It is so frustrating that people the media and now the general population connect being socially inept with Autism. There is a major difference and it is hurtful and ignorant. You can be socially inept due to a multitude of different reasons, not just due to a disorder, mental health issues, etc. When it is in the case of someone like GT and ER it is the extreme narcissism that tends to point towards a narcissistic type disorder. Can I check Isisrising, is it now more common that someone who would previously have been diagnosed as a sociopath/psychopath would now be labelled as having anti-social personality disorder at times coupled with narcissitic personality disorder to varying degrees? I am sure it is not that straight forward but I know that they have refined and changed some definitions in recent years. GT and ER show self awareness to an extent (in that they cannot see their own behaviour is the cause) but cover it up with extreme narcissism and hatred of all others due to their extreme feelings of inadequacy, insecurity, etc. When I think of the way their minds seem to work, I cannot help but imagine a tightly wound up wet tea towel or something along those lines...that just keeps winding until it breaks...
Australia - Warriena Wright, 26, dies in balcony fall, Surfers Paradise, Aug 2014 #1
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Rejection for normal people is not awesome, but most of us can handle it and move on. For someone who thinks they are the "pinnacle of man" based on disordered thinking and they are constantly rejected - the hit must be a million times worse over and over again. The frustration builds up and builds up, they lack self awareness and therefore cannot work out that they need to adjust that behaviour, the clock keeps ticking and they finally snap.
MsAnais
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BBM
In the DSM-V (which is the American diagnostic reference book that is used by all psychiatrists and psychologists here in Aus) a sociopath or psychopath would be diagnosed with Antisocial Personality Disorder.
It gets confusing because there are books out there in bookshops/online saying that APD is not the same as psychopathy - but in terms of a diagnosis that is legally recognised, all mental health practitioners use the DSM - therefore someone who is a psychopath in Australia would be diagnosed as having APD.
And Narcissistic Personality Disorder often goes hand in hand with it.......
Hope that makes sense.:seeya:
Not to steal any fundamental invoicing from our mental health professionals, but there is a DSM http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/DSM-5 The Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, which will explain the 10 diagnoses of personality disorder we hear discussed.
If any of these issues are causing you some impairment, or manifesting in behavioural demonstrations, then you may be running for election as mayor of crazy town, and need some assistance. Unfortunately by the time the demonstrations of the disordered behaviour become palpable, someone has been hurt, there is a court action, or law enforcement is involved and the notion of the problem being a mental health issue, becomes irrelevant. Personality disorder is not insane, it is just in pain.
If any of these issues are causing you some impairment, or manifesting in behavioural demonstrations, then you may be running for election as mayor of crazy town, and need some assistance. Unfortunately by the time the demonstrations of the disordered behaviour become palpable, someone has been hurt, there is a court action, or law enforcement is involved and the notion of the problem being a mental health issue, becomes irrelevant. Personality disorder is not insane, it is just in pain.
MsAnais
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Great description!!
And yes, someone like GT completely lacks the 'inner scaffolding' that a 'healthy' person has. His internal coping mechanisms would be minimal - thus he seems to turn to alcohol to block everything out. So instead of examining his feelings, he just ups the alcohol.
At his core, this is a very shaky insecure guy. The degree to which he's overcompensating for that with his online swagger is almost comical.....except that it's hurting both him and lots of women.
I wish he'd gone and gotten some help.
Therapy, therapy, therapy!!!
MsAnais
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Great link, BigT!:seeya:
And it's Cluster B in Personality Disorders that we're referring to here.
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pers...dramatic.2C_emotional_or_erratic_disorders.29
Thank you Isisrising that confirms exactly what I was thinking - so a sociopath or psychopath is at the top of the chain as such but within that diagnosis is a component of Antisocial Personality Disorder and possibly Narcissistic Personality Disorder. That clears up the gaps in my limited knowledge :seeya:
The question I have is and it is something that sometimes ends up leaving me sitting on the fence with my opinions in some aspects - is someone diagnosed with NPD or APD capable of self awareness? If so does the disorder cause them to ignore it or do they choose to?
In that regard then, can these types of people ever expect to be able to gain insight into their disorder and seek help in time? Or does it generally take an escalation of this sort to identify?
Also due to a person of this type displaying behaviours that are so difficult to deal with it seems that most people would not be able to stick around to be supportive, etc. Most people would after either being used by this person, treated poorly, etc. would bail and move on, tired of being hurt. The only people who remain friends are those who share similar characteristics to differing extents - either worse or not as bad. In that sense then, it must be difficult to rehabilitate someone who behaves like this. Can you use CBT (Cognitive Behavioural Therapy) to assist them with changing the way they process as such?
