in there, surely they spotted it as strange and they could've used a different part of his statement, or had him repeat it in a way that doesn't sound like he's absolutely certain his wife is dead?

Lavanda, your statement about having changed your mind and suspecting foul play more is interesting to me- are you able to elaborate on why you now think this?

Also think its interesting that we've had reports of zero phone coverage in the spot the phone was found, and that Jen wasn't known to have a protective case.

As to the statement about husbands and affairs, mine has enough trouble dealing with one woman, I think two would melt his brain, but in general I have to disagree on a feminist level! I know women AND men who have had affairs and I would say its not about gender, it's about ego, and being a jerk, which either gender is more than capable of. While I know some people DO make 'arrangements' within a marriage or relationship, IMO these arrangements are usually very honest between partners - so I believe that if this were the case (which I felt was implied?) then Jen would definitely have been aware of the affair- but nobody has confirmed that she was. I also would think it would be rare for one of these 'arrangements' to involve a close friend.

Just, these statements about it being 'complex' bother me- relationships are always complex, and even more so when you add a third person. But without Jennifer present to speak to these complexities, it to me, like others have said, does seem deeply inappropriate to carry on close personal relations with someone you recently had an an affair with when your wife is missing. And I agree that as the kids grow up, then no matter the outcome of Jennifer's disappearance, that's going to be very difficult to deal with.

Rant over.
 
fringles said:
The 'there's no doubt in my mind that we're not going to see her again' statement weirdos me out well and truly.

I understand that it's not what he meant to say, in that that would be crazy, especially with the part about giving them hope. I don't buy the double negative intention 'we're not not going to see her again' so I figure either he was planning to go with 'I don't believe we're not going to see her again' or something like that but tried to change it to sound more forceful and messed up, or else it's a weird Freudian slip. Either way I think it's weird that the news left it in there, surely they spotted it as strange and they could've used a different part of his statement, or had him repeat it in a way that doesn't sound like he's absolutely certain his wife is dead?

Lavanda, your statement about having changed your mind and suspecting foul play more is interesting to me- are you able to elaborate on why you now think this?

Also think its interesting that we've had reports of zero phone coverage in the spot the phone was found, and that Jen wasn't known to have a protective case.

As to the statement about husbands and affairs, mine has enough trouble dealing with one woman, I think two would melt his brain, but in general I have to disagree on a feminist level! I know women AND men who have had affairs and I would say its not about gender, it's about ego, and being a jerk, which either gender is more than capable of. While I know some people DO make 'arrangements' within a marriage or relationship, IMO these arrangements are usually very honest between partners - so I believe that if this were the case (which I felt was implied?) then Jen would definitely have been aware of the affair- but nobody has confirmed that she was. I also would think it would be rare for one of these 'arrangements' to involve a close friend.

Just, these statements about it being 'complex' bother me- relationships are always complex, and even more so when you add a third person. But without Jennifer present to speak to these complexities, it to me, like others have said, does seem deeply inappropriate to carry on close personal relations with someone you recently had an an affair with when your wife is missing. And I agree that as the kids grow up, then no matter the outcome of Jennifer's disappearance, that's going to be very difficult to deal with.

Rant over.
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I went to bold the parts I agreed with, then realised I was bolding everything!
Well said my friend! well said. :rocker:
 
Janeumayer said:
Not to sound disrespectful, but how many carjackings have occurred in that area in recent years?
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ZERO. I truly believe that if the police thought that she was "carjacked" they would divulge the information to serve as a warning to the general public. This is Norwich, for God sake, not Syracuse or Rochester or Buffalo or NYC. Carjackings simply are not common in our small town.

The comment about the phone being tossed, hitting a rock and turning back on? A bit of a stretch, IMO as you have to "hold" the power button for a few seconds for the phone to turn on or off. We don't have many rocks around here with that kind of dexterity.

I'm not saying that "the husband did it", but if she did meet with foul play, it's my humble opinion that the culprit is someone she knew.... not some random person.

I truly believe that, again, if local LE believed that she was harmed/abducted randomly they would divulge this theory to serve as a warning to all of our local people. If they thought that she left or was harmed by someone close to her, they would keep this quiet and build a case. And in JR's case, they are being quiet, aren't they. This speaks VOLUMES to me.
 
One more thing. About 10 years ago, a local man murdered his wife and then staged a car accident into a local lake to make it look like she drown. He was releativly quickly charged with her murder, tried, convicted and sentanced. Since then, there have been 2 appeals and 2 additional trials, for a total of 3 trials. He was found guilty, his appeals failed, and he remains in prison. The Chenango County Sheriffs Office was the lead agency in this particular case. All of the appeals were made on the grounds basically of shoddy police work, evidence improprieties, etc. To put it plainly, his defense team tried to paint CCSO as a buch of bumbling "Barney Fifes" who rushed to close this case. Nothing could be further from the truth, but thats what they tried to do. Don't think for a minute that the CCSO didn't learn from this, and if they are being "unusually" quiet, IMO they are working feverishly in the backround to make sure all the "i's" are dotted and the "t's" are crossed before they make a move.

http://centralny.ynn.com/content/top_stories/590292/peter-wlasiuk-found-guilty/
 
Piperdog said:
<rs> Don't think for a minute that the CCSO didn't learn from this, and if they are being "unusually" quiet, IMO they are working feverishly in the backround to make sure all the "i's" are dotted and the "t's" are crossed before they make a move.
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Some people would be amazed at just how much LE reads, sees, and hears
 
sreshowtime said:
so...where is Jennifer

Does anyone off hand know what the garbage pick up is like there around Norwich...more specific- Who the providers are and when are dumpsters picked up and where are they dumped?
Is there a dumpster at the apartments where the van was located?

Is household garbage picked up at the curb? What size containers? Or is there a central location for residents to drop at? Does it go to the same dump?
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Locally, you either take it to the North Norwich transfer station yourself (about 4 miles from where the van was found north on State Route 12) or it is picked up by professional garbage men. If picked up professionally, it is most likely hauled to the north Norwich site. All trash arriving at North Norwich is then hauled to the Pharsalia dump / landfill that is about 9 miles from where the van was found.

I don't recall hearing anything about dumpsters being checked either.
 
OffRoadRunner said:
Locally, you either take it to the North Norwich transfer station yourself (about 4 miles from where the van was found north on State Route 12) or it is picked up by professional garbage men. If picked up professionally, it is most likely hauled to the north Norwich site. All trash arriving at North Norwich is then hauled to the Pharsalia dump / landfill that is about 9 miles from where the van was found.

I don't recall hearing anything about dumpsters being checked either.
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One more place is Coombes (?) just south of the transfer station on Rt. 12 in N.Norwich, on the right. This is where I take my trash. It is "more relaxed" than the county transfer station, and ahs alot less people working there and checking whats actually being disposed of. The only problem with dumpsters, and trash collection areas is that more than 2 months have elapsed since she's gone missing. The other problem is that not all the trash remains in Pharsalia. Some is trucked to the bigger landfills in Buffalo, so something "dumped" 2 months ago could be long gone.
 
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