Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #187

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Also - i fully get at trial, in a case which was not solved for years (e.g McStay), many theories arise, and the defence legitimately seek to hook these theories up with evidence for the Jury. All fine and good.

What appears to be new here, is that before trial, this stuff is being woven into motions where it is irrelevant to the legal issue raised, with the idea of generating a ground swell of support.

MOO
 
I agree RA acted alone in the actual murder of Abby & Libby, but I still can't shake the feeling that he knew they were going to be at the MHB at that time. He arrived at nearly the same time and walked 'purposely' from the Freedom Trail to the MHB.

He didn't just show up and wander around leisurely watching the stock ticker and fish. I believe he was on a mission which included carrying a knife and gun. Not normal for a casual afternoon stroll at approx. 2 pm IMO.

How RA knew Abby & Libby were going to be there? IDK, but I think it has to do with catfishing them himself online or KAK/accomplice supplying access to the gross CSAM sites.

JMO
I think the timing is odd too. I think it is possible to be a coincidence, he made that walking after lunch many times waiting for a victim and when alone? It is also possible that he knew or suspected that the girls or Kelsi would be there in some way? Or he suspected that young girls/women will be there in that day since he lived next to a shcool. I think the "walked purposely" to the bridge because the bridge was his target and he wanted to use that as a trap. It was more isolated than where he saw the 3/4 girls.

But it is also absolutely possible that he knew the girls would be there. The timing is odd. I think we will found out in the hearing of July.
 
I think the timing is odd too. I think it is possible to be a coincidence, he made that walking after lunch many times waiting for a victim and when alone? It is also possible that he knew or suspected that the girls or Kelsi would be there in some way? Or he suspected that young girls/women will be there in that day since he lived next to a shcool. I think the "walked purposely" to the bridge because the bridge was his target and he wanted to use that as a trap. It was more isolated than where he saw the 3/4 girls.

But it is also absolutely possible that he knew the girls would be there. The timing is odd. I think we will found out in the hearing of July.

The fact that there is often no connection between killer and victim is one reason these types of cases are so hard to solve ... for all we know, these were not his ideal victims at all, just the ones who happened along. There was a similar case in germany a year or so ago, where two women were killed by a rando in a sexually motivated assault in a tourist area. IMO it's quite a mistake to assume this was all very well organised or carried out.
 
I go back and forth on if he knew they would be there that day.

From the little we know the timing is suspicious as it doesn’t sound like he was waiting around for hours looking for possible victims.

But I also feel like if he secretly grooming one of those girls then there is simply no way in hell he would left that phone behind as it’s such a rookie mistake.

Moo
 
When all is said and done, RA is not going to be convicted or acquitted on whether those are jeans or sweatpants or leggings at the crime scene and how all the confusion came about.
It’s more a sign that the evidentiary hearings can’t get here quick enough for us all.

Of course not. In my opinion, it points to something else happening other than the narrative that's out there. If Libby was wearing gray sweats, and less than two hours later Abby supposedly was dressed in Libby's jeans, there's more to the story here.

IMO MOO
 
I go back and forth on if he knew they would be there that day.

From the little we know the timing is suspicious as it doesn’t sound like he was waiting around for hours looking for possible victims.

But I also feel like if he secretly grooming one of those girls then there is simply no way in hell he would left that phone behind as it’s such a rookie mistake.

Moo
Musing aloud about mistakes, Delphi murderer/s left phone behind and Idaho students murderer left knife sheath behind. This is interesting to me as Kohberger/Idaho studied criminology but still made mistakes. Wonder if carrying out such cold blooded murder puts them into a cloud of consciousness state for a time so less aware of details. Or, some kind of euphoric power state, with same effect, urgh.
MOO
 
Musing aloud about mistakes, Delphi murderer/s left phone behind and Idaho students murderer left knife sheath behind. This is interesting to me as Kohberger/Idaho studied criminology but still made mistakes. Wonder if carrying out such cold blooded murder puts them into a cloud of consciousness state for a time so less aware of details. Or, some kind of euphoric power state, with same effect, urgh.
MOO

Yes I guess most people can not understand their mind set as we are not capable of such acts. So who actually knows what goes on in their head when they are committing such ghastly acts.
 
