17 yo Trayvon Martin Shot to Death by Neighborhood Watch Captain #30

[Phoenixfla]

But he would already have that evidence would he not???? It's not up to the state the make his SYG case for him. He has to convince a judge. The State has to convince the judge he's not being truthful or that the law just does not apply to him. jmo

No he would not necessarily have the evidence. I would expect he will want to introduce the statement from " John" as evidence that he was being assaulted but if there is no discovery before the SYG hearing how would he obtain it?

 

[LambChop]

I don't know Katy.... I guess someone is going to have to transcribe the tape... when and if it comes out in full.

I think we need to find the Gilbreath vid if there is one.

I think the problem understanding how they were running has to do with the location of the condo. We don't know which condo this lady lives in and Gilbreath does not say in his testimony, nor did he give this person's name. jmo

 

[Phoenixfla]

The defendant is the one that has to provide the evidence at a SYG hearing not the prosecution. If GZ is going to claim SGY immunity he has to prove it, then the prosecution will present whatever they need to in order to disprove what GZ is claiming. In a SYG hearing the burden of proof is squarely on the defendants shoulders.

So your saying if the prosecution has a video tape of the incident (just an example) that could clear a defendant they would have no obligation to turn it over to the defense for the SYG hearing?

 

[Concerned Papa]

http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsburghtrib/news/nation/s_792307.html

During further questioning by O'Mara, Gilbreath admitted that the state has no evidence who started the fight. There is also no evidence that Zimmerman didn't walk back to his car after chasing Martin on foot, as the defendant has claimed

The state is locked into that now. To tell you the truth, I think they are using the girlfriend's statement as to what she heard. That is not an eye witness either. She heard something, but she saw nothing. The state may not make it through the SYG hearing.

Locked in you say? You betcha! They're locked right into this case with a defense whose core says George Zimmerman got out of his vehicle at [2:08] and followed Trayvon Martin until the dispatcher said "We don't need you to do that" at [2:26].

The State is also locked into George's claim of additionally walking, what would have required no more than 80 feet to the front of the next building, for an address or street sign

The State is further locked into, the defense's stated position of what's now record in this case, that George Zimmerman then turned around and was walking back to his car when he was brutally attacked by an unarmed 17 year old kid.

Is the State locked into that position taken by the defense in this bond hearing? You bet they are, as evidenced by the following exchange:

O'MARA: Since. Today. Do you have any evidence that conflicts with his suggestion that he had turned around and went back to his car?

GILBREATH: Other than his statement, no.

Is that's the State's ONLY evidence? All these geniuses in the media that see the simplicity of this Investigator's truthful reply as a negative, need to get out a calculator for a little arithmetic.

If you leave your car and walk somewhere for EIGHTEEN SECONDS, how long will it take you to walk BACK to your car?

Plus

How long does it take to walk EIGHTY additional feet for an address?

:waiting:

:waiting:

:waiting:

Add all that together and understand that is the timeline where George Zimmerman initially, and now his brilliant attorney, have told the world that this "attack" occurred leading to his justification in killing an unarmed 17 year old kid. Less than ONE MINUTE after George got out of his vehicle and started following Trayvon, his story calls for being "attacked". How long do you think it will take a jury to glance at a transcript of the 911 call and realize that George was still TALKING TO THE DISPATCHER two minutes after he got out of his vehicle?

How long do you think it will take a jury to recognize that Trayvon's body was found TWO HUNDRED AND THIRTY THREE FEET away from George's vehicle?

Is that all the State's got? Probably not, but what else do they need to prove George Zimmerman is a LIAR?

 

[Adrienne37]

Ben Crump: 'The lying has already begun'
Trayvon Martin's family attorney takes aim at George Zimmerman's defense

SANFORD, Fla. -
An attorney for Trayvon Martin's family believes their son's shooter is lying about injuries he sustained the night he killed the unarmed 17-year-old.

"If this is any indication of what's to come, then the lying has already begun," attorney Ben Crump told reporters on Sunday, while promoting a documentary at the Florida Film Festival on another case.

http://www.clickorlando.com/news/Be...-already-begun/-/1637132/11562322/-/n978b8/-/

 

[m00c0w]

Oh but when the defendant (GZ) is claiming that he was being beat within one hit from being in diapers and spoon fed for life, then they sure as heck had better be more than 2 TEENY, TINY scratches.

Can you provide a link to where George Zimmerman made these claims? TIA.

 

[Phoenixfla]

I am just listening to Websleuths Radio.....

I do not like what this Richard Hornsby is saying...... Not at all...... Makes me really upset......

JUSTICE FOR TRAYVON.......

I just hope he will get Justice.....

Blessings

Micci

Catch us up, whats he saying?

 

[LambChop]

No he would not necessarily have the evidence. I would expect he will want to introduce the statement from " John" as evidence that he was being assaulted but if there is no discovery before the SYG hearing how would he obtain it?

The burden is up to him. The state will not make that argument for him, IMO. If what he claims is true the evidence will prove his position. This is why MOM was trying to get as much information out of Gilbreath as he could. MOM does not want to put GZ on the stand if he is not going to do well and if SA can get more information out of GZ to support their case it may not be worth having the SYG hearing and just go for self-defense. With the SYG hearing GZ has to testify which means he could be cross-examined. At this point I don't think MOM would want the state to have that option. If GZ does have a temper this prosecuter will certainly bring it out of it's hiding place for sure. lol jmo

 

[CathyinTexas]

Hm. Reserving comment on the phone records until they make a little more sense to me. JMO

Curious, though... *IF* the phone records fail to confirm that TM was on the phone with the GF at the time she says, what will be the ramifications for the State's case? JMO

I thought the investigator at the bond hearing settled that question.

