CA CA - Bryce Laspisa, 19, Castaic, 30 Aug 2013 - #6

[kevsrebla]

Speaking of the dam, on the other side of it (if B walked across), what's that long bridge like thingy that ends with a round cone like thingy extending into into the lake? Anyone know?

Probably water intake for power generation or water for LA basin

 

[tamrabbit]

No, the lake gets windy- I used to waterski on it.

I rode my bike on Lake Hughes dr around Castaic the Wednesday before BL went missing. There was no noticeable wind. At 6 am it was probably High 70s, low 80s temperature wise.


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[Woe.be.gone]

Sorry to quote myself... I'm specifically thinking of the Willow Springs racetrack and the fact that every fence was blown down, every person around me was grabbing onto things, and I was nearly knocked to the ground several times by wind. Everything was built to fight the wind - i.e. bathrooms faced a certain way with big concrete barriers. Other racers were saying they sometimes used the wind to help them on certain turns. I've only been there once but people who'd been there before told me it wasn't even a very windy day. If Castaic is similar, I can't even imagine what might happen to someone in the water. (yes it hurts a lot to think and type this). If Castaic's not windy like this it changes my thinking. Granted my thinking changes daily...

I wish there was some way to rule the lake in or out definitively. Unfortunately I don't think it's possible given the size and depth of the lake.

http://www.wunderground.com/history...tml?req_city=NA&req_state=NA&req_statename=NA

This is a good weather source site that BondJamesBond showed us a long time ago where you can look up weather history.

On August 30, the wind peaked just before 10:00 a.m. (if I'm reading the graph correctly) at 11 or 12 mph.

 

[RoseGarden]

IIRC, DRZ made a map with dog path marked out - I can't find that for some reason. Just wanted to see what the dogs did at the pump end, the path there....

 

[Quester]

IIRC, DRZ made a map with dog path marked out - I can't find that for some reason. Just wanted to see what the dogs did at the pump end, the path there....

Here you go:
Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - CA CA - Bryce Laspisa, 19, Castaic, 30 August 2013 - #6

 

[tamrabbit]

IIRC, DRZ made a map with dog path marked out - I can't find that for some reason. Just wanted to see what the dogs did at the pump end, the path there....

I don't think DRZ knows the actual route other than they tracked him from the car to the lake, across the Dam to the exit on the other side of the lagoon area. I walked out near the dam etc yesterday and the route that DRZ doesn't make sense if I take it literally. I think it's just a general route.


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[RoseGarden]

Here you go:
Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - CA CA - Bryce Laspisa, 19, Castaic, 30 August 2013 - #6

You Rock! :rockon: Okay, so his trail crossed a little bit of water and he traveled inside (east of) the pump outlet. Could get a little wet, and by the time he was there, after the accident and some shock adrenaline wore off, pretty tired. Maybe wanted to rest, catch his breath a bit. Just thinking as I type, hope this is helpful and not just a ramble...

Okay, to your point, tamrabbit, we should get some feedback from DRZ about the path he traced, if this is where the dogs walked, or where the dogs roamed, etc... thanks

 

[Baddux]

First post to this case......been following for a bit....

I think the critical thinking regarding the crash scenario has been stellar, but...

KISS tells me looking at this scent map that Bryce had a good shot of being home free at that endpoint...maybe picked up as that looks like relatively easy spot to catch a ride. I mean It looks like there are houses nearby

IMO if the scent ended nearer to the dam wall or whatever that instead, him being in the lake would make sense....a trek to a good pickup location indicates self preservation to me.

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[Woe.be.gone]

I think I'm caught up again, and I noticed something interesting about the car pictures. I don't know what the other side looks like, but if it rolled completely over, that's one heck of a roof and hood on that car. The front window is mostly intact, which means there was no real impact on the front roof, so it looks it might have been a side drop and flip, not a true rollover. The front tires are working on bald, so there was little to no grip with those. The back tires have tread, but they are just street tires and would have no purchase in that terrain. I can easily see that size vehicle rolling down the hill and brakes being of little use, the tires would just slide if there was enough momentum. I'm not talking lots of speed, but enough downhill weight to keep the car from stopping. It still looks like the lower rear quarter panel hit first (the fold over the wheel well makes me think that-there is no reason for the fold if it just landed on it's side), but the picture doesn't show the front.

The back window could easily have been broken when it hit on the passenger side.

The part that confuses me is on the back hatch. There is a severe indent about 6 inches down from the top spoiler. It doesn't match up to any marks on the side. I can't figure out how that could happen.

