Bosma Murder Trial 04.19.16 - Day 37

[Errrr]

Sorry if this was answered already. Re: orange guys and fireworks.

MDMA, also known as Orange Bandits.
orange bandits*- Methylenedioxymethamphetamine (MDMA)
http://www.noslang.com/drugs/dictionary/o/

Fireworks, I was watching a movie this morning. Guy had guns and ammo in his van, called them fireworks. So I believe MS was using fireworks as the slang term for gun.

I don't think it was orange tarps, shirts or pylons in referring to "orange guys" MS had no problem asking for gloves and tape, why a code name for tarps, shirts etc? I do believe MS asked DM for a drug.

Fireworks can also be used to refer to any sudden burst of excitement or violence, such as starting a fight or an argument. I wouldn't expect it to be used to refer to a clandestine mission where everything is supposed to go down quietly. Unfortunately the language is cryptic enough to allow for reasonable doubt.
Apparently MDMA can cause feelings of empathy. Maybe DM was selling/giving away his prescription?
Whatever orange guys is it is referred to in very familiar terms, something plural that is used frequently. Drugs sounds about right.

 

[Prairie_dawg]

I felt like the shredding paper reference was literal. We knew DM pulled the incinerator receipt, and didn't MM have a file folder or something when they picked her up?

Perhaps, but then why would he need help shredding one folder, he would only need help if he was planning on emptying entire file cabinets....perhaps he was?!? JMO

 

[brightii]

Which is why I just shake my head whenever I see a well-meaning poster say: "I hope (so-and-so witness) decides to do the right thing once they're up on the stand."

I don't know if you're referring to me and/or others here, but if you did have me in mind when writing, thanks for at least acknowledging that I am well-meaning. I do hope for the best when anticipating witnesses and speculating whether or not they will be truthful, IMO. Many times I have called out witnesses whom I perceived as far less than honest on the stand, and in my experience here that's not always been a welcome opinion to express either, until others later may share the view, IMO.

Anyway, yesterday, sadly I had to attend a funeral. When I got home I read the thread to catch up here on the day's testimony. I wish now I had waited until at least today to read all those texts presented in court because upon reading here until very late last night, I was emotionally spent and in need of sleep. Suffice it to say sleep did not come easy to me last night, as I suspect it didn't for many of us, IMO. The Bosmas likely have not been able to sleep well for years, IMO and how they get through every day, with each it seems more difficult than the last, is beyond me. Still though they do carry on as they show up and sit together in the courtroom day after day hoping for the best and praying for justice for TB. I hope along with them together with all of you.

All MOO.

 

[SnooperDuper]

Just a quick question. Why are these guys being tried together? I think Smich especially is suffering because of it. Could you imagine a case against Smich without all these texts that don't concern him? Do they need to be tried together because they acted together?

MS was part of the whole thing: he knew of the plan and he knew exactly what they were going to do with TB (fireplace furniture and sizzling sausages). MS is equally guilty of first degree murder. Why should he get off light?

 

[Massasauga Rattler]

If he was interrogated for 24 hours, why haven't we seen any testimony about that interrogation? Presumably he was read his rights and had agreed to talk, with or without his attorney present?

I'm not sure the exact law around interrogation, but if police ever overstep their boundaries by using undue duress, stress, intimidation, or threat, that evidence can be thrown out. Also could be issues around not giving him prompt access to a lawyer before he was interrogated. Could be many reasons, IMO.

 

[SnooperDuper]

My first thought on 'juice' was steroids, but neither DM or MS looked like they were particularly interested in taking care of themselves or bulking up. (People who use steroids are typically hitting the gym pretty hard.)

As such, I have no idea what they're talking about. Cough syrup maybe? Can you get cough syrup with dextromethorphan in CA? That'll do a number on your stomach.

I think juice = beer and MS's only daily afflictions were that and pot. IMO.

 

[CJPRINCESS]

My first thought on 'juice' was steroids, but neither DM or MS looked like they were particularly interested in taking care of themselves or bulking up. (People who use steroids are typically hitting the gym pretty hard.)

As such, I have no idea what they're talking about. Cough syrup maybe? Can you get cough syrup with dextromethorphan in CA? That'll do a number on your stomach.

I agree, not steroids. One page back I listed 3 drugs referred to as "juice" PCP, steroids and crack laced pot joint.

