AUS - Khandalyce Kiara Pearce (Wynarka) and mum Karlie Pearce-Stevenson (Belanglo) #9

[JaneSA]

You don't a share in almost $100k was enough to negate the risk for some? Imo to some the risk would be more than worthwhile

No, I really don't think it is enough, Dinky.
Anfter all, at the beginning whoever was taking the money had no idea how long it would keep being available before it stopped due to some form or other not being lodged.
The amount available at the beginning was only Karlie's fortnightly social security payment.
It could have stopped the next month.
I don't think the money was ever the motivator of the crime, and certainly not enough of a motivation for someone not directly connected to the murder to become involved later.
I think using the account was about proof of life and covering the crime.

 

[Oona]

RE SUITCASE
For curiosity's sake, has anyone used google streetview to see if the suitcase is visible in pre-roadwork images of Karoonda Highway? I tried but don't know exactly where it was found. I know that this has been discussed in previous threads, but if it had been there since December 2008 it looks to have held up quite well.

 

[russian_doll]

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/ne...645596184?sv=c21400e4b53492be426e8d6b4b40c276


few more deets here

 

[JaneSA]

Scala of my consternation:

1. Murder of Karlie
1. Murder of Khandalyce
1. Khandalyce's 5 days between Karlie's murder and her own death

2. Conny's and Colleen's fate, sorrows, betrayal (and Khandalyce's bio father, Karlie's stepfather/stepbrother, extended family)

Pause

3. Centrelink/Bank

Totally!

 

[KG1]

Hbayne ....you know I have been here since day one... NO ONE on this thread has ever come out and said..."Hazel is Innocent"...ever!!.....

Some members have put forward their own thought and ideas that "MAYBE" she was duped, conned, deceived by Daniel....just like Karlie's family was..

<modsnip>

So I'm guessing you won't get a big reply...as no members ..have ever said she was...just a few expressing some doubt as to what her involvement actually was.....

Hazel cannot possibly be innocent full stop. The SA police have not come out and stated publicly that Hazel Passmore is an innocent person and not a suspect in any matter/s. From what I have read on this thread, it has been stated a couple of times that she is 'under caution' from the SA police. Innocent people are not placed 'under caution', if this is correct. It is no mere coincidence that a woman in a wheelchair impersonated Karlie at Centrelink and also possibly at a bank (not sure if that person was in a wheelchair) and Hazel Passmore, former partner of accused murderer Daniel Holdom is also in a wheelchair. It beggars belief to think otherwise. The wheelchair impersonator of Karlie and Hazel Passmore are one and the same person, which is why she is under police caution. I fail to understand why there is any doubt in anyone's mind. Regardless of motivation to impersonate another, the end result was a fraud committed on the Australian Government and in turn the Australian taxpayer. Karlie Pearce-Stevenson was not the person in the wheelchair but was represented as such, in order to continue a fraud and theft already well established. This is despicable in my view. Innocent, my foot. MOO BBM

 

[JaneSA]

The women impersonating Karlie was in a wheelchair. Is there some other wheelchair confined woman out there we don't know about ? Seriously it's a no brainier and hopefully Hazel will be dealt with by the law as the conniving thieving woman she is
IMO of course

It is normal that amputees and the families and close friends of amputees tend to generally know a lot of other amputees.
They meet through support groups and rehabilitation programs.
The rehabilitation programs are lengthy and intense.
They share a lot of the same pains and griefs, so tend to become good friends.
So certainly there are numerous other wheelchair bound women around. DH may know quite a few.
It may not seem likely that there is another wheelchair confined woman out there we don't know about, but it is not impossible.

 

[JaneSA]

Can anyone who believes hazel is innocent in all this explain the incredibly coincidence that the person impersonating Karlie was in a wheelchair? The odds are very small that there is another wheelchair bound woman connected to Holden out there ???? Really interested to hear thoughts

I'd just make 2 point about this:

Firstly, given all the misinformation from the police, can we even be sure the woman was ina wheelchair?

Secondly, if the woman was in a wheelchair and if it was HP, and it DH had told her Karlie was in hiding but needed help, could HP have done the impersonating believing she was helping and alive, but hiding Karlie?

