Found Deceased Canada - Genevieve Cormier, 19, St John, NB, 29 Sept 2013 - #2

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if we only knew approx days in the water, we would have something to link to abduction. We would be able to question where they were for x days if only in water for y days.

I am sure the police know from the autopsy reports how ling they were in the water, and maybe this is why they are reluctant to follow the abduction / murder theory?

Believe me, I am on the side of justice for these women, if its warranted, but I like to play devils advocate and explore all options...
BBM - Or maybe that is exactly why they are trying so hard to deny that these are murders--related murders.

I am positive that law enforcement know much more than they are saying, and I fervently hope that they are seeking to solve these cases.

But that is all that I have--an uncertain hope.

I bet they are praying as hard as I am that he has had enough now, and that he will just stop; but what if he doesn't? The lid is going to blow off the pot if there is a fourth one.

At first I thought this might be someone coming into port occasionally; but the more I look at it, the more it appears to be someone local; and he may be carefully selecting his victims--not grabbing them randomly.

I don't mean to say this flippantly as I know they have very difficult jobs, but that should make it easier for them to solve, (if these are open cases and they are working on them.)

You might not believe this, but I have been trying to explore all options, too. I don't like the one I see before me, and I didn't get here without giving this some thought.
 
I noticed from one of the maps, that there is a dotted line that goes from the St. John area to Nova Scotia? Is this a regular ferry service?
 
IS THERE A SERIAL KILLER ON THE LOOSE IN FREDERICTON ...
oldmaison.wordpress.com/.../is-there-a-serial-killer-on-the-loose-in-frederic...
Feb 13, 2013 - Matt Sloan was last seen during the Harvest Jazz and Blues Festival in Fredericton. He was found days later in the St.John River!! Many are…

Fredericton is one hour from Saint John......interesting...I have to look into this ...
 
IS THERE A SERIAL KILLER ON THE LOOSE IN FREDERICTON ...
oldmaison.wordpress.com/.../is-there-a-serial-killer-on-the-loose-in-frederic...
Feb 13, 2013 - Matt Sloan was last seen during the Harvest Jazz and Blues Festival in Fredericton. He was found days later in the St.John River!! Many are…

Fredericton is one hour from Saint John......interesting...I have to look into this ...

is the St. John river the same one that feeds the Bay of Fundy where Gen, Shelby & Yeonshee were found?
 
I have to say, for a population of that size, this amount of death/apparent suicide in young people - and their bodies all being found in the river - is VERY concerning.
 
I have to say, for a population of that size, this amount of death/apparent suicide in young people - and their bodies all being found in the river - is VERY concerning.

Agree! That they all were drowning, all no note, all women... does raise an eyebrow...
 
IS THERE A SERIAL KILLER ON THE LOOSE IN FREDERICTON ...
oldmaison.wordpress.com/.../is-there-a-serial-killer-on-the-loose-in-frederic...
Feb 13, 2013 - Matt Sloan was last seen during the Harvest Jazz and Blues Festival in Fredericton. He was found days later in the St.John River!! Many are…

Fredericton is one hour from Saint John......interesting...I have to look into this ...

I have to say, for a population of that size, this amount of death/apparent suicide in young people - and their bodies all being found in the river - is VERY concerning.

No matter what we try to say, statistics show that our Canadian crime rate is lower now than it has been since 1972. This holds true for the province of New Brunswick, with the only exception being the city of Moncton.

While I believe that murders may be frequently dismissed as suicides, I do not believe that all murders/suicides in the province are related.


Statistics Canada | Police-reported crime statistics in Canada, 2012
Lowest since 1972
http://www.statcan.gc.ca/pub/85-002-x/2013001/article/11854-eng.htm
__________

GNB | Crime Statistics in New Brunswick 2010
xm6alj.jpg

See page 11 for a better break down.
http://www2.gnb.ca/content/dam/gnb/...olice/CrimeStatisticsInNB2010AnnualReport.pdf
 
Some interesting information regarding suicide. From what we have heard about Gen, it doesn't sound like she was suffering from mental health issues serious enough to commit suicide. Her mother mentioned anxiety but she always remained positive. Positive people typically don't commit suicide. JMO.

