Australia Australia - William Tyrrell, 3, Kendall, NSW, 12 Sep 2014 - #69

[sleepinoz]

If William was walking away in front of FFC, then she should have been, in my opinion, looking out for blue (as William's Spiderman outfit was blue on the back of it).
Police planted the Spiderman suit and hid in bushland waiting for Paul Savage.(Supplied: NSW Local Court)

You would still expect to see red - according to these photo's

William Tyrrell: Never before seen photos released five years to the day of Kendall disappearance | Daily Mail Online

 

[sleepinoz]

I can't quite keep track: but the various cars that FM saw - wouldn't they have appeared on CCTV?

Not necessarily if they didn't drive by the Tennis Club.

More about the cars on CCTV at the Tennis Club, the Police called all that possibly drove past the Club to turn up and ID themselves.


Officers were at the tennis club from 10am until 2pm on Sunday with photos of all cars that passed the club the morning of September 12.

Those who drove past at that time were asked to call by the club on Sunday to eliminate themselves from the investigation.

Acting Inspector Kerrie Brill said police were "very, very pleased with the level of support from the community".

Police to continue William Tyrell investigation with club

 

[sleepinoz]

There's also a spot in Sydney's eastern beaches known as Grassy Knoll! North Bondi Grassy Knoll
North Bondi Grassy Knoll

And a Beer named Grassy Knoll in Australia - it gets used a bit.

https://www.grassyknollbrewing.com.au/

 

[SouthAussie]

For those asking about the reported confirmation of FM's camera time, it was reported as 'exclusive' by Caroline Overington, Literary Editor, 12:00AM September 2, 2019:

Probe ordered into William Tyrrell’s last photograph

The Australian understands an expert in photographic metadata has been called in after NSW police admitted to confusion as to when the widely circulated image was taken. The photograph is a crucial piece of evidence, because it provides what is known as “proof of life” for William on the day of his disappearance on the NSW mid-north coast.

. . .

The report, obtained by The Australian, was generated by X-Ways forensic software. It reveals the image is a .jpg created on a digital camera, and it says: “Created: 12/09/2014 07:39:54. Corrected time: 12/09/2014 09:37:44.”

That app is available online for purchase by anyone and CO's article does not name the 'expert in photographic metadata' who used the software to produce the report.

X-Ways Forensics: Integrated Computer Forensics Software

I think confirmation of the result of the photo time re-examination - as published by the DT - is what is wanted. Not the original confirmation that the police sought (which is what is referenced in your post, and in the 2,000 page police brief).

You will see in these screenshots (and likely other places) that the Coroner's order for the re-examination was on Sept 2, 2019.

 

[sleepinoz]

I think confirmation of the photo time re-examination - as published by the DT - is what is wanted. Not the original confirmation that the police sought (which is what is referenced in your post, and in the 2,000 page police brief).

You will see in these screenshots (and likely other places) that the Coroner's order for the re-examination was on Sept 2, 2019.

View attachment 340268 View attachment 340269

Which wasn't, as some members have stated, the 'end' of the Inquest. From memory there were a couple of more tranches after that, and it was never mentioned during those tranches.

 

[JBowie]

I think confirmation of the result of the photo time re-examination - as published by the DT - is what is wanted. Not the original confirmation that the police sought (which is what is referenced in your post, and in the 2,000 page police brief).

You will see in these screenshots (and likely other places) that the Coroner's order for the re-examination was on Sept 2, 2019.

View attachment 340268 View attachment 340269

So the report that police tendered as evidence to the inquest (using the X-Ways software) was then called into question because of confusion among people about EXIF file dates terminology?

I thought it was the bio father, through his lawyer at the inquest, who requested that the photo's dates be checked/verified?

 

[SouthAussie]

So the report that police tendered as evidence to the inquest (using the X-Ways software) was then called into question because of confusion among people about EXIF file dates terminology?

I thought it was the bio father, through his lawyer at the inquest, who requested that the photo's dates be checked/verified?

Yes, and yes.

It had been forensically examined. The BD requested that it be examined again.

 

[Couldbe]

You would still expect to see red - according to these photo's

William Tyrrell: Never before seen photos released five years to the day of Kendall disappearance | Daily Mail Online

Thank you for the photos link; I do concede that there would be some red, but from the rear I think the blue colour would dominate.
The searchers would have that aspect covered I would think. In any case, sadly William wasn't found.
I do notice in those photos how very thin William appears to be.

 

[sleepinoz]

Thank you for the photos link; I do concede that there would be some red, but from the rear I think the blue colour would dominate.
The searchers would have that aspect covered I would think. In any case, sadly William wasn't found.
I do notice in those photos how very thin William appears to be.