I'm not trying to defend HP here, but simply to come up with a scenario that would explain why the police have not charged her with a crime and why she thinks it's all over now and she won't be charged.

If she impersonated Karlie in good faith, certainly she still broke the law, but assuming she has made no personal financial gain, perhaps the mitigating circumstances are enough for the police to decide not to charge her.

 

[SouthAussie]

I'm not trying to defend HP here, but simply to come up with a scenario that would explain why the police have not charged her with a crime and why she thinks it's all over now and she won't be charged.

If she impersonated Karlie in good faith, certainly she still broke the law, but assuming she has made no personal financial gain, perhaps the mitigating circumstances are enough for the police to decide not to charge her.

RSBM

I don't think Passmore thinks it is all over for her now. She feels that she won't be charged as being complicit in the murders.


When asked if she thought her involvement in the investigation was over, Ms Passmore *replied: &#8220;I hope so.
&#8220;I don&#8217;t know (if she will face any charge) ... I don&#8217;t think so. (There will be) no charges in relation to murder, anyway.&#8217;&#8217;

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/ne...645596184?sv=c21400e4b53492be426e8d6b4b40c276

 

[Mrs G Norris]

I for one would not want to be hanging around Centrelink in her neck of the woods. Just sayin...
The whole area is downright scarey.
But then maybe they can compare notes on how to best rort the system, that's support isn't it?

I used to eavesdrop on junkie types all the time for entertainment, and yes .. they do swap notes on how to rort the system, continuously!

 

[KG1]

I'd just make 2 point about this:

Firstly, given all the misinformation from the police, can we even be sure the woman was ina wheelchair?

Secondly, if the woman was in a wheelchair and if it was HP, and it DH had told her Karlie was in hiding but needed help, could HP have done the impersonating believing she was helping and alive, but hiding Karlie?

I'm not trying to defend HP here, but simply to come up with a scenario that would explain why the police have not charged her with a crime and why she thinks it's all over now and she won't be charged.

If she impersonated Karlie in good faith, certainly she still broke the law, but assuming she has made no personal financial gain, perhaps the mitigating circumstances are enough for the police to decide not to charge her.

What is the police misinformation you refer to JaneSA? Could you please post a link in relation to that. Further, as you have put forth a number of times that Hazel may have believed she was helping Karlie (by allegedly impersonating her and allegedly accessing Karlie's money) (Karlie's Centrelink benefit entitlements as a sole parent with a very young child), can you articulate why Karlie may have needed help? I reckon she would have needed a lot of help if she was still alive and her money was stolen fortnightly, but these matters occurred following Karlie's death on 15/16 December 2008. What could have led to the belief in Hazel's mind that Karlie needed help? As Karlie was already dead, who got the money from her bank account/s? Follow the money, Des Bray said!

 

[JaneSA]

RE SUITCASE
For curiosity's sake, has anyone used google streetview to see if the suitcase is visible in pre-roadwork images of Karoonda Highway? I tried but don't know exactly where it was found. I know that this has been discussed in previous threads, but if it had been there since December 2008 it looks to have held up quite well.

Yes, now that is totally bamboozling, isn't it?
We know now that this is not some lonely, isolated stretch of highway, but a well known and marked crossover point to a busy dirt bike track and a popular geocaching area.
The likelihood that the case was there from 2008 and survived the 2014 fire, yet was only seen in 2015 and opened then, seems beyond belief.

 

[DinkyDi]

it is entirely possible that there may never be a trial concerning Karlie's murder. . The NSW Justice Dept may, with agreement with SA and the ACT, although those jurisdictions will not hold a veto card on this, may and most likely will proceed with a murder trial in regard to Khandalyce only.

The reason for that, I suspect , would be that Holdom would have absolutely no defence to it. None. There is no story he can tell a jury that would guarantee him even a minutes listening.


Not that anyone knows why he murdered Karlie. I very much doubt it was a matter of passion, but instead a matter of a small amount of money and the issue of Karlie's 'disobedience' as Holdom would see it. No one knows if he had his big trip across to SA and the NT planned, ,and Karlie jibbed, or he did that trip because he murdered Karlie and Khandalyce.. it will soon be made plain, though.

