17 yo Trayvon Martin Shot to Death by Neighborhood Watch Captain #35

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This is being discussed since it has been verified as his MS page by his lawyer and its in main stream media.

Do you have a link to main stream media about TM and verfification its him? If not it can't be discussed.

Ima

Miami Herald story referencing Trayvon's twitter account, while not mentioning the account name specifically, it does mention the tweets contained within, and the posting name of Slimm.

http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/04/08/2738118/what-trayvon-martins-social-media.html
 
Right! Most stolen jewelry ends up in a pawn shop, and people that have good jewelry have it insured and carry on.

That's true but to submit an insurance claim you have to have a police report about the burglary and the police said that the jewelry didn't match any that had been reported stolen.
 
Idk, but I would guess it was because he perceived himself as, between the two of them, the person rightfully where he was and Trayvon as a person who was not. He had not seen Trayvon in the neighborhood before and perceived him as a potential criminal threat. Under the circumstances, rightfully or wrongfully, he probably wasn't putting himself into the mind of an innocent kid visiting the neighborhood, but rather putting himself into the mind of a potential criminal. If that was his mindset, and I believe that it was, I can see how his first thought would be to ask the questions, and not to respond to Trayvon. jmo

Well the BBM part I actually have to agree with especially since GZ had so much "practice" and really did actually live in that mindset, since which of the 2 ACTUALLY has a criminal record????
 
OT-I have been super sick. Woke up thinking it was early evening. :blushing:

Can anyone give me the short version from the past couple of days?

Well, I've been doing a lot of reading, unless I've missed something, there are still only two true facts, true fact #1-Trayvon's very young life is over :-( , true fact #2- GZ is responsible for Trayvon's life being over.
 
What???? This post makes no sense to me. GZ saw a teenage, black male wearing a hoodie in "his"(GZ) neighborhood and started immediately following him, that teenage black male wearing a hoodie didn't even have to look at GZ, all it took for GZ to start following TM was that TM fit GZ profile as a "f*ck*ng punk" that being a teenage black male wearing a hoodie. GZ was following TM from the get go even before calling 911, cause big bad "Joe G" was going to make sure that "this" "f*ck*ng punk" didn't get away.

Don't forget, "these *advertiser censored**holes always get away!

Then also don't forget the driving force for GZ's aggressive behaviors...his own property was stolen off his front porch, so its' my belief it was a personal vendetta to set out for the next person HE didn't know to become his target..

People need to get into GZ's mind, mentality..it's his 'excited' utterances that tell it...he was very determined to stop anyone he felt was up to no good..TM was innocent..right place at the wrong time...and it was GZ who set his sights on TM for the reason above...
 
What???? This post makes no sense to me. GZ saw a teenage, black male wearing a hoodie in "his"(GZ) neighborhood and started immediately following him, that teenage black male wearing a hoodie didn't even have to look at GZ, all it took for GZ to start following TM was that TM fit GZ profile as a "f*ck*ng punk" that being a teenage black male wearing a hoodie. GZ was following TM from the get go even before calling 911, cause big bad "Joe G" was going to make sure that "this" "f*ck*ng punk" didn't get away.

There are so many words and phrases that have been used to paint the picture in GZ's favor.

Hoodie: If a white kid or suburban middle-aged man had the hood of his sweatshirt up, in the rain, it would not be referred to as a "hoodie" it most likely would have been called a "hood."

911: After an estimated 46 calls to 911. ON February 26, 2012, GZ DID NOT CALL 911. He called the NON-EMERGENCY number.

Suspicious: If a white kid or suburban middle-aged man was walking home, talking on his/her phone put up his hood when it started to rain, who would call that suspicious?

I could go on but it doesn't matter...people are prejudiced and bigotous and we have ever so far to go before any minds will change.
 
he had no issues-he had no idea who this nutcase following him was. Wouldn't/shouldn't the onus be on the follower? The guy who knew what was going on? The one who decided Trayvon was suspicious and needed to be stopped and prevented from getting away? Why didn't George identify HIMSELF?

I really don't understand this insistence that Trayvon was at fault here. Trayvon had no clue what was going on. George was in total control of everything including all the information. He decided everything, that TM was suspicious, that 911 needed to be called, that he needed his gun, that he needed to follow him with his gun. We are seriously expected to understand and agree that if someone is following us-we have the responsibility to establish who WE are, we should assume the follower is an innocent law abiding citizen with no evil intent? I'm not that stupid and I certainly wouldn't advise my teenage sons to take this approach.

If someone like George is going to undertake to play cop then he needs to follow cop rules and identify himself at the earliest opporunity which would have been back when he was sitting in his car watching Trayvon walk by. He needed to open his darn window and ask Trayvon a question about who he was, where he was going, etc if he wanted to know. That would have been reasonable and sensible. But he needed to escalate the situation and to follow and prevent him from getting away like all the other a#$holes did.

How this ends up being Trayvon's fault requires mental gymnastics the likes of which even the Soviets in the 70's couldn't manage.


