Australia Australia - William Tyrrell, 3, Kendall, Nsw, 12 Sept 2014 - #60

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SLouTh said:
I wonder where they got that info from regarding mobile phone and FF left at 9:30am????

Teal car at approx 9:10am

This is our old timeline for that morning....

12/09/'14
6-7am Children get up
7-7.30 FM gets up and opens curtains to see 2 strange cars parked across the road from her house between AMS house and number 35's house.
7.30 - Dress, get ready for the day

8.30 Breakfast FM FGM and Kids - Scrambled egg and toast and orange juice

8.40 - AMS reverses out of her house to take her child to daycare to arrive at 9am. Says there are no cars parked on the street that day when she leaves.
8.55-9.00 MFC leaves, FFC said in her evidence that the MFC had already left when kids were riding bikes on the driveway.
9.00 - Mrs Wilson hears little children outside, leaves house? Doesn't notice any strange cars in the street.
9.03 - FM calls BS, can't remember which phone she uses (she used the landline), leaves a message asking about when the part arrives
9.10? - Kids riding bikes in the driveway, FM notices an Ltd teal coloured car do a 3 point turn in the next door neighbours driveway, remembers driver,

9.00 - 9.15 - FF heads off for a teleconference at Lakewoodhad prescription filled at chemist in Lakewood at 10:19am.

9.10- FM plays with WT in the backyard that overlooks Benaroon Dr. Notices the 2 parked cars that she noticed earlier that day are still parked there, tries to get WT to climb a tree
9.30-9.35 Crabbb's get home
9.37- the last of 5 photos is taken of WT in his spiderman outfit while playing on the back deck, The kids have been drawing pictures to take to the cemetery later in the day

9.37 Heather leaves for Bingo

9.59 Savage on phone for 8 Minutes by Der Beaucroft

10.10-10.15 Crabbs heard car ( they said about 40mins after they got home )

*** 10.05 - 10.15 Estimated time of disappearance by Det Lara Beaucroft ..
*** 10:10 by Laidlaw

10.07 Savage on telephone - Det LBeaucroft


10.15 - 10.30 - WT is playing Mummy Tiger and hiding game around the side of the house, WT is bored and restless waiting for FF to return, FM expecting a text from FF that usually states he will be home in 5 minutes. FM says to kids shall we go down the front and look for Daddy's car'
10.19 - FF has script filled - Lakewood chemist
10.30? - The Crabbes at 51 both noticed hearing a car driving up Benaroon dr, turning and driving away fast, they thought it sounded like the postie. So if that car left the street it went out the Batar Creek rd end of the street.
10.30 approx,- FF states he sent a text via Siri that he is 5 minutes away.
10.30 - FM notices it's quiet and start looking for WT
10.30 - 10.35 - LH is unpacking groceries from her car, she sees the man opposite on his ride on mower when she comes in and gives him a wave. Didn't hear or see any cars.
9.37 Heather Savage leaves for Bingo and doesn’t see anything
10.40 - FM is at the front gate of AMS place, meeting for the 1st time, AMS notices she can hear a male calling out for WT from the area behind the FGM's house, begins to start help searching. Because she knows someone is searching uphill she decides to head down towards the Batar Creek rd end of Benaroon Dr. It seems the women split at Ellendale rd. AMS goes down to the bus stop but has no recollection of seeing the man on his ride on mower at that stage. When she returns up the street she sees the FM coming out of Ellendale and the FM says to her, he has hit his head and can't respond or he is not here and now I have to call the police.

10.41 Savage on Phone to X-ray - Det L Beaucroft

10.45 Ronald Chapman’s sees Beige 4WD with child in the back in Laurel Street
statement signed and walkthrough interview April 2017 -LH

10.56 - FM calls the police from her mother’s landline, her husband has arrived home somewhere in this time and is searching frantically.. - FM stayed home to care for daughter while FD searched
11.00 Rowley first saw job
11.06 Rowley arrives @ #48 Benaroon - doorknocked and looked around houses, canvassed every house and business that may have had CCTV showing vehicles entering or leaving area, identified someone at local café had asked for directions, first spoke with FM about cars she saw 3 days later(15th)
11.30 ish Inspector Aldridge & Harper arrive
12.30 Snr Cn Williams arrived ( Land & search co-ordinator )
‘lunchtime’ SES coordinator Paul Burg arrived
12.45 Snr Cn Wendy Hudson arrived with her 2 sons - off duty at the time, took William’s sister aside and asked if she recalled anything & if William had any hiding places, sister couldn’t think of any. Attended home of ‘bit strange’ neighbour
13.00 Greg Newton arrived (PS’s BIL) - saw Paul Savage standing in street with locals (when he left on 13th he could not recall anyone stopping him as he left)
Click to expand...