There is no doubt in my mind that if Bryce was in the driver's seat when the car went down, he hit his head (probably several times) on the driver's side window. (I've done that more times than I want to admit). I'm also not convinced anyone was inside when it went down. If Bryce stepped out to "check the tires" and it wasn't in park, well, I think of the time my father forgot to put one of the cars in park, and it rolled backwards down the hill in front of our house....

Great observations. Immediately after reading this post, here's what I thought (please excuse suggestions of less than perfect relations but I'm a parent too). Since Bryce had been 'tracked' by his mom through his car and possibly phone, and the last 'tracking time' was around 2:00 a.m. via phone, he may have sent the car down along with his phone as a big f you to his mom. Wait, I'll explain.
I thought of this because, even though I know deep down that my 19 yo kid loves me, I only see glimpses of evidence these days. The great equalizer in our house is his father who was a soldier at age 19 and holds me back from appearing as if I'm up in son's business at all times. I have an informant and pay close attention but often hold back from interferring in his personal life. (Remembering myself at his age too.) I pray for him and try not to worry too much. My husband is the 'he has to find his own way' message guy, yet he's there for him too but not in 'in your face' ways.
It's a balancing act. Only a member within the same family can decide if the dynamic going on is too much this or that but I'm stating a feeling or scenario that I struggle with too (wishing to guide my 'little baby boy').
My husband reminds me all the time 'by the time he was 19, he was a soldier' yadda-yadda. Still, husband was operating within a system so it wasn't like being missing from his family even if they didn't hear from him very often. But, his point is a boy has to become a man and in today's world, even though he admits things seem different now, we tend to coddle and try to control a young man's future too much sometimes.
Repeating - I'm not saying that's the case here but it could be that Bryce felt he needed to get away.

Just wondering too, what were Bryce's feelings about moving to CA (with his parents) recently (right?). I noticed he seems to have tons of caring friends in Naperville, Illinois.
One of my kid's longtime friend just moved to FL due to his dad's job promotion/transfer. He had no choice but to go with them until he figures his own future out. Guess where he's heading later this month? Back here to visit his friends. It will take time to make new friends who compare to your lifelong school friends. This is a difficult transition even for adults!

o/t ~ Human skull found in Will County in Illinois.

 

[Voice4theSilent]

Hubby works for AT&T designing cell towers- that's not how it works. Pinging cannot determine a route- it's not that accurate. The phone must be on and they can determine where it received/made a call to a 1 mile radius from the nearest cell tower of it's carrier.

Which is pretty close to tracking. If people were calling him and the calls were going to voice mail all of those incoming calls could be pinged to a mile radius of where his phone physically was at that specific time, correct? Same with incoming (and outgoing) text messages? TIA for the info.

 

[RoseGarden]

First post to this case......been following for a bit....

I think the critical thinking regarding the crash scenario has been stellar, but...

KISS tells me looking at this scent map that Bryce had a good shot of being home free at that endpoint...maybe picked up as that looks like relatively easy spot to catch a ride. I mean It looks like there are houses nearby

IMO if the scent ended nearer to the dam wall or whatever that instead, him being in the lake would make sense....a trek to a good pickup location indicates self preservation to me.

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Great points, Baddux He seems to be heading in the direction of self-preservation. One note, there are no houses right where the scent trail ends - it is a road, at one entrance to Castaic park, and the only thing there is a Sheriff's Training Facility and lot with some trash in it. Bunch of patrol cars parked inside, dirt road leading in to the facility site. Possibly a car came by at that time that was heading into the hills...

My bet, IMO, is that the dogs were picking up the scent on the wind (I think that was this set of dogs - air scent canines?) and the trail could be a bit off. Using Google Earth view (gawd it is amazing) you can zoom right in to see plants and terrain and rocks. Bryce could definitely have climbed over the bottom lip of the pump trough and hiked through the area east of the "rec area." Exploring the terrain has been very interesting. Lots of wild clumps of trees and brush and ground cover. A good place to sit down and rest for a bit, he had to be exhausted when the adrenaline wore off... :moo::twocents:

 

[Woe.be.gone]

http://joliet.patch.com/groups/police-and-fire/p/human-skull-found-in-creek-off-rowell-road-coroner

I doubt very much the skull has anything to do with BL. Still, part of Naperville, Illinois is in Will County. So when I heard Will county, my ears perked up.