For one, imo, George obviously wasn't concerned about his own safety, but that of his neighbors and, two, in connection with your earlier post, he did call the police.

Imo, it's all about the context. It is established that there were recent break-ins in the community which are known to have been perpetrated by young men, the majority of whom were black. George had recently assisted a woman whose home was broken into by this same group of criminals while she was in the home with an infant. That woman had to hide with the baby, most certainly praying for her and her child's life the entire time, and George was aware of this and had assisted her. These same criminals or "a&%holes" (personally, I think the shoe more than fits) did, in fact, "get away," as they fled out her back door just as the police arrived.

If I were a man, particularly a man who was a neighbor involved in assisting that woman and part of the NW, I would have done anything in my power to make sure that another incident just like that didn't happen again. Because I'm a woman, I'm not sure I would have followed Trayvon, but I'm feisty and I might have. In any case, if I knew that another woman and her baby in my neighborhood had gone through that, I would have done my very best to make sure I knew where this person was until the police arrived, this time. And if that meant following the person I was suspicious of, then I would have.

It was completely fortuitous that George was wrong about Trayvon. Imo, he had every right to be suspicious and I would have been, as well. Very much so, in fact.

For those reasons, I believe that what George did up to the moment of confrontation is, potentially, completely reasonable. It's what happened in those last seconds that matters to me.

The question in my mind about those last seconds is this. Both George and Trayvon's girl friend agree that Trayvon asked George why he was following and that George asked Trayvon what he was doing there. Why did Trayvon not simply say, I'm staying with my Dad over at *advertiser censored* address. Even if he thought George was going for a gun rather than his cell during that conversation (which I don't think has been established and I'm not sure I believe, anyway) wouldn't a reasonable reaction be "Wait! Dude!, my dad's gf lives here -- right over there. I'm just on my way home!!!"
 
I have been looking for the TM was 70 yards from the house or door and can't find one, (msm)everything about that is in a blog or someones opinion, is there a link to this being true?
 
It seems that the discovery that GZ, at the age of 22, still considered himself a "G" has gotten a few folks a bit upset.

For those who argue that we, as a public, cannot judge GZ by his acts in 2005, I suggest you note that his MS page was "MODIFIED" as late as 2 years before he shot Trayvon. By my estimate, he was 26 on January 16th, 2010. So, he wasn't a kid when he visited his "abandoned" MS page and modified his photos.
 
he had no issues-he had no idea who this nutcase following him was. Wouldn't/shouldn't the onus be on the follower? The guy who knew what was going on? The one who decided Trayvon was suspicious and needed to be stopped and prevented from getting away? Why didn't George identify HIMSELF?

I really don't understand this insistence that Trayvon was at fault here. Trayvon had no clue what was going on. George was in total control of everything including all the information. He decided everything, that TM was suspicious, that 911 needed to be called, that he needed his gun, that he needed to follow him with his gun. We are seriously expected to understand and agree that if someone is following us-we have the responsibility to establish who WE are, we should assume the follower is an innocent law abiding citizen with no evil intent? I'm not that stupid and I certainly wouldn't advise my teenage sons to take this approach.

If someone like George is going to undertake to play cop then he needs to follow cop rules and identify himself at the earliest opporunity which would have been back when he was sitting in his car watching Trayvon walk by. He needed to open his darn window and ask Trayvon a question about who he was, where he was going, etc if he wanted to know. That would have been reasonable and sensible. But he needed to escalate the situation and to follow and prevent him from getting away like all the other a#$holes did.

How this ends up being Trayvon's fault requires mental gymnastics the likes of which even the Soviets in the 70's couldn't manage.


For one, imo, George obviously wasn't concerned about his own safety, but that of his neighbors and, two, in connection with your earlier post, he did call the police.

Imo, it's all about the context. It is established that there were recent break-ins in the community which are known to have been perpetrated by young men, the majority of whom were black. George had recently assisted a woman whose home was broken into by this same group of criminals while she was in the home with an infant. That woman had to hide with the baby, most certainly praying for her and her child's life the entire time, and George was aware of this and had assisted her. These same criminals or "a&%holes" (personally, I think the shoe more than fits) did, in fact, "get away," as they fled out her back door just as the police arrived.

If I were a man, particularly a man who was a neighbor involved in assisting that woman and part of the NW, I would have done anything in my power to make sure that another incident just like that didn't happen again. Because I'm a woman, I'm not sure I would have followed Trayvon, but I'm feisty and I might have. In any case, if I knew that another woman and her baby in my neighborhood had gone through that, I would have done my very best to make sure I knew where this person was until the police arrived, this time. And if that meant following the person I was suspicious of, then I would have.

It was completely fortuitous that George was wrong about Trayvon. Imo, he had every right to be suspicious and I would have been, as well. Very much so, in fact.

For those reasons, I believe that what George did up to the moment of confrontation is, potentially, completely reasonable. It's what happened in those last seconds that matters to me.

