4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, Nov 2022 #85

[al66pine]

No Connection. Adding "Prior to the Murders?" Inferences?

.... AT should have probably said "no connection prior to the murders" but honestly, this "DNA is a connection" response online was unexpected by me. IMO, she's referring to prior to the murders as the document was making the point that they don't know the prosecution's case. JMO

snipped for focus @BeginnerSleuther Def atty said "no connection."

If def atty had said ---"no connection prior to the murders" seems that is wide open to a reader interp'ing/imagining these inferences.

"BK had no connection prior to murders, at which time he was inside the 1122 King dwelling where..."

From there reader may logically continue by interp'ing/imagining ---

"where BK WATCHED as known-to-him/unknown to him person/persons caused the deaths of the four people."

Or ---
"where BK AIDED/abetted/assisted/continued to act in furtherance of his conspiracy to murder w __."

Or ---
Worse than any of the above ---
"where BK willfully, deliberately and after premeditation, KILLED four people."

Not seeing that adding ^ phrase as helpful to def't, IDK ICBW,
Maybe my imagination was going wild?

 

[maconrich]

Before the debate about the origins of the original video, I had already watched it in full. Gray Hughes does an excellent job of linking this video to the PCA and clarifying a lot in a very short amount of time ~ 15 minutes. That was helpful.

Watching the raw footage was somehow creepier and unsettling to say the least. I am not sure where this puts us in terms of truly understanding the entry and exit from the residence. But if you have any doubts, it clarifies a lot of what we don't know. I am always going to want more, but do check it out. JMOO.

That was disappointing IMO. He did do a good job with the PCA and his car animation / simulation, but there's next to nothing from the video. And I do appreciate his work, explanations etc, and mainly his matching up the car horn beeps from the police body cam with the security cam footage (to indicate the footage is more than likely legit).

I agree that the raw footage was creepier and more unsettling. Maybe because it was (apparently) literally capturing things as they happened - and with more than the white car. But for me, it doesn't answer any questions or even clarify anything - at least not any more than the PCA itself does - which makes sense because it's based on the PCA. So IMO nothing new other than the brief clips from the security cam video and potential confirmation that the video is legit. All MOO, IMO etc

 

[Chloegirl]

That was disappointing IMO. He did do a good job with the PCA and his car animation / simulation, but there's next to nothing from the video. And I do appreciate his work, explanations etc, and mainly his matching up the car horn beeps from the police body cam with the security cam footage (to indicate the footage is more than likely legit).

I agree that the raw footage was creepier and more unsettling. Maybe because it was (apparently) literally capturing things as they happened - and with more than the white car. But for me, it doesn't answer any questions or even clarify anything - at least not any more than the PCA itself does - which makes sense because it's based on the PCA. So IMO nothing new other than the brief clips from the security cam video and potential confirmation that the video is legit. All MOO, IMO etc

I understand what you're saying. I remember early on when I watched the GrubHub video, hanging on every movement from all the individuals in the foreground. <modsnip: sleuthing someone not named a POI> It's all very subtle stuff sometimes. It's confusing as well as clarifying simultaneously. JMOO

 

[Chloegirl]

I was never sold on BK targeting a specific person or people in the 1122 house, even after reading the PCA over and over and reading through all the discussion on these threads. Now, after watching the GH video and seeing the loops linked up with the PCA, I'm convinced he was after someone in that house specifically. He passed by dozens of other homes. Why 1122? I'm a visual person, and the GH video really made it sink in for me how creepy his actions were before the heinous murders.

At one point they said possibly targeting the house which made me think of retribution towards the landlord. That narrative dropped away and I can't imagine a heinous murder like this against the landlord but it is still possible because there's so much we don't know. I keep trying to keep my mind open, look at the evidence and try to set my feelings aside. Occasionally that is impossible. JMOO

 

[Justice101]

Great video/re-enactment of the drive-bys. Agreed, it was quite eerie. It gave me the sense that in each one, where the car stopped for a few minutes in the back of the apartments he was watching Maddie's room. I came to the conclusion, and this is JMO, that in circling the area, he was waiting for lights out. I also believe, (again, JMO) that what has been referred to as the failed parking attempt, was the interruption of the DD driver.

Edited to add: It would be interesting to see the video footage recorded by the apartments on the times prior to the murders that his phone pinged in that area.

MOO

There is also a video from the house directly to the right of the victim's house. That one has not been "leaked" like this one from down in the other apartment complex

 

[Justice101]

That was disappointing IMO. He did do a good job with the PCA and his car animation / simulation, but there's next to nothing from the video. And I do appreciate his work, explanations etc, and mainly his matching up the car horn beeps from the police body cam with the security cam footage (to indicate the footage is more than likely legit).

