4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #85

[maskedwoman]

RE: the defense request in regards to the autopsy and the 3 officers' bodycams, photos, notes, etc.

<modsnip>

Again, legal wording (my sister worked for a state's attorney for 30 years, so I've had this drilled into my head over and over) is very precise and each word in the defense's requests are carefully chosen. Sadly, she's no longer alive or I would be able to ask her and then give you all her 3 page long rant about legal language precision and defense attorneys. The request stated "collected at the autopsy by Tolleson, Vargas, and Gunnerson." As in those items listed that were created during the autopsy only. Notes/reports that the officers made once back at the station would be entirely separate entities and would have been turned over separately from this line item in the requests.

All photographs, audio recordings of notes, logs of evidence and documentation of transfer of evidence, and reports created by the ME and their staff would come later directly from the ME office.

Interesting bit I found from the Spokane County Medical Examiner Quality Management Manual:

"While law enforcement personnel, forensic unit, and occasionally prosecutors may observe autopsy and body evidence collection, they are allowed no input into the inspection/examination process. These individuals witness, but don’t participate."

https://www.thename.org/assets/docs/4.1-4.2%20Bias%20and%20Confidentiality.pdf

Very very interesting. Thank you for sharing!

 

[girlhasnoname]

They are easy enough to pick up at Goodwill or rummage sales where I live.

I wonder if BK didn't already own those Van or Van 'type' shoes and then disposed of them after the crime. LE could have asked students or family if he had been known to wear a pair only to find out they are unaccounted for after the crime was committed.

His family would have been familiar with BK's clothes and shoes as he lived at home with them until he moved to Pullman at age 28.

MOO

 

[girlhasnoname]

For those who haven't seen it, Gray Hughes has put out a video comparing the movements of the Elantra before entering the house (as described in the PCA) with the surveillance footage from Linda Lane. It's not very long, only 15ish minutes and actually watching the visual of the route the car took- exactly matching the times noted in the PCA- was helpful and really illuminating to see, even believing I already had an accurate grasp of the timeline of events from reading the PCA.

I am a totally visual person and this video really cleared up the drive bys and the timeline. Thanks for posting.

 

[Nichevo]

I thought the ME was a male in Spokane?

If you mean the coroner, I wasn't all that impressed with her professionalism during her media blitz early on. JMO

Dr. Veena D. Singh is the current Spokane County ME. The previous ME was also female.

 

[Boxer]

Guess I won't be finding knockoffs. Good for the Vans people. LOL But maybe something else with a similar sole?

MOO i looked, some sneakers were marginally similar but didnt think that they looked much like the Vans sole.

 

[BeginnerSleuther]

Really? I think that is the very definition of defense pre-trial strategy. = "playing word games in official court filings "
JMO

Word games in official court filings is not a thing, IMO. At the end of the day, no attorney wants to get in trouble for abusing/misusing the court with those kinds of shenanigans.

JMO.

 

[schooling]

MOO i looked, some sneakers were marginally similar but didnt think that they looked much like the Vans sole.

I pointed out that early versions of the New Balance 990s (I have a pair) have a diamond patterned upper sole.

I think LE said “Van’s style” to give themselves some wiggle room as they probably weren’t sure at that time.

 

[girlhasnoname]

Word games in official court filings is not a thing, IMO. At the end of the day, no attorney wants to get in trouble for abusing/misusing the court with those kinds of shenanigans.

JMO.

If every attorney that played word games in filings were penalized, there would be no practicing attorneys left, both Prosecution and Defense. I'm not saying that disparagingly...

It may very well be what BK has told his attorneys ie, "I don't know any of them, I've never met them before" so that really isn't a lie if they don't have proof he actually did.

Regardless, it's a nothing 'Kohberger', a lot of mass murderers or spree killers do not know their victims.

MOO

 

[jepop]

I wonder if BK didn't already own those Van or Van 'type' shoes and then disposed of them after the crime. LE could have asked students or family if he had been known to wear a pair only to find out they are unaccounted for after the crime was committed.

His family would have been familiar with BK's clothes and shoes as he lived at home with them until he moved to Pullman at age 28.

MOO

Good point. I wonder if this was investigated. After arrest and the returns on appartment and PA search warrants, I wonder if LE could/would have questioned colleagues, neighbours, others(?) who perhaps saw BK recently and regularly at WSU about his footwear? Also maybe video footage from WSU - come to think of it there is the warrant for WSU - I doubt it's actually for video footage but its a passing thought nonetheless. Having said all that I do suspect that defendant ditched the shoes he wore post crime. I also feel that it's possible he had a special pair he wore on the night and perhaps during earlier stalking incidents - not "everyday shoes" - because I believe defendant was big on planning.Moo

 

[stormymama]

Shoe person here who has found myself studying the bottoms of my many pairs of shoes.
Whenever I think of Vans or Vans-style shoes, I think of an athletic loafer. They are technically tennis shoes or sneakers, but they are different than a New Balance or Nike athletic shoe. Vans (and Vans-style shoes) have more of a narrow, flat bottom, with less "chunk" than a Nike running shoe, for example. I wonder if Converses had been considered, although ironically, they were originally a basketball shoe.
I guess what I'm getting to is, what about the footprint, other than the pattern, led them to call the shoe a Vans or Vans-style shoe?

 

[BeginnerSleuther]

If every attorney that played word games in filings were penalized, there would be no practicing attorneys left, both Prosecution and Defense. I'm not saying that disparagingly...

I just don't buy that, sorry. I haven't seen any evidence that AT is playing word games here or in any court filing. Can you (or anyone saying this happens with regularity) point to examples please?

