Found Deceased AZ - Jerold Williams, 5, Jacob Lake, 6 Aug 2015

[cbanning]

To those speculating why they aren't allowing the public to search, the area is remote and terrain is difficult to navigate. With a fire going through the area in the last couple of years and all the rain we have received this summer, the vegetation will be pretty thick. I couldn't imagine the nightmare the officials would have trying to keep track of everyone. I live over in the Coconino National Forest and we went berry picking last weekend. I made my kiddos stay in the truck because I was afraid of them getting lost. If you aren't familiar with the area, it is really easy to get lost out in the forest.

 

[Kaliste]

Long underwear are required part of the dress code for FLDS women and children. They are required to dress in layers.
http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2008/04/21/20080421polygamydress0421.html

Very interesting read, thank you!


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[neesaki]

I hope the searchers have the presence of mind to light up the North Rim lookout tower with searchlights pointing in every direction. Little Jerold might be able to see it both during the day and the night. If he can see spotlights shining in the distance, he may head towards them.

The lookout towers are usually positioned at the highest point at the top of the mountain and then extend up another 100' or so above the surrounding terrain. The location of the towers normally provides them with the best possible view of the area. If they can't find him by searching, maybe they can guide him in with bright lights.

Hooking up some sort of a PA system and talking him in wouldn't be a bad idea either. They have plenty of generators available, they could rig something up.

See map I made up below for clarification.

https://www.google.com/maps/d/edit?mid=zAAmDUXJe_aE.kcsOUmM2GJ3A&usp=sharing

Awesome map, Steelman, I've been trying to picture the search area in my head and haven't been successful. Thank You! And those sound like good ideas too, I hope that's what they're doing.

 

[flourish]

Because people are getting the FLDS confused with the Amish community, which don't believe in modern technology.
The FLDS (Mormons) don't have an issue with cell phones and modern gadgets.

Well okay but the FLDS are NOT Mormons, which are LDS. Not the same.

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[bluesneakers]

I think this is why there's a theory floating around that maybe she handed him off to get him out of the lifestyle.

Maybe the mom got turned around and got sidetracked herself, or was going to the bathroom or something. How old is she?

Based on the large family and particular dynamics if they are FLDS I wouldn't even assume the woman pictured with searchers is his mother.

 

[bluesneakers]

Well okay but the FLDS are NOT Mormons, which are LDS. Not the same.

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Thank you. FLDS isn't even a sect of LDS, is it? I thought they were a complete and separate entity at this point.

 

[flourish]

Thank you. FLDS isn't even a sect of LDS, is it? I thought they were a complete and separate entity at this point.

They are separate. The FLDS is considered an offshoot of mainstream Mormonism...although it could be argued that LDS is actually an offshoot of FLDS, but point is they are two different religions, the most visible difference being FLDS practices polygamy on earth still while the LDS stopped a few generations ago.

(Just to add confusion I'll mention the church formerly known as the RLDS--reorganized church of Jesus Christ of latter day saints-- who has a different name now but used to add another dimension to the confusion)

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[gitana1]

As of Saturday afternoon, more than 300 searchers had not found any sign of a missing 5-year-old near Jacob Lake.
...
Stormy weather and muddy roads hampered search efforts Friday, but the Coconino County Sheriff’s Office said Saturday that ground searchers have been joined by aircraft. The missing child is from Colorado City, and members of the community have been preparing meals for the responders.

Personnel from many agencies have been assisting the Coconino County Sheriff’s Office and Coconino County Sheriff’s Search and Rescue, including: Kane County Sheriff’s Office and Search and Rescue, Yavapai County Sheriff’s Office and Search and Rescue, Mohave County Search and Rescue, U.S. Forest Service law enforcement and fire crews, National Park Service law enforcement, Arizona Game and Fish law enforcement, Coconino County CERT teams, Page Rural CERT teams, Nellis US Air Force Base, National Guard Blackhawk and Special Forces, AZ Department of Public Safety troopers and Air Rescue, Bureau of Land Management personnel and dog teams, and Civil Air Patrol.

http://azdailysun.com/news/saturday...cle_4f484bc1-9d41-537f-94b2-15207eebc8cb.html

300 searchers? If that's true then maybe they don't need civilian searchers right now.

Colorado City? That clinches it.

And I think Azure brings up a good point. Because it seems a bit odd to me the way this incident is described. One moment he is chasing grasshoppers and then he is long gone. And it seems odd to me that a 5 yr old would not have heard 20 people calling out for him in the 4 hours they were searching unless he was full on running away from them. I could be wrong but it just seems odd. They were not up on a big hike in the wilderness and he made a wrong turn on the trail. they were just 150 yards from the campsite and suddenly he was gone totally.

Except there are hundreds of cases where precisely that has happened. Kid is there walking along or playing one moment and the next he or she is instantly gone. Without a trace. With no one seeing the kid disappear.

There red have been SEVERAL cases at campsites or beaches where that has happened.

 

[gitana1]

Indeed. On the spectrum of possible scenarios, I'd put this theory above "staged abduction to save child from FLDS", but only just. Then at the top of the list are the more likely theories: he really wandered off and succumbed to the elements and has yet to be found, or he was never at the campground in the first place. I only go to the latter theory because it has sadly proven true in so many cases of missing children.