I agree that the raw footage was creepier and more unsettling. Maybe because it was (apparently) literally capturing things as they happened - and with more than the white car. But for me, it doesn't answer any questions or even clarify anything - at least not any more than the PCA itself does - which makes sense because it's based on the PCA. So IMO nothing new other than the brief clips from the security cam video and potential confirmation that the video is legit. All MOO, IMO etc

I thought he did a good job with what facts he had to work with. I did not realize how far he had to drive around in that extended loop.. only to always end up at the victim's address. He was on a mission. If he was only peeping tom he would have just parked the once and stayed there... but he kept driving around until the lights went out in the bedroom of the one(s) he targeted.

 

[maconrich]

I thought he did a good job with what facts he had to work with. I did not realize how far he had to drive around in that extended loop.. only to always end up at the victim's address. He was on a mission. If he was only peeping tom he would have just parked the once and stayed there... but he kept driving around until the lights went out in the bedroom of the one(s) he targeted.

Agree that seeing the roads and routes the car took (according to the PCA) was helpful - more so than looking at a map (and since I live on the other side of the country, I've never seen the area in person, so very helpful for me personally). But, aside from the brief clips from the security video, it only showed what the PCA said. So helpful, but not really helpful, IMO, but worth watching and discussing for sure.

 

[TL4S]

I thought he did a good job with what facts he had to work with. I did not realize how far he had to drive around in that extended loop.. only to always end up at the victim's address. He was on a mission. If he was only peeping tom he would have just parked the once and stayed there... but he kept driving around until the lights went out in the bedroom of the one(s) he targeted.

I agree about him waiting for lights out. IMO, his drive-by behavior that night tends to also support the 12 previous times LE says his phone was in the area of the King Rd. house. I think we'll find LE could get cell data for those previous 12 times to within a much closer proximity than what some might think, and while it isn't clear evidence, combining it with these repeated passes on the night of the murders, I think stalking behavior is looking more and more likely. JMO.

 

[DizzyB]

I thought he did a good job with what facts he had to work with. I did not realize how far he had to drive around in that extended loop.. only to always end up at the victim's address. He was on a mission. If he was only peeping tom he would have just parked the once and stayed there... but he kept driving around until the lights went out in the bedroom of the one(s) he targeted.

I know it’s my own inadequacy, but if GH had done the simulation with StreetView (probably not available for the whole route), my brain would have processed it better.

 

[Charlot123]

My siblings both use an app that allows them to see their partners screens in real time. It’s a tracker showing their locations and all texts that come on their screen. I have avoided asking more about this app but will today.
I don’t believe it’s impossible that BK could have known about the door dash delivery if he was using an app like this to stalk them. You only need their Wi-Fi password.

The question is, does the app have to be installed on both phones, or merely on one and connected via Wi-Fi? If on one - if you remember, BK allegedly knew the password for the neighbor whom he befriended and whose apartment was later broken into, when installing her security system. So maybe he used to collect passwords to WiFis?

As to the King Road house, it was a party house and it is not impossible that many people knew the Wi-Fi password. Also, was the WiFi provided by the owner of the house? (Offices are often leased with existing Wi-Fi, I don’t know about houses). If so, it is not impossible that the new tenants might have not changed the password that the tenants from the previous year had been using.

 

[Charlot123]

The waffle pattern, pretty sure.

And Van's are designed to resist slipping (they are skateboarding shoes, at least, that's how they are marketed).

Flat gives more traction on a skateboard. It denotes a younger person. They are priced for younge yr people.

I'm not as interested in the brand as I am in what they found from the footprint. Forensic anthropology has an entire subdivision devoted only to footprints. I was looking at a footprint just today (and looking at my own). I also have a few pictures of Vans footprints. SO much can be known from the various measurements/ratios of the toes/heel/arch of the foot. First thing that even a beginner can see is whether the great toe is 1) longer than the second toe...2) same size as second toe...3) shorter than the second toe.

And so on.

It's something that I assume fits Kohberger's foot, because if not, that's a big deal.

IMO.

One footprint can tell a lot, but if there are two, from different feet, even in different places, I am thinking of the gait. Gaits are individual, the level of pronation, supination, etc. I have noticed that the degree of pressure exerted by R and L foot may not be even in many people; same with arches and even the angle they place their feet when walking. What I want to say, we are talking about one footprint, but maybe LE have more? This would be very interesting.

 

[Charlot123]

Vans are very distinctive, thanks.

A shoe expert can verify this which the State will do if they can find a reliable tie for a Van to BK.

Like if they find BK purchased Van shoes before that night and his purchase matches the tread and size of the shoe print, add that to the witness description, DNA, car surveillance videos, cell tower GPS tracking, no reliable alibi, etc...and it all adds up.

I think the FBI digital forensic investigators will find a BK digital connection to a King Rd occupant. Be interesting to find out if those ID cards were BK's cards or cards he may have obtained (from young women) under suspicious circumstances.