 

[ktm44]

If every attorney that played word games in filings were penalized, there would be no practicing attorneys left, both Prosecution and Defense. I'm not saying that disparagingly...

It may very well be what BK has told his attorneys ie, "I don't know any of them, I've never met them before" so that really isn't a lie if they don't have proof he actually did.

Regardless, it's a nothing 'Kohberger', a lot of mass murderers or spree killers do not know their victims.

MOO

Then there is the definition of 'knowing' someone. Some may say it means they know them well enough to be invited into their home, others may feel they know someone because they recognize their face know their name and someone else may feel they know someone because they attend class together or have another mutual friend in common and have heard 'stories'.

 

[Boxer]

I just don't buy that, sorry. I haven't seen any evidence that AT is playing word games here or in any court filing. Can you (or anyone saying this happens with regularity) point to examples please?

MOO

"There is no connection between Kohberger and the victims."

This above is a word game based in the hope that they get the DNA supressed.

The fact is there is a connection at this time, legally and in common terms.

 

[arielilane]

Shoe person here who has found myself studying the bottoms of my many pairs of shoes.
Whenever I think of Vans or Vans-style shoes, I think of an athletic loafer. They are technically tennis shoes or sneakers, but they are different than a New Balance or Nike athletic shoe. Vans (and Vans-style shoes) have more of a narrow, flat bottom, with less "chunk" than a Nike running shoe, for example. I wonder if Converses had been considered, although ironically, they were originally a basketball shoe.
I guess what I'm getting to is, what about the footprint, other than the pattern, led them to call the shoe a Vans or Vans-style shoe?

I'd put BK in a pair of Converse (diamond pattern on the bottom) before a pair of Vans any day of the week. Hope we get to find out the truth. If am wrong, am wrong, the truth is what counts here. moo

In addition, possibly the New Balance pic is an option as well. moo

 

[MyBelle]

I just don't buy that, sorry. I haven't seen any evidence that AT is playing word games here or in any court filing. Can you (or anyone saying this happens with regularity) point to examples please?

Scott Peterson's attorney told the jury in opening statements that his client was "stone cold innocent."
Verdict: guilty, death penalty.

JMO

 

[Boxer]

I'd put BK in a pair of Converse (diamond pattern on the bottom) before a pair of Vans any day of the week. Hope we get to find out the truth. If am wrong, am wrong, the truth is what counts here. moo

In addition, possibly the New Balance pic is an option as well. moo

Do Converse have a diamond pattern slip on?

 

[BeginnerSleuther]

Scott Peterson's attorney told the jury in opening statements that his client was "stone cold innocent."
Verdict: guilty, death penalty.

JMO

That's not an example of word play nor is it in official court filings. It was part of the trial.

While I do believe Scott Peterson is guilty, his attorney saying he's innocent and the jury disagreeing does not show word play.

JMO

 

[BeginnerSleuther]

MOO

"There is no connection between Kohberger and the victims."

This above is a word game based in the hope that they get the DNA supressed.

The fact is there is a connection at this time, legally and in common terms.

I actually think that's a bigger play on words than what's in the official document. AT should have probably said "no connection prior to the murders" but honestly, this "DNA is a connection" response online was unexpected by me. IMO, she's referring to prior to the murders as the document was making the point that they don't know the prosecution's case.

JMO

 

[Boxer]

I just saw the link to the to Black Vans slip ons didn't past the way I thought.

Vans | Classic Slip-On Black/Black Classics Shoe

Classic Slip-On Shoe

www.vans.com

 

[Cool Cats]

MOO

"There is no connection between Kohberger and the victims."

This above is a word game based in the hope that they get the DNA supressed.

The fact is there is a connection at this time, legally and in common terms.

Yup!
That is a word game if ever.

AT probably sees other BK connections to the victims considering all the evidence. I believe there will be other connections found digitally:

credit card purchases
online purchases
in-store purchases
bank statements
Google Pay transactions
Other online pay services

Purchases could show possible Murder Kit items were purchased:

Cleaning materials including chemicals and paper products, trash bags, plastic, mask, dark clothing, knife, sheath, car replacement parts, van type shoes, flashlight, spying equipment, phone jammer, binoculars..... etc....

Search warrants include digital information related to the investigation:

Reddit
Google
TikTok
Snapchat
Facebook
Instagram
Twitter
Tapatalk
public posts
private messages
public messages
saved files
photos
location data

From Kohberger's Google account including his hard drive, investigators have pulled extensive records:

search history
browsing history
emails
drafts
trash
hangouts
chats
photos
documents
spreadsheets
presentations
files
metadata
calendar events
and contacts
Google Play purchases

Investigators also obtained additional AT&T records:

messages
records
files
logs
photos
outgoing and incoming texts
information deleted but still available
cell tower pings
outgoing and incoming calls

Records from "Strava," an internet service which allows users to track their physical exercise and share their performance on social networks:

biometric information
exercise data
session logs
geo location data
contacts
photos
names and accounts

Records related to the four victims' Snapchat accounts:

communications
messages sent
messages received
logs of previous snaps
stories
chats
support services
actions taken including suspensions of the accounts

Investigators probe Bryan Kohberger's social media in connection with Idaho college murders

The documents include search warrant applications for some of Bryan Kohberger's internet activity.

abcnews.go.com

Idaho prosecutors seek search warrants for Bryan Kohberger’s social media accounts

The Latah County Prosecutor’s Office requested information on Mr Kohberger’s digital footprint from TikTok, Strava, Reddit, Google, and Snapchat

www.independent.co.uk