Musing aloud about mistakes, Delphi murderer/s left phone behind and Idaho students murderer left knife sheath behind. This is interesting to me as Kohberger/Idaho studied criminology but still made mistakes. Wonder if carrying out such cold blooded murder puts them into a cloud of consciousness state for a time so less aware of details. Or, some kind of euphoric power state, with same effect, urgh.
MOO
Yes, I believe so along with the old saying "there is no such thing as the perfect murder". That's even more true IMO with all of today's technology.

With CAST info, CCTV, DNA, IGG, etc. great for us law abiding people, bad for the criminals. :)

MOO
 
Yes, I believe so along with the old saying "there is no such thing as the perfect murder". That's even more true IMO with all of today's technology.

With CAST info, CCTV, DNA, IGG, etc. great for us law abiding people, bad for the criminals. :)

MOO
Cameras and technology are everywhere so even if you don’t think you are being seen you are.

Case in point. Did anyone follow the Douglas Garland Case in Alberta? Douglas Garland murdered Grandparents and a young grandchild. He took them to his farm. He was outed quite quickly and evidence was found that incriminated him.

Fast forward to his trial and evidence was entered of pictures of all 3 dead, lying on the grass at the farm. A plane was flying overhead taking surveying pictures of the area days before LE descended on the farm. The surveying company didn’t review the images immediately but when they did WHOA!

Yup. No murder is perfect, especially today.

MOO
 
The one thing I’m intrigued about is he obviously knew he had been seen by multiple witnesses and yet he still continued with his plan that day.

Thats so brazen to go ahead when he knew he had been spotted and for all he knew had been recognized from working at CVS.

Moo
 
The one thing I’m intrigued about is he obviously knew he had been seen by multiple witnesses and yet he still continued with his plan that day.

Thats so brazen to go ahead when he knew he had been spotted and for all he knew had been recognized from working at CVS.

Moo

He may not have planned to murder.
 
Musing aloud about mistakes, Delphi murderer/s left phone behind and Idaho students murderer left knife sheath behind. This is interesting to me as Kohberger/Idaho studied criminology but still made mistakes. Wonder if carrying out such cold blooded murder puts them into a cloud of consciousness state for a time so less aware of details. Or, some kind of euphoric power state, with same effect, urgh.
MOO

One shoe and a mobile phone.
Do you really think it was a mistake?
 
It was certainly not the run-of-the mill homicide, and we see a lot of the insane “tentacles” that touched this case… from KAK and Anthony Shots to Odinist symbolism and potential cult sacrifices. I 100% understand why he described the case as he did.

At the end of the day, though, it still seems way more likely that a mistake was made versus everyone involved with the case overlooking the appearance of some pants and disappearance of other pants. Especially the defense that leaves no straw ungrasped.

I still waffle back and forth over whether I think there could have been another person, or people. I wish we knew more, but sadly, that’s not reality right now. What I do know is that even if another person was involved, them transporting another pair of pants (that was owned by one of the girls, nonetheless) to the abduction and murder makes next to no sense and would also seem to imply someone with very close access to the girls was involved, which is, frankly, gross and a pretty fringe theory at this point.

JMO

Well said, and would add that DC's mind may have been particularly alive to the potency of some of the religious/quasi-religious symbolism he saw in the case, especially during the (mercifully) brief "Shack" period of pressers.

It has long been a case whose sensational aspects -- images and audio of the killer, pair of young friends vanishing, the almost gothic setting of the high bridge, etc -- have seemed to overwhelm the murdered girls at its centre, and the viciousness of the acts that left them there. I'd argue also that the investigation itself at times played on these elements, with a sort of gnomic side-commentary on its horrors, bizarreness, ritualistic furniture and the power of the secrets that might someday be revealed about it -- that fabled day when "you will know what we know."

IMO, this will be seen as one of the foundational cases for this era of what we might call the "new-new true crime economy," just previous cases were in their own times, with its front-and-centre characters of investigators, legal figures, commentators, document dumpers, leakers, righteous (and not so righteous) podcasters, and so on, even as family members are left mostly offstage to mourn and wait.