For your answer to cough syrup with dextromethorphan. Stuff like Benadryl and antihistamines contain diphenhydramine. When a large amount is ingested, its a high between Meth and heroine. It creates a schizophrenic like type episodes. I know this one all too well from a family member. There is youtube videos and write ups on "how to take" and which doses do what to a person. I was quite taken back and it's becoming huge for the younger kids as its not illegal to get or have. They also think it's safe because they can get it over the counter.

 

[Kamille]

Okay the video is still there, just a little tricky to find. To my knowledge, it is just this reporter who called it a shotgun, and it is being filmed through a window. You can also see the jar of pellets on the table.

If the video does not come up, click on the link at the right that says "CTV National News: Expanding the investigation".

Here is a screen cap of the "shotgun" and the bowl of credit cards, with the jar of pellets.

http://toronto.ctvnews.ca/police-probe-link-between-bosma-suspect-missing-woman-1.1286814

 

[Massasauga Rattler]

My first thought on 'juice' was steroids, but neither DM or MS looked like they were particularly interested in taking care of themselves or bulking up. (People who use steroids are typically hitting the gym pretty hard.)

As such, I have no idea what they're talking about. Cough syrup maybe? Can you get cough syrup with dextromethorphan in CA? That'll do a number on your stomach.

It's an interesting point you raise. There is a lot of evidence in this case that would be inadmissable if it was just MS on trial. That evidence, though on may assume the jury can sort it out, is likely prejudicial by association. If I were Dungey, I probably would not have been happy that my client was being tried alongside DM.

Then again (as others have pointed out already), on could argue that being tried alongside DM makes MS look relatively less evil.

 

[SnooperDuper]

Fireworks can also be used to refer to any sudden burst of excitement or violence, such as starting a fight or an argument. I wouldn't expect it to be used to refer to a clandestine mission where everything is supposed to go down quietly. Unfortunately the language is cryptic enough to allow for treasonable doubt.
Apparently MDMA can cause feelings of empathy. Maybe DM was selling/giving away his prescription?
Whatever orange guys is it is referred to in very familiar terms, something plural that is used frequently. Drugs sounds about right.

MDMA is a street drug, not a prescription drug.

 

[Massasauga Rattler]

A medical marijuana permit would allow MS to possess without hassle from LE. That's the only advantage. It is thoroughly unlikely that he would get a medical marijuana prescription for his particular problem though.

You can get a med marijuana script for anything and anybody these days.

 

[SnooperDuper]

I'm not sure the exact law around interrogation, but if police ever overstep their boundaries by using undue duress, stress, intimidation, or threat, that evidence can be thrown out. Also could be issues around not giving him prompt access to a lawyer before he was interrogated. Could be many reasons, IMO.

Could be he just didn't say anything.

 

[CJPRINCESS]

I think juice = beer and MS's only daily afflictions were that and pot. IMO.

I've never known anyone to get sore chins, ankles or stomach pains from beer. Even knowing a few alcoholics, they have never complained of those symptoms. Sever stomach pain when their livers are cooked after many years of heavy drinking. IMO, its heavy drugs as it was stated MS had a substance abuse problem. Some heavy drugs cause above symptoms and add severe body pain to that mix. Coming off these drugs is awful with terrible withdrawals and will make one very sick.

 

[dar107]

Orange guys could be morphine pills as well..

https://www.google.ca/search?q=morp...sAQIKg&biw=1024&bih=636#imgrc=zeC9yHZBfA17ZM:

 

[SnooperDuper]

You can get a med marijuana script for anything and anybody these days.

No it is very difficult and limited to chronic conditions like MS, epilepsy, arthritis, cancer, AIDS.

You absolutely cannot get a MM permit for temporary pain relief like MS thought.

Here is the general criteria:

Any symptom treated within the context of compassionate end-of-life care,

OR

Symptoms related to specific medical conditions, namely:
Severe pain and/or persistent muscle spasms from multiple sclerosis
Severe pain and/or persistent muscle spasms from a spinal cord injury
Severe pain and/or persistent muscle spasms from a spinal cord disease
Severe pain, cachexia, anorexia, weight loss, and/or severe nausea from cancer
Severe pain, cachexia, anorexia, weight loss, and/or severe nausea from HIV/AIDS infection
Severe pain from severe forms of arthritis
Seizures from epilepsy

A debilitating symptom that is associated with a medical condition or with the medical treatment of that condition, other than those described in Category 1.

http://hc-sc.gc.ca/dhp-mps/marihuana/how-comment/eligible-admissible-eng.php#a1

Many many doctors are against the prescribing of marijuana, including the Canadian Medical Association that says:

The CMA still believes there is insufficient scientific evidence available to support the use of marijuana for clinical purposes. It also believes there is insufficient evidence on clinical risks and benefits, including the proper dosage of marijuana to be used and on the potential interactions between this drug and other medications.

https://www.cma.ca/En/Pages/medical-marijuana.aspx

ETA: pick up the phone and ask 10 doctors in your area if the prescribe marijuana and you'll get a 0% hit rate, honest.