Suicide rates: An overview
Statistics Canada Catalogue

Research shows that mental illness is the most important risk factor for suicide; and that more than 90% of people who commit suicide have a mental or addictive disorder.1,2 Depression is the most common illness among those who die from suicide, with approximately 60% suffering from this condition.3,4 No single determinant, including mental illness, is enough on its own to cause a suicide. Rather, suicide typically results from the interaction of many factors, for example: mental illness, marital breakdown, financial hardship, deteriorating physical health, a major loss, or a lack of social support.


http://www.statcan.gc.ca/pub/82-624-x/2012001/article/11696-eng.htm
 
is the St. John river the same one that feeds the Bay of Fundy where Gen, Shelby & Yeonshee were found?
Yes, but the location where the young man was found is not close to the locations where Yeonhee and Shelby were found; nor Genevieve.

Please read this for an indication of the size of the river and the area it spans.

Quote: "The Saint John River (French: Rivière Saint-Jean) is a river, approximately 418 miles (673 km) long, located principally in the Canadian province of New Brunswick but also in, and arising from the province of Quebec and the U.S. state of Maine. It forms part of the Canada – United States border in two different places along its length. The river drains an area of approximately 55,000 square kilometres (21,000 sq mi), of which slightly more than half is located in New Brunswick. Along that portion of the Atlantic shoreline of North America that lies between the St. Lawrence River and the Mississippi River, the Saint John River is the second longest waterway; only the Susquehanna is longer. The lower section of the Saint John River (extending from Fredericton to the City of Saint John) is nicknamed the "Rhine of North America" in reference to its popularity for recreational boating.[1] This section of the river is regulated by a hydro power dam located in Mactaquac, New Brunswick, whose head pond is very popular for boating, water skiing and swimming."
Read more: Saint John River
 
Agree! That they all were drowning, all no note, all women... does raise an eyebrow...
Agreed, and adding--they were all from the west side of Saint John; Genevieve and Shelby both attended Saint John High School as did Yeonhee's daughter; not a trace of these women was found until they washed ashore--not a bracelet; not an earring; not a cell phone; not a backpack, absolutely nothing.

These women went missing in very close to 6 month intervals.

The exact same area was searched for Yeonhee and Genevieve, running from Prince Street to the Boaz Restaurant.

Shelby and Yeonhee were both found within feet of the other's location at Long Wharf; Genevieve made it across the tip of the Bay--whether from tidal action or a different drop point is unclear.
 
Re: Found Deceased - Elizabeth (Beth) Fellows MISSING Jan 24th 2012
« Reply #23 on: March 07, 2012, 08:35:18 AM »
There is not a lot being said. Being as where she was found , I am taking it that it was a criminal cause of death, do any one know? Even on the family site not a lot is said




Re: Found Deceased - Elizabeth (Beth) Fellows MISSING Jan 24th 2012
« Reply #24 on: March 25, 2012, 07:52:39 AM »
She died of hypothermia.
Still find it strange she wasn't found sooner. I don't think there was much snow after she went missing but I'm not sure.
If she went into the river what are the chances she ended up pretty much where she was last seen?
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-brunswick/story/2012/03/23/nb-fellows-autopsy-1036.html



Re: Found Deceased - Elizabeth (Beth) Fellows MISSING Jan 24th 2012
« Reply #25 on: December 09, 2012, 11:01:44 AM »
I live down the road from where she was found. People, including myself, walk their dogs in this area. I and everyone in Fredericton is suspicious of this. If proper searching was conducted she wouldve been found, considering her body was located DIRECTLY behind the beer store where she was last seen. Either the search was botched or she was placed there. Also, I cannot remember if there was a storm or not, but maybe the snow covered her for 25 days..?




Found on the River bank,an hour from where Genn, Yeonhee, and Shelbywere found.........
 
www.monctonblogger.com/.../alanna-greenes-body-found-missing-moncto...