The term “ID cards” is very vague.
I am thinking, any exhibition badge, which is later discarded, maybe in the thrash bin at the entrance? Or any outdated badge? Or - more complicated- a driver’s license that is old (exchanged for an enhanced one?) The old one is usually punch-holed, but on the top, which I think is a mistake, because theoretically, one can hold it, covering that spot with a finger.
Another thought of mine is, BK has a slight familial resemblance to his sisters. On one of his younger photos, he looks very thin and to me, slightly androgynous. In short, in a wig and with makeup, he probably could pass for a tall woman, especially if ID is of a mundane type and doesn’t list height/weight.

 

[Megnut]

He could have had a collection of his own ID cards from previous employment, colleges, etc. HVAC, Security, Staff.... But would LE collect those? They had to fit within the scope of the warrant. Part of a disguise/uniform to gain access to homes without raising suspicion....

Jmo

 

[Megnut]

Do we know, from established facts, where he was from, say, 5 pm until 1 am, that night?

Could he have been somewhere, only to head to hospital apartment and leave for Moscow? Didn't he turn off his phone right about the time K and M were getting home and then calling/texting, likely in unison?

It's unnerving to me to imagine his movements in stereo with theirs, how blissfully unaware they were, how laser focused he was...

Waiting for lights out...

Timed to the minute...

PRECISE.

jmo

 

[DizzyB]

He could have had a collection of his own ID cards from previous employment, colleges, etc. HVAC, Security, Staff.... But would LE collect those? They had to fit within the scope of the warrant. Part of a disguise/uniform to gain access to homes without raising suspicion....

Jmo

Interesting. We discussed how BK might stand out at a college party on King Road, but would anyone question him if he said he was from a utility company, i.e. cable/electric, or part of a property management crew?

 

[arielilane]

Posting this here as I know there's been chat about the Bates stamp.

Important Prosecution responses to the Motions to Compel concerning the Elantra/CAST documents and examiners. Long of the short of it is, they are denoting the Bates Stamp numbers that reference what has been provided concerning these requests as well as summarizing progress on related requests. Discovery on a case like this is voluminous. The Defense has and will continue to get all evidence in the case allowed by law as well they should.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1679828996081451010

 

[Boxer]

If I was to jump on the speculative DD bandwagon. How else would he know if it wasn't DoorDash telling him?

Listening device? That's much more likely. But still squarely inside the realm of conspiracy theory. JMO.

I missed what BK knew, can you tell me? Thanks

 

[North_Idaho_Nony]

Interesting. We discussed how BK might stand out at a college party on King Road, but would anyone question him if he said he was from a utility company, i.e. cable/electric, or part of a property management crew?

This is an interesting point & one I pondered earlier. Pure speculation, but I asked several college students about this earlier & they said no way would they allow an unexpected worker in their places. Apparently the specific property management company has a very good reputation (as do some others — reputation is important) for communicating with tenants about maintenance. Too, younger people seem to be way more aware of these kind of safety issues, MOO. Maybe it’s because this is a college town with lots of young renters or maybe times have changed even in this college town.

A couple of caveats. First, my convos were after the horrific murders, so sudden attitude changes might understandably have taken place. Second, no one I chatted with lived in an off-campus house with 6 bedrooms, where it’s conceivable clear communication about scheduled maintenance visits might be less clear, more potential for a variety of safety consciousness levels could exist, etc.

Finally, generalities say nothing about the specifics of these treasured individuals. Living in a party house in no way means they weren’t generally safety-conscious & there’s been reporting that indicates they were young people living their best lives when evil appeared. The fact that the house is perceived as some kind of fishbowl doesn’t mean the existing window coverings weren’t regularly used, especially in bedrooms, etc.

All just MOO, as always.

 

[kittythehare]

I went down the shoe print rabbithole in the beginning of this. If they say Vans like, they are pretty darned sure they are Vans. I think they hedged their bet in case they happened to be a knock off that duplicated the tread pattern exactly. Less is more, Vans like or diamond soled is a safer statement. I think size and wear pattern can further drill down the print.

I went down the rabbit hole of diamond soles the other night. There's tons and tons. Recall it was a latent.
Recall the word 'similar'.
They are all 'similar'.

(upshot was I bought 3 pairs of shoes I don't actually need and none suitable for rainy weather here, thanks BK, like I needed more to dislike you more!!)

 

[di anna]

I have a question....I have had someone in my family try to explain to me but I still don't understand. When I am often in a business a drop down on my phone will ask me which
Wifi do I want to connect to? I always ignore it. I did have someone tell me never to lookup my private information ( I don't want to say what info) in a situation like this because others can see my information. Upthread I posted the synchronization of DD around the time of this particular crime. It's not that I believe in some conspiracy
theory of DD, I just cannot figure out how you could be so CERTAIN that you would not be confronted with people going in and out. No one wants to be caught in a house, (where you don't belong) in the middle of the night with a knife in their hand. With that many cars in the driveway, and the traffic in and out, how do you know someone
doesn't own a weapon and will take care of you entering in the middle of the night?