The question in my mind about those last seconds is this. Both George and Trayvon's girl friend agree that Trayvon asked George why he was following and that George asked Trayvon what he was doing there. Why did Trayvon not simply say, I'm staying with my Dad over at *advertiser censored* address. Even if he thought George was going for a gun rather than his cell during that conversation (which I don't think has been established and I'm not sure I believe, anyway) wouldn't a reasonable reaction be "Wait! Dude!, my dad's gf lives here -- right over there. I'm just on my way home!!!"
 
People have suggested that GZ has been vilified. Opinions as to how GZ presents and presented himself are mainly based on documented details of just that...how GZ has presented himself.
 
he had no issues-he had no idea who this nutcase following him was. Wouldn't/shouldn't the onus be on the follower? The guy who knew what was going on? The one who decided Trayvon was suspicious and needed to be stopped and prevented from getting away? Why didn't George identify HIMSELF?

I really don't understand this insistence that Trayvon was at fault here. Trayvon had no clue what was going on. George was in total control of everything including all the information. He decided everything, that TM was suspicious, that 911 needed to be called, that he needed his gun, that he needed to follow him with his gun. We are seriously expected to understand and agree that if someone is following us-we have the responsibility to establish who WE are, we should assume the follower is an innocent law abiding citizen with no evil intent? I'm not that stupid and I certainly wouldn't advise my teenage sons to take this approach.

If someone like George is going to undertake to play cop then he needs to follow cop rules and identify himself at the earliest opporunity which would have been back when he was sitting in his car watching Trayvon walk by. He needed to open his darn window and ask Trayvon a question about who he was, where he was going, etc if he wanted to know. That would have been reasonable and sensible. But he needed to escalate the situation and to follow and prevent him from getting away like all the other a#$holes did.

How this ends up being Trayvon's fault requires mental gymnastics the likes of which even the Soviets in the 70's couldn't manage.

I'm not blaming or faulting anyone, nor am I placing an onus. I just wrote what my thoughts are on the subject. I also explained why I think George may not have identified himself first, and what I don't understand about why Trayvon did not identify himself - especially if he thought he was about to be shot. The other side of those explanations has been offered many times over, so it's not like I felt I needed to cover those explanations again in my posts.
 
OH GOOD point. I am sure he is very interested in that timeline. And the timeline that Crump officially put out there, about the days following the tragedy.

It will be interesting to see if it is accurate and verifiable.

The timeline after the shooting doesn't really matter, unless SHE said something about it in her statement.

Unless Crump is called to the stand, wouldn't anything HE said outside of the courtroom or in the media be considered hearsay? I can't think of an exception that would cover it? Unless he is called to testify?
 
he had no issues-he had no idea who this nutcase following him was. Wouldn't/shouldn't the onus be on the follower? The guy who knew what was going on? The one who decided Trayvon was suspicious and needed to be stopped and prevented from getting away? Why didn't George identify HIMSELF?

I really don't understand this insistence that Trayvon was at fault here. Trayvon had no clue what was going on. George was in total control of everything including all the information. He decided everything, that TM was suspicious, that 911 needed to be called, that he needed his gun, that he needed to follow him with his gun. We are seriously expected to understand and agree that if someone is following us-we have the responsibility to establish who WE are, we should assume the follower is an innocent law abiding citizen with no evil intent? I'm not that stupid and I certainly wouldn't advise my teenage sons to take this approach.

If someone like George is going to undertake to play cop then he needs to follow cop rules and identify himself at the earliest opporunity which would have been back when he was sitting in his car watching Trayvon walk by. He needed to open his darn window and ask Trayvon a question about who he was, where he was going, etc if he wanted to know. That would have been reasonable and sensible. But he needed to escalate the situation and to follow and prevent him from getting away like all the other a#$holes did.

How this ends up being Trayvon's fault requires mental gymnastics the likes of which even the Soviets in the 70's couldn't manage.


This post deserves more than the 1 thank you allowed! :tyou: :tyou: :tyou:
 
Thanks
I know TM is a victim. I also know that since Feb 27,2012 GZ has been victimized by the press and posters here. He has been arrested yes, but not charged and that is a big difference.

The Sanford police chief closed the case shortly after Trayvon was killed, George was released free & clear within hours, based on his claim of SYG. And no one was even talking about this closed case until Trayvon's parents sought answers in March, see article below. By the way, the first WS thread regarding George gunning down Trayvon wasn't started until March 8.

George hasn't been victimized by anyone, he got himself into this mess by unnecessarily following then killing a kid (George's word) when he KNEW police were on the way. He was told to NOT follow but did anyways and shot Trayvon within minutes, approx 233 ft from his parked vehicle (per SFD calls re address of shooting & Concerned Papa measurements). He pursued Trayvon almost the length of a FOOTBALL FIELD before killing him. George is in no way a victim, imo.

Reuters article March 7, 2012
http://news.yahoo.com/family-florida-boy-killed-neighborhood-watch-seeks-arrest-044537742.html
 
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