I am also looking into Moncton ,which is completes a triangle between Saint John and Fredericton.This girl was also just walking...

Foul play not suspected after body found in Moncton park: RCMP ...
atlantic.ctvnews.ca/foul-play-not-suspected-after-body-found-in-moncton-...
Sep 24, 2012 - RCMP have confirmed that 29-year-old Alanna Greene was found in Mapleton Park, just off Mapleton Road, before 4 p.m. Sunday. Greene was ...

My apologies...the first link does not appear to work.This girl had run out to do an errand and was found in a park,not far from the road......and foul play also not suspected?????:scared:
 
Some interesting information regarding suicide. From what we have heard about Gen, it doesn't sound like she was suffering from mental health issues serious enough to commit suicide. Her mother mentioned anxiety but she always remained positive. Positive people typically don't commit suicide. JMO.

Suicide rates: An overview
Statistics Canada Catalogue

Research shows that mental illness is the most important risk factor for suicide; and that more than 90% of people who commit suicide have a mental or addictive disorder.1,2 Depression is the most common illness among those who die from suicide, with approximately 60% suffering from this condition.3,4 No single determinant, including mental illness, is enough on its own to cause a suicide. Rather, suicide typically results from the interaction of many factors, for example: mental illness, marital breakdown, financial hardship, deteriorating physical health, a major loss, or a lack of social support.


http://www.statcan.gc.ca/pub/82-624-x/2012001/article/11696-eng.htm
I agree, Swedie! From your link, bolded by me:

Causes of suicide:
Mental illness: Yeonhee; yes, but was taking medication for her depression. Shelby; no. Genevieve; anxiety.
Marital Breakdown: Yeonhee, no. Shelby, no. Genevieve, no.
Financial hardship: Yeonhee, no. Shelby, maybe. Genevieve, no.
Deteriorating physical health: Yeonhee, no. Shelby, no. Genevieve, no.
A major loss: Yeonhee, debatable. Shelby, yes. Genevieve, no.
A lack of social support: Yeonhee, debatable. Shelby, no. Genevieve, no.

To explain some of my answers above ~~ I admit when I first heard of Yeonhee’s death, I thought suicide was possible. That’s how it was presented in the media, and I guess I bought it.

I do not think that is the case now. For one thing, I had never heard about Shelby until after Genevieve went missing.

Getting back to Yeonhee, depression medication often times does work.

Looking at financial hardship, considering the size of the reward that her husband offered for her, I believe it is safe to say that they were not poor.

She may not have known many Canadians, but I know in my area the Korean people reach out to each other. Many of them attend the same church and sit together as a group, enjoying themselves. They welcome any newcomers and are proud to have them.

Yeonhee’s husband said that they loved each other and that she wanted to come to Canada and even liked it here.

There are at least as many reasons to argue against suicide being the cause of her death, as there are to argue for it.

It’s exactly the same with Shelby—she had a three year old child to live for. She was very close to her grandmother and often lived with her. Her mother took care of her little boy, but she could see him any time she wanted.

After the loss of her second child in August, she was still staying at First Steps, which is an organization which helps young, single mothers.

Her lifelong friend said she was coping well, and the fact that she went uptown on a Saturday night somewhat confirms that she was not suicidal.

Here is a picture of Shelby in 2011—the year she graduated Saint John High.
41977.jpg
Shelby Dawn Williams
http://www.sjhigh.ca/alumni/directory.php?ALUMNI_ID=41977

And Genevieve, beautiful Genevieve. Her mother, and her aunt, and I don’t know how many others, said her anxiety was in her past. She was a sweet, caring girl getting ready to embark on her life journey.

She was excited about a job interview on Monday morning.

If any of us were to leave this earth tomorrow—and heaven forbid—I’d be willing to bet that they could find as many ‘causes’ for suicide in our lives as they have in the lives of these vital young women.

Also from the same link:
Quote: “It is estimated that for every completed suicide there are as many as 20 attempts.”

I have not read anywhere that Yeonhee, Shelby, or Genevieve ever attempted suicide at any prior time in their lives.