Does anyone know what time FM went for a drive to look for William in FGM car
 
Green beans said:
Does anyone know what time FM went for a drive to look for William in FGM car
Click to expand...
Before 10.35. MFC arrived back at Benaroon at 10.35. She did an initial search of the yard, then the house, opening all the cupboards and then went down to Batar Creek rd to as far as the riding school and returned to the house. When she arrived home she saw the text from MFC and he arrived within a minute at 10.35 whereupon she informed him WT was missing, asking him was he with him. He then took off, looking for him and FFC made her 1st approach to a neighbour's house across the road to AMS's place. AMS could already hear the MFC calling out and searching for WT.
 
Estelle said:
If FC's car/houses etc were bugged....they must have sound nerves/discipline to never have discussed what happened! .... if they did do something? I'm so torn on this case!!!!! Don't want to judge! Even GJ said don't judge based on media! But he has judged them! (But I guess he has personally dealt with them for 7 years, so is allowed!). But even him speaking up in the media, is adding fuel to it all! What is going on???
Click to expand...

BBM I've often wondered why she didn't give herself more time before calling 000? [/QUOTE]


Do you remember the story I posted in the upthreads about FM & FC going for a pointless drive from their North Sydney homes? The Media were following them. Just speculation here, maybe they used to go for drives in Kendall and discuss things on their "drives", possibly suspecting bugs in the house. Why would you for a pointless drive to airport and traffic is a nightmare? To get out of the house or possibly discuss things? IMO
 
JLZ said:
I think they were riding their bikes at 9:45 which is when FFC saw the third car turn in the Millers' drive, sandy-haired man.
Click to expand...

Think it was earlier than that JLZ.

From my notes, it was after MFC left as she remembers the car not being there.

This is the sequence of events I have until William vanished............

All after 9am
Riding bikes on driveway & saw car turn @ Miller's
Next event FFC recalled was FFC & William went outside to the trees & playing " mummy monsters"
FFC slipped & scratched hand
Played about 5 mins
Went back inside & talked about going to FFC father's grave
Kid art
Went out to patio, kids started drawing
FFC & FGM sat out on patio
William started to get bored
Daddy Tiger
Photos taken x 5 , last one 09:37
This was before decided to have cup of tea.
William was bouncing on & off the patio near the clothes line ( had no shoes on ) was muddy with bindiis
Got William to put shoes on
After William put shoes on, William & sister picked up drawings & took inside
FFG stayed outside
Time for morning tea
FFC put kettle on
Nanna's hat was removed from the table
Sat down to have cup of tea
William's sister still drawing
William playing Daddy Tiger
William was getting bored
Got out dice, William played game 30 - 60 seconds
William got bored again
While making cups of tea William's sister was with FFC & William was in & out
Played Daddy Tiger again
FFC was letting tea cool abit before drinking
William was running around corner close to clothes line ( only once ) roaring like a tiger.
FFC hears a loud roar , was talking with FGM, than hears nothing, too quite, get s up " I walk around, I can't see him ( crying ) William where are you ? I can't see you. Said to mum " He's not here "
" I was looking for red, I couldn't see any red. I raced around. I said to mum he's not here"
" Go inside , open everything"
" Go outside, he's not here. I go down the side between us & the Miller's & all I can think is where is the red? I can't see him. He's gone.
 
silverau said:
This is a great point and I fo you shared.

I do think though in this case, years had passed when she was giving her this interview. She wasn't there, in the moment like CS's mum was (18 days)
Click to expand...
I did the original comment about the "birds weren't singing" was from the 60 Minutes interview exactly a year after William's disappearance. She did a walk through of the disappearance and I found it "off". It's the same interview were the female police officer says that something is "off" and William isn't missing, something else has happened.
 
drsleuth said:
I'm not sure that is correct, as all the evidence I heard at the inquest said he left just before 9am
Click to expand...
Hi Doc ..... just wondering IF this could be the reason behind the current investigation???

Have digital records been found to be not consistent with verbal statements? When they were double checked, or more info obtained???

Otherwise it is definitely a struggle to understand or comprehend.....
 
Do you remember the story I posted in the upthreads about FM & FC going for a pointless drive from their North Sydney homes? The Media were following them. Just speculation here, maybe they used to go for drives in Kendall and discuss things on their "drives", possibly suspecting bugs in the house. Why would you for a pointless drive to airport and traffic is a nightmare? To get out of the house or possibly discuss things? IMO
Click to expand...