What cases has it been proven true that a child reported missing from a campsite was never there to begin with?

 

[AmyPond]

All these missing kids at campsites....it honestly never really crossed my mind how helpful it would be to have your child in bright colored clothing. We aren't really "outdoorsy" people. But because of this thread, if we're ever in places like this...I now know to dress my child in bright orange or something.

 

[flourish]

I'm certainly not going to derail the thread but yes brainwashing is very powerful as is isolation which is a big component to the brainwashing.

It's easy to be judgemental when you know there's something different. Difficult to strive for something when you don't even know the something exists.

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[steelman]

There is a chance of rain this afternoon. We can only hope so. Little Jerold may need a serious drink right about now, even if he just has to hold his mouth open and point it towards the sky. He can still survive for awhile if he can find pockets of water to keep him hydrated and get a drink now and then. The key to surviving is access to water, more-so than food.

These guys are running out of time though. 72- hours in now, Jerold's going to be getting really weak from the lack of food and nutrition. He most likely has exerted a huge amount of energy running around in circles and climbing up things and over things. After a certain point, he's just going to sit down and not go anywhere, he won't have the strength left.

They need to bring in 500 more volunteers and send them out into the areas that either haven't been searched or have been lightly searched. Any of the lifelong residents, hunters and hunting guides familiar with the area, and any ranchers that have run cattle in that area should be the top pick as potential searchers. They already know the place and how to get around. If nothing else, they can have them run up and down game trails, primitive trails, and old logging roads just to see if they can find any trace of him.

The can be somewhat selective who they let in as searchers, but they need more of them, and they need them NOW.

 

[gitana1]

If FLDS, would they even have/use cell phones? Maybe that's one reason it took 4 hours to call, someone had to locate a phone.

FLDS use cell phones. Quite well. They are not Amish.

 

[Trident]

There is a chance of rain this afternoon. We can only hope so. Little Jerold may need a serious drink right about now, even if he just has to hold his mouth open and point it towards the sky. He can still survive for awhile if he can find pockets of water to keep him hydrated and get a drink now and then. The key to surviving is access to water, more-so than food.

These guys are running out of time though. 72- hours in now, Jerold's going to be getting really weak from the lack of food and nutrition. He most likely has exerted a huge amount of energy running around in circles and climbing up things and over things. After a certain point, he's just going to sit down and not go anywhere, he won't have the strength left.

They need to bring in 500 more volunteers and send them out into the areas that either haven't been searched or have been lightly searched. Any of the lifelong residents, hunters and hunting guides familiar with the area, and any ranchers that have run cattle in that area should be the top pick as potential searchers. They already know the place and how to get around. If nothing else, they can have them run up and down game trails, primitive trails, and old logging roads just to see if they can find any trace of him.

The can be somewhat selective who they let in as searchers, but they need more of them, and they need them NOW.

Thank you for your no-nonesense/good sense posts. You ought to join a SAR unit. Does anyone know if there are statistics on how often SAR teams are successful on the searches they do? In other words, what is their "find" rate?

 

[SweetT]

Why dont they use drones like right away. Russia had a missing kid in a forest or something and they quickly got drones out there as well as other things/people and found the kid.

and as someone else stated do some food and water drops and megaphone the area etc.

 

[Portabella]

I am concerned with combination of the Arizona heat, and the fact that under those jeans he is wearing Long Johns, he will lose more water by sweating more. The long sleeve, jeans and boots will help protect him some, but the long johns (especially if hand made woolies) will really take it out of him fast. I fear for him at this point. Does anyone know if children are more or less resilient without water then an adult? I can not find anything on it...IMHO

 

[gitana1]

I can understand how in a large group...people can "lose sight" of a child. But if it was just 1 adult and 1 child off by themselves....how exactly does that happen? I've gone plenty of places with my son (though never camping) and I am literally right by his side if there's ever a risk of him running off or anything. I just can't wrap my head around a 1 on 1 scenario where a kid goes missing like that.

Some parents aren't as diligent as you. Doesn't mean they're bad parents or that it is impossible for a child to go missing in their care. And sometimes really bad things happen to the most diligent parents who might have super bad luck one tragic time.

Thank you. FLDS isn't even a sect of LDS, is it? I thought they were a complete and separate entity at this point.

It is absolutely, 100% a sect of the LDS. They branched off when the LDS outlawed polygamy.

 

[bluesneakers]

[snip]

It is absolutely, 100% a sect of the LDS. They branched off when the LDS outlawed polygamy.

Thanks. I think I had the definition of sect wrong, or more likely I was once again confused. But if I'm understanding you correctly - FLDS is a sect of Mormonism like WBC is a sect of Christianity. The larger, organized religion doesn't recognize them, they are merely offshoots or formed after schisms.

 

[Jules71]

FLDS use cell phones. Quite well. They are not Amish.

If FLDS, would they even have/use cell phones? Maybe that's one reason it took 4 hours to call, someone had to locate a phone.

I made the same honest mistake - not knowing much about FLDS and their views on things like technology. I think it's their "Little House on the Prairie" attire that made me think they might have similar views as the Amish.

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[Tssiemer]

What does all this have to do with Jerold?


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