Comments are asking if it could be Stacy Peterson or Lisa Stebic

 

[AmandaFast]

Great observations. Immediately after reading this post, here's what I thought (please excuse suggestions of less than perfect relations but I'm a parent too). Since Bryce had been 'tracked' by his mom through his car and possibly phone, and the last 'tracking time' was around 2:00 a.m. via phone, he may have sent the car down along with his phone as a big f you to his mom. Wait, I'll explain.
I thought of this because, even though I know deep down that my 19 yo kid loves me, I only see glimpses of evidence these days. The great equalizer in our house is his father who was a soldier at age 19 and holds me back from appearing as if I'm up in son's business at all times. I have an informant and pay close attention but often hold back from interferring in his personal life. (Remembering myself at his age too.) I pray for him and try not to worry too much. My husband is the 'he has to find his own way' message guy, yet he's there for him too but not in 'in your face' ways.
It's a balancing act. Only a member within the same family can decide if the dynamic going on is too much this or that but I'm stating a feeling or scenario that I struggle with too (wishing to guide my 'little baby boy').
My husband reminds me all the time 'by the time he was 19, he was a soldier' yadda-yadda. Still, husband was operating within a system so it wasn't like being missing from his family even if they didn't hear from him very often. But, his point is a boy has to become a man and in today's world, even though he admits things seem different now, we tend to coddle and try to control a young man's future too much sometimes.
Repeating - I'm not saying that's the case here but it could be that Bryce felt he needed to get away.

Just wondering too, what were Bryce's feelings about moving to CA (with his parents) recently (right?). I noticed he seems to have tons of caring friends in Naperville, Illinois.
One of my kid's longtime friend just moved to FL due to his dad's job promotion/transfer. He had no choice but to go with them until he figures his own future out. Guess where he's heading later this month? Back here to visit his friends. It will take time to make new friends who compare to your lifelong school friends. This is a difficult transition even for adults!

o/t ~ Human skull found in Will County in Illinois.

I'm definitely with you on this. My younger brother is the same age and he has a history of getting in dumb trouble. Not drugs or anything but just stupid stuff that my parents don't approve of regardless of the fact he is just growing up and learning things the hard way.

He has a bad habit of ditching his phone when he goes somewhere he's not suppose to. Like he will say he's at place A and his phone will be at place A but he will be off in place B.

Quite a few times we weren't able to get ahold of him for quite awhile and when we tracked his phone we found his phone and not him.

He pushed away the more they pushed so I can totally see this.

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[Woe.be.gone]

Bryces car is seen entering the park at 4:20, car is found by worker coming in to work at approx. just before 5:30. Sheriffs were also coming in to do an exercise and were notified immediately, approx. 5:30
It was 8:00 when CHP notified Bryces parents that the car was found

The accident happened between 4:20 and 5:30, my guess would be shortly after 4:20

Ok, lets clear some new things up.

Airbags didn't deploy (I stated that before) but it takes a hard straight frontal hit to deploy them

Car (as it was coming down the hill) did take a front hit, but it was under the bumper, ripping it off, not straight, like if you rearend another car, sensors are an electronic device designed to do a certain thing, in this case, protect a driver from a straight front end hit, not a roll.

I cannot release any form of media that comes to me from or through LASD, otherwise I face criminal charges. PERIOD.

hope this helps

The first dog search was ruled out because they were SAR dogs and followed human scent.
The bloodhounds, going only off Bryce's scent (from worn shoes and socks), followed Bryce's path over the dam and leading out of the park.

This is where the scent ends

I cant add attachment. Basically from car, over dam, and down to where scent ends

The vehicle was found ON MAIN RAMP ROAD, about 80% of it was in the right lane if traveling north

I will post a map

There are markings on the street where the vehicle came to rest

eg. RR = right rear of vehicle etc.

Also there was a lot of vehicle debris on the road where it rested - glass, taillight pieces etc

There was a lot of disturbed brush, moved rocks, boulders etc. I have pics of this but can't post

The map I posted gives a definitive picture of where vehicle ended up. There SHOULD NOT be any speculation to anything else. THIS IS FACT

Shoot, I remember dragracerz commented on the camera location (iirc with a qualifier stating per what LE told him) but now I can't find the post. The post may have been in the previous thread. I only reviewed this one.

He has given some definitive info though like where the Toyota landed and how it came down the hill, etc. Here are some of his posts I gathered for revue even though I didn't find the one I was looking for.