Interesting- they went for a drive to the beach on the fourth day of him missing too I think? car not bugged then.
 
iiiii's said:
Before 10.35. MFC arrived back at Benaroon at 10.35. She did an initial search of the yard, then the house, opening all the cupboards and then went down to Batar Creek rd to as far as the riding school and returned to the house. When she arrived home she saw the text from MFC and he arrived within a minute at 10.35 whereupon she informed him WT was missing, asking him was he with him. He then took off, looking for him and FFC made her 1st approach to a neighbour's house across the road to AMS's place. AMS could already hear the MFC calling out and searching for WT.
Click to expand...
So it’s possible that the car the crabbs heard screaching out onto bater creek road was FM
 
Awakening said:
I don't understand why police are questioning the shoes.

In the photo he is barefoot but 60 seconds later he could of had shoes on.

Based on MSM reports and the board police used to display the Spiderman suit & shoes he was last seen in, I assume that at the time the shoes were reported as missing.

Therefore the assumption would be when WT left the deck he put on those shoes. And FM explanation was he would of put on those shoes because we have always told him to wear shoes on FGM grass due to possible bindis and dog poop.

If there was no bindis and no dog anymore so what? WT & shoes are still missing so assume he did put on the shoes and the shoes are with him.

Unless... a shoe or both shoes have been found? Perhaps recent flooding caused a shoe/s to be found? Or new house owners found a shoe? Or there were drainage problem and a shoe was found when inspecting the drains?
Click to expand...
Yeah I don’t get it either , unless shoes found in boot of car ??
 
Awakening said:
Years ago, we had training on how to detect lies by a gentleman named Steve van Aperen. Otherwise known as "the human lie detector"

I remember him saying this same thing. Liars give lots of details. Details you didn't even ask for.

He also said that when people tell the truth they are not afraid of saying "I don't know" or "I have no idea" Generally truth tellers will not speculate on what they think happened unless really pushed, because they are sticking to facts only.

Examples he gave were of parents of a missing child or spouse of missing spouse. He said if he asked them "what do you think happened?

Where do you think x would be?" Innocent people tended to anxiously say "I don't know?! I don't understand it?" Because they don't know what's happened. They want the person to be found. So they tend to be reluctant to theorise in case that leads LE down the wrong path.

Whereas guilty people were quick to offer all sorts of hypothesis. Guilty people tended to suggest third party involvement (abduction) or in the case of missing spouses (ran away, suicidal).

Similar to when you ask a child "who ate all the cookies?!"

Innocent child "not me!"
"Then who did?"
"I don't know but it wasn't me!"

Guilty child "it was my brother!"
"Your brothers not home"
"The dog did it! Or maybe someone broke in and took them or ...." (You get the idea. Depending on the age of the child you can get some very far fetched ideas!)

Book one of Australia's top Keynote Speakers for your next event.
Click to expand...


Great post ! One thing I will touch on is in your post non truth tellers pointing the finger at someone. THE FGM pointed the finger at the neighbour across the road and told Police to look there. WHY? WHY did FGM cast speculation on the neighbour across the road? To distract from her own household? Just IMO
 
Aimee2 said:
William Tyrell's biological grandmother speaks out
update on todays search no anomalies under the concrete slab

William Tyrell's biological grandmother speaks out
Click to expand...
"…We knew nothing. Like … the first time I met Gary Jubelin was in the inquest. He walked past me, and I said to him, 'that's right, keep walking'," she said.

Wow, GJ is coming out of this very badly.
 
I have a big problem accepting that FGM would go along with FM’s cover up plans if there had been an accident.

If FM was hysterical, surely FGM would tell her the plan was ridiculous . She seemed to be a well known person in Kendall, who involved herself helping out in the community.
I thought she was recovering from an operation, dont recall her mental capabilities being questioned. Wasnt she only in her seventies?
 
SLouTh said:
Hi Doc ..... just wondering IF this could be the reason behind the current investigation???

Have digital records been found to be not consistent with verbal statements? When they were double checked, or more info obtained???

Otherwise it is definitely a struggle to understand or comprehend.....
Click to expand...

I don't know, it was always around 9am & I assume they had phone records available at the inquest.
 
SLouTh said:
Hi Doc ..... just wondering IF this could be the reason behind the current investigation???

Have digital records been found to be not consistent with verbal statements? When they were double checked, or more info obtained???

Otherwise it is definitely a struggle to understand or comprehend.....
Click to expand...



Perhaps like in case of CS, they discovered pings from towers? Police now have powers to access records from Telco companies, although I believe they have been able to do that for a long time. I suspect perhaps more towers for Telco companies have been erected for better coverage and perhaps that gives more PING POWER now for Police to get a far better idea of where people are now?
 
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