Quote: “The most common method of suicide in Canada has been hanging (44%), which includes strangulation and suffocation; followed by poising (25%) and firearm use (16%).

Males were most likely to commit suicide by hanging (46%) while females most often died by poisoning (42%) (Chart 2). Males (20%) were far more likely to use firearms than females (3%)."


I don’t see where throwing yourself in a cold, cruel river rates as even 1% among either sex.
 
Wow!! Very interesting and informative post on suicide. Also, is it just me or does that picture of Shelby look very similar to pictures of Gen? Until I read the printing beside the pic I thought it WAS genevieve.
 
Also, I never heard of all the disappearences in Fredericton despite being only an hour or so down the highway.
 
I agree, Swedie! From your link, bolded by me:

Causes of suicide:
Mental illness: Yeonhee; yes, but was taking medication for her depression. Shelby; no. Genevieve; anxiety.
Marital Breakdown: Yeonhee, no. Shelby, no. Genevieve, no.
Financial hardship: Yeonhee, no. Shelby, maybe. Genevieve, no.
Deteriorating physical health: Yeonhee, no. Shelby, no. Genevieve, no.
A major loss: Yeonhee, debatable. Shelby, yes. Genevieve, no.
A lack of social support: Yeonhee, debatable. Shelby, no. Genevieve, no.

To explain some of my answers above ~~ I admit when I first heard of Yeonhee’s death, I thought suicide was possible. That’s how it was presented in the media, and I guess I bought it.

I do not think that is the case now. For one thing, I had never heard about Shelby until after Genevieve went missing.

Getting back to Yeonhee, depression medication often times does work.

Looking at financial hardship, considering the size of the reward that her husband offered for her, I believe it is safe to say that they were not poor.

She may not have known many Canadians, but I know in my area the Korean people reach out to each other. Many of them attend the same church and sit together as a group, enjoying themselves. They welcome any newcomers and are proud to have them.

Yeonhee’s husband said that they loved each other and that she wanted to come to Canada and even liked it here.

There are at least as many reasons to argue against suicide being the cause of her death, as there are to argue for it.

It’s exactly the same with Shelby—she had a three year old child to live for. She was very close to her grandmother and often lived with her. Her mother took care of her little boy, but she could see him any time she wanted.

After the loss of her second child in August, she was still staying at First Steps, which is an organization which helps young, single mothers.

Her lifelong friend said she was coping well, and the fact that she went uptown on a Saturday night somewhat confirms that she was not suicidal.

Here is a picture of Shelby in 2011—the year she graduated Saint John High.
41977.jpg
Shelby Dawn Williams
http://www.sjhigh.ca/alumni/directory.php?ALUMNI_ID=41977

And Genevieve, beautiful Genevieve. Her mother, and her aunt, and I don’t know how many others, said her anxiety was in her past. She was a sweet, caring girl getting ready to embark on her life journey.

She was excited about a job interview on Monday morning.

If any of us were to leave this earth tomorrow—and heaven forbid—I’d be willing to bet that they could find as many ‘causes’ for suicide in our lives as they have in the lives of these vital young women.

Also from the same link:
Quote: “It is estimated that for every completed suicide there are as many as 20 attempts.”

I have not read anywhere that Yeonhee, Shelby, or Genevieve ever attempted suicide at any prior time in their lives.

Quote: “The most common method of suicide in Canada has been hanging (44%), which includes strangulation and suffocation; followed by poising (25%) and firearm use (16%).

Males were most likely to commit suicide by hanging (46%) while females most often died by poisoning (42%) (Chart 2). Males (20%) were far more likely to use firearms than females (3%)."


I don’t see where throwing yourself in a cold, cruel river rates as even 1% among either sex.

This is fantastic work Truth and thank you. Awww such another beautiful young lady. :( UBM-I agree and I cannot see someone choosing to commit suicide that way either. Wouldn't they think "what if I fail and suffer?". I know that sounds like a strange thing to say, but don't people who commit suicide want to do it in a way where it is fast and painless?! I would suspect so. JMO.
 

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