Your welcome.

I have to disagree with that, I think the red, being at the top, would be the most noticeable. Either way, there would be some of both visible to any searcher IMO. Maybe that was mentioned as the red is dominate overall.

And yes it is very sad he wasn't found.

I have to disagree with how thin he looks, he looks the same (similar) weight as most of the other photo's of him.

 

[SouthAussie]

And have we ever heard about the Taxi Driver's statement about seeing a Holden Commodore???
Where was the Taxi Driver when he saw this?? And what colour was this Commodore?? And what was in the box trailer???

A taxi driver had seen a Holden Commodore with a box trailer
William Tyrrell inquest: Foster mum gave different, contradictory accounts about day boy vanished - NZ Herald

I think the taxi driver is probably the loner who lived in the creepy house. Those paragraphs (around that info) in that article seem to be all sightings (or non-sightings) of vehicles on the street.

The loner was an ex-taxi driver, which accounted for his nocturnal hours IIRC.

And that is the only info about a commodore and a box trailer that I recall.

Here is an old post about it that will steer you to the previous convo.

Australia - Australia - William Tyrrell, 3, Kendall, Nsw, 12 Sept 2014 - #54

 

[drsleuth]

Which wasn't, as some members have stated, the 'end' of the Inquest. From memory there were a couple of more tranches after that, and it was never mentioned during those tranches.

Correct Sleep, it was on the last day in Lidcombe ( 26/8/19 ) before the 6 month break when it started up again in Taree on the 9/3/2020.

Applications & submissions are made often in court , they all don't get reported on by the media & we often hear no more about them.
If the Coroner is satisfied that the application has been dealt with than, IMO that's the end of it, the coroner doesn't have to release her "findings" of every application / submission to the public.

 

[drsleuth]

The scream in the bush scenario really stood out to me. A child has just gone missing, you are searching for him, you hear a child scream in the bushes but you think, "Nah, probably not relevant"? I have tried and tried to understand the thought patterns there, but I cannot. I think I'd be pummelling into the bush at a rate of knots yelling or, if I didn't think that was the primary focus (as she claimed) I'd at least send someone else in there straight away. I just don't think it happened at all.

It wasn't bush, it was the reeds near the bus stop on the corner of Benaroon drive & Batar Creek.

The FFC also did look in the drains there too ( but didn't go in them ) , which is in amongst the reeds.

If William was there he would have been easily seen IMO



Google Maps

 

[JBowie]

Applications & submissions are made often in court , they all don't get reported on by the media & we often hear no more about them.

Media reps can make their own requests for documents, and I guess if a particular journo receives a document then when they report its contents they claim an 'exclusive'.

Applications by media to access coronial documents or any other material concerning a coronial inquest must be made through the Department of Communities and Justice media unit - external site .

Access to coronial documents

 

[TootsieFootsie]

Red or Orange are the colours that stand out more to the human eye. Blue, not so much.

https://www.colorbux.com/articles/what-color-catches-human-eye-most

 

[SleepyJoe]

When looked out from behind, the Spiderman suit that William was allegedly wearing the morning of 12/9/14 was mainly blue with a thin strip of red across the shoulders going down the arms, and the bottoms of the legs being red as well. I've always thought it a bit strange that fFFC repeatedly said that she was looking for 'red' and never mentioned the 'blue'.

 

[SleepyJoe]

It wasn't bush, it was the reeds near the bus stop on the corner of Benaroon drive & Batar Creek.

The FFC also did look in the drains there too ( but didn't go in them ) , which is in amongst the reeds.

If William was there he would have been easily seen IMO

View attachment 340273

Google Maps

Whether it was 'bush' or 'reeds', from her own account it doesn't sound like she thoroughly investigated where she heard the scream come from.

 

[drsleuth]

Imo, a big deal was made at the end of inquest when the coroner stated that the last photos of W would need to be forensically examined by an independent professional source in regard to the discrepancy in times... which big deal was highly reported in MSM. I know myself and many others have been waiting for those results to be published, as it seems like a hanging thread/question unanswered. My belief is that since what seemed like a big deal had been made about the time discrepancies in the photos, the outcome would not go without ever being reported on, there would be no reason for that. I got the impression that because of the time discrepancies in the last proof of life for William, a veil of doubt had been cast upon the FPs, and it would only be fair to them to report the results as soon as possible once they were back from the independent professional forensics.

If there was indeed an answer to the photo time discrepancies, no matter the outcome, it seems there ought to have been a press release, or a statement issued by the coroner herself, or something which was made available to ALL news media, rather than just one media company reporting to have this information 'confirmed', to the exclusion of all others, but yet at the same time, failing to mention the source of said information. In the past when the coroner has released certain things in regard to this case, such as little video clips, photos, and etc., the information was widely reported by numerous media outlets, with it also being stated that the coroner had released the said certain things.