Or Hazels about to get out of rehab and she needs him.
I mean she was the dominant one after all. &#128514; Imagine this hulky big man full of rage, scared of a chick In a wheelchair.
Geez, of all the lies this one is close to the top of the bs barometer. Poor Daniel so easily lead.

 

[JaneSA]

What is the police misinformation you refer to JaneSA? Could you please post a link in relation to that. Further, as you have put forth a number of times that Hazel may have believed she was helping Karlie (by allegedly impersonating her and allegedly accessing Karlie's money) (Karlie's Centrelink benefit entitlements as a sole parent with a very young child), can you articulate why Karlie may have needed help? I reckon she would have needed a lot of help if she was still alive and her money was stolen fortnightly, but these matters occurred following Karlie's death on 15/16 December 2008. What could have led to the belief in Hazel's mind that Karlie needed help? As Karlie was already dead, who got the money from her bank account/s? Follow the money, Des Bray said!

Sure, happy to KG1.

Regarding misinformation from the police, I posted a list yesterday and included things like saying the Belanglo bones were from a backpacker who had not been in Australia long, that the child was from the Mallee region, and several more.
I am not saying the information was intended to mislead, just that it has since been shown to be incorrect, which may be more the fault of the media than the police.
However, based on that, I wonder if the idea that the woman who went to the bank was in a wheelchair may have been wrong too.

But, as I said above, if the woman was HP (and it may well be), perhaps DH convinced her that the bounty story was true and that Karlie was in hiding and could not attend the bank herself.
That is how I am suggesting HP may have been duped into believing that Karlie was still alive and that she was assisting her to keep her money coming.

I am aware it sounds far-fetched, and I'm not emotionally attached to the theory I am just offering it as a possible alternative that may explain what had been going on and why HP has not being charged.

 

[Puggle]

Hazel cannot possibly be innocent full stop. The SA police have not come out and stated publicly that Hazel Passmore is an innocent person and not a suspect in any matter/s. From what I have read on this thread, it has been stated a couple of times that she is 'under caution' from the SA police. Innocent people are not placed 'under caution', if this is correct. It is no mere coincidence that a woman in a wheelchair impersonated Karlie at Centrelink and also possibly at a bank (not sure if that person was in a wheelchair) and Hazel Passmore, former partner of accused murderer Daniel Holdom is also in a wheelchair. It beggars belief to think otherwise. The wheelchair impersonator of Karlie and Hazel Passmore are one and the same person, which is why she is under police caution. I fail to understand why there is any doubt in anyone's mind. Regardless of motivation to impersonate another, the end result was a fraud committed on the Australian Government and in turn the Australian taxpayer. Karlie Pearce-Stevenson was not the person in the wheelchair but was represented as such, in order to continue a fraud and theft already well established. This is despicable in my view. Innocent, my foot. MOO BBM

KG1...I have never said Hazel was innocent or guilty...to be honest...I'm just a bystander awaiting evidence...I don't think I have expressed an opinion either way...lol...may have..but am sure that would only have been on one of my *Party Nights*...and I wouldn't remember in that case...

 

[JaneSA]

Ditto, Puggle.
We don't have the facts so we cannot possibly know.
Only fact we do have is that HP has not been charged, so we can all base assumptions on that - but they are only assumptions.

 

[DinkyDi]

Sure, happy to KG1.

Regarding misinformation from the police, I posted a list yesterday and included things like saying the Belanglo bones were from a backpacker who had not been in Australia long, that the child was from the Mallee region, and several more.
I am not saying the information was intended to mislead, just that it has since been shown to be incorrect, which may be more the fault of the media than the police.
However, based on that, I wonder if the idea that the woman who went to the bank was in a wheelchair may have been wrong too.

But, as I said above, if the woman was HP (and it may well be), perhaps DH convinced her that the bounty story was true and that Karlie was in hiding and could not attend the bank herself.
That is how I am suggesting HP may have been duped into believing that Karlie was still alive and that she was assisting her to keep her money coming.

I am aware it sounds far-fetched, and I'm not emotionally attached to the theory I am just offering it as a possible alternative that may explain what had been going on and why HP has not being charged.

Keep her money coming where? To Daniel? To her? Or do you think they forwarded it?