New acronym for brainbuilder.com sub culture TTT.
Maybe we can have RAA's (rational attitude artist)
MsAnais
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I've got to say, I'm no expert in personality disorders. I've worked with clients with antisocial pd and narcissistic pd but it is not my field of expertise.
So with that proviso, I believe that their capacity for developing insight is extremely limited - if not impossible - as a personality disorder is a deeply integrated way of being. It's not just a surface thing. The DSM-V explains it better than I ever could!! (bbm):
Watching that presentation by Warriena is soul crushing.
This one is very close to home for me as I live directly opposite Avalon and have looked upon it for years. Knowing something so frightening happened so close by, coupled with my lifelong fear of falling to my death, gives me the shivers.
Guys like GT are dime a dozen on the Goldie. His exercising of his right to remain silent just creates more suspicions. The tox report should clear up whether she took something (knowingly or not) and went over the balcony suffering from a reaction, scared and disoriented. That's my unfounded and unsubstantiated hunch at this time. I don't think he threw her over though.
This one is very close to home for me as I live directly opposite Avalon and have looked upon it for years. Knowing something so frightening happened so close by, coupled with my lifelong fear of falling to my death, gives me the shivers.
Guys like GT are dime a dozen on the Goldie. His exercising of his right to remain silent just creates more suspicions. The tox report should clear up whether she took something (knowingly or not) and went over the balcony suffering from a reaction, scared and disoriented. That's my unfounded and unsubstantiated hunch at this time. I don't think he threw her over though.
Thanks IR, I am currently locked in litigation with a classic personality, and have locked away some of these links in my understanding of what I am dealing with.
I like Theodore Millions breakdown of cluster B. I am however nearing the conclusion that there is little hope for the sufferer of NPD though, seems they would rather rewrite history to suit their strong firm view, than even consider reason or rationale.
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Narcissistic_personality_disorder#Millon.27s_subtypes
MsAnais
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Oh thank you for your information
That is all helpful and I understand where you are coming from. I can see now where someone like this, who is not psychotic or delusional at the time the crime or violence occurred or has another major mental health impairment that could cause them to act a certain way, is responsible for their actions. Regardless of disordered thinking, he would have been aware of what he was doing. I am sure he is going to use the alcoholic blackout defence which is just bollocks. If he had the presence of mind to take off soon after...he was not blackout drunk. I do wonder if the person who was immediately on scene to call police was this Tony Ongert? GT kept running but Tony called emergency services? Unless someone was walking past as she fell on the path below?Thanks Isisrising!
I joined up once GBC went to trial but then I went overseas and forgot about my membership, but have read here for years.
MsAnais
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Oh thank you for your information
Exactly - he was lucid enough to get out of there AND call his friend.......not blotto!!! (there goes that argument, GT!!)
And yes, someone with a personality disorder is not psychotic - that's a whole different deal altogether. Personality disordered people know what is right and wrong, according to society's rules.
I think someone in the flats nearby saw her fall and called emergency (from memory). And someone down below did indeed see her body - who knows if it was TO??
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I think someone waiting for a bus found/seen her?
Hello humije,
Welcome to Websleuths!
I think you might be right in some ways - I think it could be two possibilities - he had something to do with causing her fall either deliberately or accidentally. The first way was during or attempting to have sex with Rrie he lifted her on the balcony and because they were drunk he dropped her and she went over the balcony or she rejected him and in his drunken state, he picked her up and shoved or threw her off the balcony. The 3 screams and sounds of a disturbance proceeding the fall seem to suggest things were occurring that she was not happy with as opposed to play fighting as such. Maybe he was holding her up, stirring her, pretending he was going to drop her and she was screaming. Maybe he lost his grip and she fell. Either way - whether it was murder or a shocking accident - he needs to be held responsible for his actions. The tox report alone will show they were intoxicated but I don't think that will totally clear up the whole story if you know what I mean?
That's a good bus service, running at 2.30 AM on a Friday.
Amee
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The body was found by a passer-by at the base of an apartment building in Surfers Paradise in the early hours of Friday.
Police don't know whether Mr Tostee was at home at the time of Ms Wright's fall, but neighbours reported hearing 'fighting' before the incident occured at about 2:30am.
https://au.news.yahoo.com/a/2471173...public-plea-as-police-deny-sex-tape-seizures/
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