For myself, this tidbit of information is similar to whichever media outlet had recently reported that LE had eyed FGM as a POI as well as FM... I believe that was only reported by one company as well, and also with no source. Just because it's in MSM doesn't make it true, we have seen many many reporting errors made in this case over the years. imo.

Actually IMO it wasn't made a "big deal" of at the inquest. It was briefly mentioned in open court , the coroner & Mr Craddock responed that they would be forensically looked into & than we heard no more about it.

IMO the photos were found to be correct & taken when they said they were.

The current police theory.

The Coroner is under no obligation to release anything, until her final report.

For all we know the info could have been leaked to the DT by the company who investigated the metadata. (I saw the company name recently, and looked for the info again but haven't had any luck in re-finding it so far.)
Or it could have been leaked by a police source who feels that balanced info should be out there.

I am really not concerned with justifying the info. The media source is usually a credible one, in my experience.
People here, on this website, pay for subscriptions to the DT because they are generally a decent source of information.
.

Me either & I agree SA

Well it stands to reason that if FM was involved and managed to convince everyone she wasn't for man years, and has gotten away with it for all this time, then she would be a very, very, very, very, very good liar. Some people are, and the lack of public scrutiny hasn't helped determine the likelihood of this. Also, as we all know, people are very good at rationalising lies to themselves to make them easier to tell.

There is a lot of rationalising in FM's comments/interviews. Explaining why the children were in the beds with their parents (not something I would ever have questioned because we slept with our parents heaps as kids, as I'm sure many did). Explaining why she thought almost everything she did. Explaining that William deliberately crashed his bike. Explaining why they stopped at McDonalds. It's not that these explanations aren't necessarily legitimate, and some people are over-explainers, but a lot of them are thoroughly unnecessary.

I really don't know how someone could remember all their thought patterns from that period, either. Panic interferes with memory like that, and I'm sure we all have experience of it. Filling in gaps later is completely unreliable as well, and the detail with FM - not just in terms of what she actually did but in terms of why - increased and changed. And yes people can remember more things, but I wouldn't imagine that is as applicable to in a panic state when the brain isn't actually recording the information. (Based on some of my own experiences and that of others and discussions about it.)

She didn't walk through. As per her story she started to walk through and then changed her mind because she didn't immediately see something and made different decisions about the sound. That's a cursory look.

But ultimately I come back to the fact that there is very little reliability in a lot of things that have been said about that day for the reasons explained above. What that means is something else, but I don't have much trust in the apparent certainty that surrounds FM's commentary.

ETA: And yes, if someone is lying often it is based around the truth, so there would be snippets of clues in the lies.

BBM : she would have been asked a million times about her movwements & actions that day ( and from when she left Sydney ) right down to the minute details . Police interviews are VERY detailed IMO & from my own personal experience .

I see no problem in her language or commentary. God forbid any of us are ever in her shoes , so to speak & have strangers picking & pulling apart her every word

Thank you for the photos link; I do concede that there would be some red, but from the rear I think the blue colour would dominate.
The searchers would have that aspect covered I would think. In any case, sadly William wasn't found.
I do notice in those photos how very thin William appears to be.

I don't think he looks thin at all IMO

 

[Travelling Wilbury]

I am sorry, but I am not seeing what part of "I went walking through" means that she started to walk through and changed her mind.

“I went walking through, went on top of that grassy knoll.
“I got into the bush and I thought I can’t see any red.

The reeds and long grass are before the bush in the area she is speaking of. She would have to walk through them to achieve 'I got into the bush'. imo

View attachment 340240
Google Maps

I am happy to agree to disagree on this matter.

Heres the green thumb coming out in me now

In September in Oz, most grasses have set seed and fall off easily. If the FFFC walked through these “reeds” or grass, which probably would’ve looked the same in the same location in the attached link, would’ve been all over her clothes. Did witnesses say she was covered in seeds?
2-D7-D80-CB-A443-4-CE2-A164-2-D3-C8-DABE74-B

 

[SleepyJoe]

From my medical perspective, when I have zoomed in on the photo of William in the "roar" photo, he does look unusually thin for a 3yo. In addition, he has quite prominent dark circles under his eyes. It made me wonder about his state of health at the time the photo was taken.

 

[drsleuth]

Whether it was 'bush' or 'reeds', from her own account it doesn't sound like she thoroughly investigated where she heard the scream come from.

I disagree & happy to leave it at that.

I heard her evidence , no she didn't do a forensic search, but IMO William would have easily been seen if he was in the reeds & she did look in the drains too .