 

[Errrr]

Just a quick question. Why are these guys being tried together? I think Smich especially is suffering because of it. Could you imagine a case against Smich without all these texts that don't concern him? Do they need to be tried together because they acted together?

It makes terrific reading though.
One advantage in doing it this way is it emphasizes the dynamic between the two. One could hope young people would observe this case and be vigilant in the future if someone was being manipulative so they could do the right thing and avoid being sucked in..... In a perfect world. Leopoldo and Loeb were the same deal but few know of them.
How do you manipulate people into not being manipulated?

 

[brightii]

I think MS liked his "cigarettes and booze" and his weed, and IMO the term juice is a reference to alcohol. I wonder if it is true that DM's father was a heavy drinker or an alcoholic, if DM's attraction to someone like MS was sort of familiar to him, IMO. Children of alcoholics have issues and I think they are sometimes attracted to people and situations that do feel familiar, and therefore oddly comfortable, even if these are painful associations, IMO.

Speculating only: I think MS's arm injury could be a rotator cuff injury, that often is incredibly painful and depending on the severity of the injury, it can severely limit mobility, IMO. It is commonly treated with cortisone injections, but if these are not effective over time, surgery may be recommended, IMO.

All MOO.

 

[Skibunny]

Susan Clairmont ‏@susanclairmont 5s6 seconds ago
May 25, 2012: Millard to Mi Negro: I'm a mission right now in Woodbridge, staking out a place, hopefully catch what car this kid drives...

Was wondering about this from April 18th, was DM surveilling his ex-fiance? He had a condo in Woodbridge, was she living in it? I was wondering that if she had a male friend hanging around, DM might be curious to find out about him. The text said that DM wanted to see "what kind of car this kid drives" possibly to gage this person by - income level etc. If that was the case, this person could have been at great risk of being murdered, due to jealousy. JMO. So glad that it looks like these two have plenty of evidence against them, and are going to be put away for a long time. MOO

 

[Massasauga Rattler]

No it is very difficult and limited to chronic conditions like MS, epilepsy, arthritis, cancer, AIDS.

You absolutely cannot get a MM permit for temporary pain relief like MS thought.

Here is the general criteria:


http://hc-sc.gc.ca/dhp-mps/marihuana/how-comment/eligible-admissible-eng.php#a1

Many many doctors are against the prescribing of marijuana, including the Canadian Medical Association that says:



https://www.cma.ca/En/Pages/medical-marijuana.aspx

Through a respectable doctor, I would agree with you. Seriously though, I could get a script this morning if you know the right doc. I am not speaking out of any personal experience, since I neither partake, nor have any afflictions. But I know enough about that world through others that I can assure you it's easy to get for those who want a script.

 

[Errrr]

I'm going to set the record straight regarding the "shotgun". Unfortunately the original video is no longer available but the story is this. The media went to Maplegate after LE had completed their search and DM was arrested and filmed footage outside the house. They filmed through the window into the kitchen. In that footage you could see the kitchen table with a bunch of stuff on it. In that stuff was a bowl of credit cards with WM's name on them and a box of pellets. Up against a wall was what appeared to be a "shotgun".

Now if it was an actual shotgun, licensed or not, I do not think LE would have left it sitting up against a wall and not locked up if it was licensed or confiscated if it was not. The box of pellets on the table really lend credence to the fact that it was likely a pellet gun.

From there, people on forums speculated that WM had shot himself with "his shotgun". WM was an avid animal lover and activist. It is highly unlikely that he would own a shotgun, licensed or otherwise.

And then one reporter decided to put "WM's shotgun death" in an article and the story took flight.

We will have to find out when WM's trial comes around but I do not believe a shotgun had anything to do with any of these murders. Nor do I think there was a real shotgun at Maplegate.

MOO

WOW! I'm amazed that the media is held to a lower standard than an Internet forum!