Deceased/Not Found Canada - Alvin, 66, & Kathy Liknes, 53, Nathan O'Brien, 5, Calgary, 30 June 2014 - #1

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sillybilly said:
<bbm>

I don't agree or disagree Elainera ... we obviously can't see beyond what the pic shows .. could also have been dragged from around the corner and left lie by the garage door where the blood appears to have pooled somewhat. IMO, it's hard for us to tell either way.
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You're right, that could be the case too.
 
Re: neighbours hearing commotion - sometimes perps just get lucky. My house is even closer to my neighbours' (newer area of Calgary, these lots in the Liknes' area are actually good sized compared to some newer areas, unfortunately).

Now, I am the nosiest neighbour ever. I have teacher ears and sleep lightly. I am always home, always outside supervising my kids, and my "laundry room perch" (where I live like half the time while folding laundry) gives me an awesome view of the neighborhood activity. And yet I have been shocked by what I have NOT heard while I was home - three hit and runs (vehicle hit parked car) within a few houses of mine this winter, one accident about 200 feet from my house where the entire light pole came crashing down and - the worst - a prowler in my neighbours' backyard which must have been like 10 feet from where I was in the living room. I heard nothing!
 
If there are blood drag marks from the side door to the driving pad, and no cars are missing, that suggests that the family was taken away in a vehicle. If there are drag marks, then one person was not walking. That person may be deceased, perhaps in the trunk of the vehicle. If someone was going to abduct a family, it's unlikely that they would use their own vehicle - unless it was something that was not planned. I'm thinking that if it was pre-planned, a stolen vehilce was used. If it was not pre-planned, someone used their own vehicle. I wonder if any vehicles were stolen in the area on Sunday.

It looks like MacLeod Trail is a good route for leaving the city, so people that live South of the city should be keeping an eye out for unusual activity, birds clustering, and so on.
 
This doesn't sound good. I really hope somehow they will be found safe.
 
I do have to wonder about the use of the word 'DRAG'.

Take away drag, and insert 'trail' of blood, or 'line' of blood, or 'spots' of blood, better yet, what if it isn't even blood?

'Drag' is a term that the Sun used, as near as I can see.

I cannot find the reference for the blood marks being 8 metres long, if someone would be kind enough to link me up?
 
Wondergirl said:
I do have to wonder about the use of the word 'DRAG'.

Take away drag, and insert 'trail' of blood, or 'line' of blood, or 'spots' of blood, better yet, what if it isn't even blood?

'Drag' is a term that the Sun used, as near as I can see.

I cannot find the reference for the blood marks being 8 metres long, if someone would be kind enough to link me up?
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This is the only reference that I can find:

"Three evidence tags can be seen next to what appears to be drag marks on the walkway of a home where three people were reported missing Monday.

Running about eight metres from a side door to the driveway, the marks look like dark liquid that was recently cleaned up."

http://www.calgarysun.com/2014/07/0...lgary-grandparents-and-young-boy-went-missing
 
I wonder if police hosed down the area after photographing and collecting evidence so as to protect the integrity of the investigation. At this time they are saying that they believe all three missing persons to be alive, but if there are bloody drag marks from the side door to the driving pad, then it's quite likely that one of the three is no longer alive.

This is from the Amber Alert:

"Nathan may be in the company of his grandfather Alvin Liknes, a white male, 6 feet tall, 200 lbs with grey and blond hair, black shorts. Alvin has a distinctive walk. His grandmother Kathryn Liknes is described as 5foot 3 tall, 120 pounds with red and brown hair and green eyes."

http://emergencyalert.alberta.ca/alerts/2014/07/2570.html

That suggests to me that the grandmother was injured.
 
Although police have said that this is a triple abduction, part of me is wondering whether, somehow, the grandfather decided to skip town with his grandson. If that were the case, then it would be very carefully planned with an extra vehicle, all the money put in a separate account perhaps under a different identity, and travel outside of the country before anyone knew that something was wrong.

What I means it that if this was a random/robbery/attack/abduction, then there's really no reason to remove a body from the house. It almost seems that one body was removed and two other people left ... all in a vehicle that was not registered to the family or the residence. There was mixed information about where they were going, and perhaps that was deliberately done by the grandfather to confuse everyone about where he would go after everything was liquidated. I'm thinking that if all the assets were liquidated, then there was a lot of money that had to be shared by two people, but one person might have thought that it would be a more comfortable lifestyle if the money was for one person.

The only reason that I can see for abducting either parents it to force them to hand over the assets/money.
 
An estate sale inside the house is dangerous- everyone who attended knows what is in the house, the ages of the people who live there, the layout of the house, had an opportunity to look around for what kind of pets might be there (i.e. evidence of aggressive dogs),could even have unlocked a window. The fact that the owners still live there means there was probably a wad of cash in the house, proceeds of the days sale.
That said, if they were selling all of their furniture, I can see why it would be easy to have the sale in the house. What a shame we have to be cynical in order to stay safe.

There was discussion earlier about how long the grandparents have been married. I think a long time- I dont think he is a step grand parent. I found an obit for KL's mother, where it is said she has one great grandson, Nathan, and lots of step great grandchildren. I guess that means that Nathans big brother has a different mother.

http://www.hffs.com/memsol.cgi?user_id=484442

What a nightmare for this poor family.
 
otto said:
I wonder if police hosed down the area after photographing and collecting evidence so as to protect the integrity of the investigation. At this time they are saying that they believe all three missing persons to be alive, but if there are bloody drag marks from the side door to the driving pad, then it's quite likely that one of the three is no longer alive.