 

[csziggy]

The detective never said it was a "she", he said a witness, never gave gender. The detective said the witness saw shadows of two people involved in a chase.

And what's really telling is this:

DE LA RIONDA: But you still have, is it not true, a witness who describes someone chasing another person from the area where they ended up... in other words, from where, near where Mr. Martin lived to the area where the murder happened?

Zimmerman was chasing Trayvon AWAY from Trayvon's place of safety if this is true. If Trayvon had made it that close to his temporary home, I can't see him chasing Zimmerman! I bet this is the key to the second degree murder charge.

IMO, JMO, etc.

 

[Adrienne37]

So your saying if the prosecution has a video tape of the incident (just an example) that could clear a defendant they would have on obligation to turn it over to the defense for the SYG hearing?

If the prosecution had any sort of video tape that could clear a "defendant," then I seriously doubt there would be a "defendant" because I doubt there would be a case.





~jmo~

 

[mercuriod]

Not according to the investigators testimony last week:




DE LA RIONDA: But you still have, is it not true, a witness who describes someone chasing another person from the area where they ended up... in other words, from where, near where Mr. Martin lived to the area where the murder happened?

GILBREATH: Yes.

BBM

Not part of the CNN transcript. It can be viewed here:
http://www.wral.com/news/video/11004815/#/vid11004815

What makes you think from that statement that they were running away for TM's home? The chase could have started further away, but still "near" TM's home and been headed towards TM's home and that statement would still be absolutely accurate.

 

[uvamerica]

Not everyone knew he had a gun. None of the witnesses reported a visible gun (at least publicly). There was some confusion by witnesses as to whether he was actually the shooter or not (Cutcher & Co. didn't seem to think so, initially, and they were supposedly the first ones out there).

People do stupid things all the time. Right now, we have the benefit of hindsight. Some curious resident who didn't realize the gravity of the situation might have started snapping pictures.

What do you mean by "didn't realize the gravity of the situation"
I find that hard to believe, there is a body on the ground not moving, another guy standing there with blood on his head, shot/shots were heard and on and on.....maybe a child wouldn't understand the "gravity of the situation", but an adult ?

 

[Reader]

This link might have been posted before but I just wanted to highlight something about the evidence from the bond hearing, misinformation or another lie?

http://www.cnn.com/2012/04/20/justice/florida-zimmerman-details/index.html?hpt=ju_c2

She said her son also participated in a 2010 campaign to "get justice" for an African-American homeless man who was seen in a videotape taken by an onlooker being struck by a man who later turned out to be the son of a Sanford police lieutenant.

"He went to churches. He put fliers on cars" and organized a meeting seeking help for the man, his mother testified.

He was recognized by the city for his efforts, his mother said.

CNN has not been able to confirm Zimmerman's participation in the campaign.

 

[m00c0w]

So your saying if the prosecution has a video tape of the incident (just an example) that could clear a defendant they would have no obligation to turn it over to the defense for the SYG hearing?

Yes, because that would mean the prosecution is committing a crime by prosecuting. If they have exculpatory evidence they withheld and proceeded with trying the case, they would be in violation of statutory law. And I could see some sanctions being brought against any members of the bar involved.

 

[CathyinTexas]

His motive may have been "Im tired of this guy watching me so im going to teach him a lesson." IMO

I thought it was stated somewhere that the GF said that TM said "this guy is looking at me like he wants to do something to me" I think TM was more likely trying to get away from someone he felt as threatening, but wasn't able to because we know based on what the gf heard, GZ caught up to him. He might have ran again, and that is when the witnesses saw someone chasing another.

 

[mercuriod]

No he would not necessarily have the evidence. I would expect he will want to introduce the statement from " John" as evidence that he was being assaulted but if there is no discovery before the SYG hearing how would he obtain it?

He would call "John" to the stand.

 

[daisy7]

So WHY does this testimony seem to say the opposite?

DE LA RIONDA: But you still have, is it not true, a witness who describes someone chasing another person from the area where they ended up... in other words, from where, near where Mr. Martin lived to the area where the murder happened?

GILBREATH: Yes.

BBM

Not part of the CNN transcript. It can be viewed here:
http://www.wral.com/news/video/11004815/#/vid11004815

I certainly didn't interpret the testimony that TM was running FROM his house. I'm not sure how anyone would.

 

[m00c0w]

What do you mean by "didn't realize the gravity of the situation"
I find that hard to believe, there is a body on the ground not moving, another guy standing there with blood on his head, shot/shots were heard and on and on.....maybe a child wouldn't understand the "gravity of the situation", but an adult ?

Maybe Zimmerman was attacked by a mysterious gunman, too. Even Cutcher, who was allegedly right there, didn't know Zimmerman was the shooter.

 

[mercuriod]

So your saying if the prosecution has a video tape of the incident (just an example) that could clear a defendant they would have no obligation to turn it over to the defense for the SYG hearing?

If the prosecution had a video tape of the incident that would clear the defendant they would not have filed charges in the first place.