So whilst not much now surprises (or exercises) me about this case, I will be shocked if at the end it doesn't turn out to be the work of a man whose anger and possibly long-held fantasies boiled over on a day unseasonably warm when, as on other days he was ready to act out, and happened to find someone to act out on who fit those fantasies or that anger (or both) in some of the ways he had hoped for.

After that, everything is explicable, even the crazy coincidences (KAK) or the baffling incompetence of parts of the investigation, and RA's years in the shadows will be down to, as always, some combination of specific circumstances, poor protocols and luck.

The rest, I fear, is noise. And as with most such noise, it will diminish but never quite disappear, so long as it is fascinating, useful, profitable, or case-relevant.

Anyway, MOO, IMO, etc.
 
The one thing I’m intrigued about is he obviously knew he had been seen by multiple witnesses and yet he still continued with his plan that day.

Thats so brazen to go ahead when he knew he had been spotted and for all he knew had been recognized from working at CVS.

Moo

He had to have expected there would be people on the trail, just maybe not that many.
He was looking for a moment, an opportunity I think. Maybe he went there often hoping for that opportunity, and that particular day, it showed up.
I think the fact he may have been seen and recognized is the reason he sought out LE to try and convince them if somebody mentions him, it’s all good. And once the BG picture and video came out, if a friend or co-worker said, “Hey, that looks like you” he could say “yea, I was there but that’s not me. I told police I was there”. He problem told folks he had been cleared.

My thoughts on it
 
The one thing I’m intrigued about is he obviously knew he had been seen by multiple witnesses and yet he still continued with his plan that day.

Thats so brazen to go ahead when he knew he had been spotted and for all he knew had been recognized from working at CVS.

Moo

That is why I thought he ALWAYS carried the knife and gun with him and that the girls giggled or looked at him strangely or something at the end of that bridge. Then he went into a rage and didn't even remember momentarily that he had been seen.
 
Does anyone remember this "odd" news story that popped into the public eye for a short period of time and then slowly crept away with little notice?

It's not been lost on me, but is a total enigma.

"In recent months, their investigation has even led them to Indiana to look into a possible connection to the highly publicized Delphi double murders."

/////////////////

The information pointed Boone County investigators toward a specific person who had a specific item they were interested in.

“I’m not going to tell you about what that item was,” Cox said. “We’ve recently been in the northern part of Indiana, investigating this guy, following him around, looking for things, collecting all of the information and evidence that we would need to at least vet him as best we could with our case. "

Investigators looking into possible link between Stephenson murders and Delphi case
 
....
Has anyone ever seen a FM even remotely written or worded in this manner? I have not.
<see emphasis mine>. ....
snipped for focus @girlhasnoname Thx :) for post quoting the FM.
Following case only sporadically, noting that some posts discuss the D team motions as seeming, well, unseemly.

Your examples in this FM bear this out.
Yikes. imo
 
Does anyone remember this "odd" news story that popped into the public eye for a short period of time and then slowly crept away with little notice?

It's not been lost on me, but is a total enigma.

"In recent months, their investigation has even led them to Indiana to look into a possible connection to the highly publicized Delphi double murders."

/////////////////

The information pointed Boone County investigators toward a specific person who had a specific item they were interested in.

“I’m not going to tell you about what that item was,” Cox said. “We’ve recently been in the northern part of Indiana, investigating this guy, following him around, looking for things, collecting all of the information and evidence that we would need to at least vet him as best we could with our case. "

Investigators looking into possible link between Stephenson murders and Delphi

I remember that.
I thought it was weird that the headlines blared about a possible connection between the two cases, but the investigators said himself there didn’t appear to be any, and the few things he mentioned aren’t all that rare n cases like these and were very generalized.




“Based on what they have right now, Cox said they don’t see a connection with the Delphi murders. However, he admits both have very rare similarities in their crime scenes.

A lot of those things, the staging, multiple victims, spending time post-Mortem,” Cox explained. “A lot of those things make these kinds of cases like the one percent kind of cases that you see”.
 
Also, on the Stephenson case….from WRTV

To me it always sounded like the KY investigators, at some point, received a random tip that said Delphi might be connected. They investigated and found nothing. Then they decided to mention in this article the Delphi tip just to get more attention for their case. I’m not a fan of that tactic.

1720646638158.jpeg
 

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