This is from the Amber Alert:

"Nathan may be in the company of his grandfather Alvin Liknes, a white male, 6 feet tall, 200 lbs with grey and blond hair, black shorts. Alvin has a distinctive walk. His grandmother Kathryn Liknes is described as 5foot 3 tall, 120 pounds with red and brown hair and green eyes."

http://emergencyalert.alberta.ca/alerts/2014/07/2570.html

That suggests to me that the grandmother was injured.
Click to expand...

Forensics or the ME might have been able to quickly type the blood to determine which of the three was likely injured.

On another note, considering a rental vehicle, Hertz at 4101 MacLeod Trail closes at 6:00 pm Sunday, but opens at 7:00 am Monday.
 
otto said:
I wonder if police hosed down the area after photographing and collecting evidence so as to protect the integrity of the investigation. At this time they are saying that they believe all three missing persons to be alive, but if there are bloody drag marks from the side door to the driving pad, then it's quite likely that one of the three is no longer alive.

This is from the Amber Alert:

"Nathan may be in the company of his grandfather Alvin Liknes, a white male, 6 feet tall, 200 lbs with grey and blond hair, black shorts. Alvin has a distinctive walk. His grandmother Kathryn Liknes is described as 5foot 3 tall, 120 pounds with red and brown hair and green eyes."

http://emergencyalert.alberta.ca/alerts/2014/07/2570.html

That suggests to me that the grandmother was injured.
Click to expand...
Grandmother may be injured. When I first read it I thought they were focusing on the grandfather because of his distinctive walk- he might stand out more.
 
Calgary father asks for help in search for missing five-year-old son

This article indicates there was a trail of something being 'dragged' FROM the side door, TO the driveway.

Based on evidence at the home &#8212; including signs someone or something had been dragged from a side door to the driveway, leaving a trail of dark liquid &#8212; police declared the case an abduction.

And that, apparently, is about all they are willing to conclude so far &#8212; despite a forensic unit carefully examining the home, and a visit from the medical examiner, all police can say is that the trio appears to have been taken by someone.
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It&#8217;s the biggest favour a father could ever ask &#8212; not that Rod O&#8217;Brien needs to ask.

A desperate father who just desperately wants his son to come home, O&#8217;Brien already has an entire city doing its utmost to find five-year-old Nathan and his missing grandparents.

But O&#8217;Brien asks for help anyway: &#8220;Please keep your eyes open.&#8221;

He sounds like a man fighting to stay composed, his voice fragile with stress.

The plea comes from a father in perhaps the most helpless position a parent can imagine: his son is gone, and no one seems to know where, or why.

&#8220;Everybody in Calgary, and the surrounding area, please keep your eyes open,&#8221; says O&#8217;Brien.
Click to expand...

http://www.calgarysun.com/2014/07/0...-help-in-search-for-missing-five-year-old-son
 
-Who's idea was the sleepover?

-When was the sleepover planned?

-Where did Nathan normally sleep?

-Who knew how much money the Liknes made at the sale that day?

-Are their shoes gone?
 
Mel 1303 said:
An estate sale inside the house is dangerous- everyone who attended knows what is in the house, the ages of the people who live there, the layout of the house, had an opportunity to look around for what kind of pets might be there (i.e. evidence of aggressive dogs),could even have unlocked a window. The fact that the owners still live there means there was probably a wad of cash in the house, proceeds of the days sale.
That said, if they were selling all of their furniture, I can see why it would be easy to have the sale in the house. What a shame we have to be cynical in order to stay safe.

There was discussion earlier about how long the grandparents have been married. I think a long time- I dont think he is a step grand parent. I found an obit for KL's mother, where it is said she has one great grandson, Nathan, and lots of step great grandchildren. I guess that means that Nathans big brother has a different mother.

http://www.hffs.com/memsol.cgi?user_id=484442

What a nightmare for this poor family.
Click to expand...

Thank you! So Nathan is related to the grandmother through her two children rather than through the grandfather's four children.
 
Police want Calgary estate sale shoppers to come forward as boy, grandparents still missing

Calgary &#8212; The Canadian Press

Published Tuesday, Jul. 01 2014, 6:08 PM EDT
Last updated Tuesday, Jul. 01 2014, 6:51 PM EDT

&#8220;We have the only scene that we&#8217;re aware of right now contained, and we&#8217;re going through that doing our best to find whatever clues may be there,&#8221; he continued.

&#8220;But the bottom line is we don&#8217;t know where these people are right now.&#8221;

Police updated their description of the boy on Tuesday, noting that the child&#8217;s eyes are brown and not blue.
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http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...y-grandparents-still-missing/article19407344/
 
If Nathan is the only grandchild mentioned in the obituary, and the only one that was staying for a sleepover, it could be that his two simblings are half siblings through a stepfather.
 
Nathan's mom and dad were married 5 yrs ago in 2009. Nathan is 5 and the older boy is 6.

Just putting it out there ... wondering if the oldest boy is from another relationship and there's an unhappy ex in the picture (i.e. you took my son away, i'll take yours)?
 
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