 

[KG1]

KG1...I have never said Hazel was innocent or guilty...to be honest...I'm just a bystander awaiting evidence...I don't think I have expressed an opinion either way...lol...may have..but am sure that would only have been on one of my *Party Nights*...and I wouldn't remember in that case...

As I stated in my post, MOO, it is my opinion only, and not referenced to any poster Puggle. I personally do not believe that the person, HP, is an entirely innocent party in relation to the frauds and whilst I do not believe she had an active role in either murder, I know no more than that. I do not know if she was aware of the murders, aware if/when they were going to happen, aware if they were pre meditated or aware after they had been committed. But unless she is a very naive person, who is easily hoodwinked, surely she had questions in relation to the whereabouts of Karlie and Khandalyce. I doubt that one could be told such a fantastic story, which would be believed, to explain the absence of Karlie and Khandalyce. The use of bankcard, bank account, impersonation thereof, possession of at least one birth certificate, to me, is tantamount to knowing a person is dead, and never has the capacity to come back and blow the lid off the whole scam. Again, my opinion/s.

 

[JaneSA]

Keep her money coming where? To Daniel? To her? Or do you think they forwarded it?

<modsnip>
I'm not wedded to this idea in any way.
It's JUST an idea.
Just idle speculation trying to tie lose ends together.
<modsnip>[/B]

So, to explain...
Since Karlie was already dead, the person using her account was most likely her killer (allegedly DH).
Either the killer was simply accessing some spare cash, or they thought that by keeping the back account active it made it seem as if Karlie was still alive.

That works fine until a letter or call (he had her phone) arrives from the bank requiring something (no idea what) that means Karlie must attend in person.

Perhaps this is the point when DH concocts the story that Karlie is on the run due to a debt or a bounty.
In any case, that story clearly gets to her family and to Connie's carer, as we know.

So if DH presents the "Karlie is on the run and can't return to SA" story to HP, possibly she agrees to impersonate Karlie at the bank to help her out.

If DH did concoct the "Karlie is on the run" story, he probably said he was laying a false trail and sending the cash on to Karlie at a secret location.

As I said - all pure speculation.

 

[Puggle]

As I stated in my post, MOO, it is my opinion only, and not referenced to any poster Puggle. I personally do not believe that the person, HP, is an entirely innocent party in relation to the frauds and whilst I do not believe she had an active role in either murder, I know no more than that. I do not know if she was aware of the murders, aware if/when they were going to happen, aware if they were pre meditated or aware after they had been committed. But unless she is a very naive person, who is easily hoodwinked, surely she had questions in relation to the whereabouts of Karlie and Khandalyce. I doubt that one could be told such a fantastic story, which would be believed, to explain the absence of Karlie and Khandalyce. The use of bankcard, bank account, impersonation thereof, possession of at least one birth certificate, to me, is tantamount to knowing a person is dead, and never has the capacity to come back and blow the lid off the whole scam. Again, my opinion/s.

KG1...sorry it is way past my bedtime here...just heading off....yes...you would think she asked questions - in August 2008 she posted pictures of Khandalyce and her own children at a car show together on her FB account....so there was an obvious connection there between her and Karlie....how it played out..I am not sure...Karlie's own Family members were obviously duped...was Hazel too??..... I really don't know the answer to that question....

 

[Panda]

In my opinion, if the police are now saying the suitcase was been on the side of the road from the get go, whereas before they thought it had only been dumped there earlier this year, I think someone has spilt the beans. So either Holdom has started to talk (which I doubt, given his reticent attitude so far) or, someone else has stepped up and provided the information. Given that Passmore has been interviewed a number of times under caution and I believe is viewed as a suspect regarding the fraud side of things, I speculate whether it is her who maybe singing like a canary. Given her past relationship with Holdom, she would in my opinion have a lot of intimate knowledge regarding the murders. The other scenario could be (once again in my opinion) Holdom's sister, as Khandalcye's birth certificate was found at her premises.

To me it is logical that someone else would have intimate knowledge of what has happened, apart from Holdom, and this person would be someone that Holdom either has had a relationship with, or has a relationship with - either familial or otherwise - either a girlfriend or family member.