 

[Ghostwheel]

Snipped and bolded by me. Except that drag made it clear in his last posts that the dogs tracked right from the crash. I can't imagine any reason the truck would have been pushed down on its own and then Bryce walked down to check out the crash. I mean, you don't intentionally ditch a car and then decide to go check it out when someone could happen by and see you. And even if he was standing outside the car at the antenna tower and it accidentally started to roll down the slope like you mentioned, and he went down to check it out, the dogs would have tracked his scent some way back up to the antennae tower instead of into the park area.

I think with the revelation that the dogs tracked right from the crash site and the blood drops found we can conclude 98% chance that Bryce was in the car when it went down unless anyone can think of a reason to discount or explain why his scent is right there and goes outward of the crash site and not back up to the antennae tower.

OK, I'm still 2% not convinced he was in the vehicle when it went down....FWIW when I say I'm not convinced, I mean I just leave that possibility open, not that I think it is probable. (Heck, my dad ALWAYS put the car in park except that one time.....) And I definitely do NOT think he pushed the car down, but that it could have rolled away from him under the right circumstances. The dog scent search path that dragracerz posted show that the dogs DID trace him up the hill, BTW
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=9891328&postcount=350

I do, however, think he went down with the vehicle due to the blood being on the passenger side. That makes me think he was moving around and spattered a nosebleed or small cut as he extricated himself from the car. This also makes me think it is far more likely he had a concussion, and headed towards lights and civilization.

 

[AmandaFast]

OK so maybe we all can work on the route to take and what should be done in Buttonwillow? I don't want to kick myself later.

I do know that either a homeless person, crack head, or street walker will be my best bet for gathering intel since they spend so much time in the streets.

I feel like I might get in trouble for saying this but should I attempt payoffs if I feel its necessary or bad idea?

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[gitana1]

With a severe brain trauma from that bad fall he could have had internal bleeding of the brain if he hit his head hard. Could he have gone unconscious and passed out and drowned while swimming in the lake?

Yes, I know no body surfaced. So back to possibly being snagged on something sharp or jagged at the bottom. Again the lake is 330 feet deep. Those two old rusty cars they recently found with specialized sonar in Oklahoma was only in 17ft deep muddy murky water.

Yes but in the OK case, the lake had not been searched before, iirc. In this case, it has, extensively.

 

[tamrabbit]

Great points, Baddux He seems to be heading in the direction of self-preservation.

I disagree. It would've been less than 2 miles if he had just followed Lake Hughes road down to the lagoon. Way easier terrain and possible cars driving by that could have picked him up. Instead he goes the longer route, to the lake, crosses the dam, and tries to get down to the lagoon area? If you've seen the lake area in person, this does not look very approachable or feasible, let alone in the dark.

His last texts to his roommate were "you saved my soul" with his roommate texting back about how beautiful his life is and to not waste it. He breaks up with his GF after multiple attempts. All signs to me point that he was suicidal. I do think his roommate talked some sense into him, but those feelings can come back fast and furious and with a vengeance. I think he is in the lake or near the lake to finish the deed that he impulsively set out to do that night when he was having a bad night and saw the lake on his GPS. If you've seen the crash site, it does not appear to be an accident. it feels very intentional, very impulsive.




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[nikb]

OK so maybe we all can work on the route to take and what should be done in Buttonwillow? I don't want to kick myself later.

I do know that either a homeless person, crack head, or street walker will be my best bet for gathering intel since they spend so much time in the streets.

I feel like I might get in trouble for saying this but should I attempt payoffs if I feel its necessary or bad idea?

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I have no idea on that last part... probably would get results but seems like a bad idea safety wise? From experience with late night motel check ins there when racing there we ran into some really messed up people in the check-in lines. They might have info but I don't think I'd trust what they said. I'd also really worry about your own safety if you flashed any money. THANK YOU for what you're doing but please stay safe.

 

[kevsrebla]

OK so maybe we all can work on the route to take and what should be done in Buttonwillow? I don't want to kick myself later.

I do know that either a homeless person, crack head, or street walker will be my best bet for gathering intel since they spend so much time in the streets.

I feel like I might get in trouble for saying this but should I attempt payoffs if I feel its necessary or bad idea?

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I would start with where we know he was at, the truck stop area, Lagoon Dr. Start with the businesses closest to that. Try to find out who worked during the time he spent there and talk to them directly. Goes without saying that you will be taking fliers, try to post as many as you can. I would also go to the rest stop north of there where he ran out of gas. You may not get any leads there but maybe post a flier or two, and just get a feel for the place. Not sure how welcome you would be in the town of Buttonwillow itself but, not guts, no glory. Don't go alone