Found Deceased Canada - Genevieve Cormier, 19, St John, NB, 29 Sept 2013 - #2

[Sandpiper]

BBM, yes, I agree.

Two questions, if you don't mind:

1) When you mention a truck driving up the path, do you mean entering from Riverview Dr.?

And 2) Do you know if there is any connection between Yeonhee's family and the Boaz Restaurant? After I called the other night, I couldn't stop thinking about it. They are Korean and I'm sure I was talking to Korean people; also a Google search shows that it is a Korean and Japanese restaurant.

There are two of them--one in Rothesay and the one on Bridge St. Mr. Han came up with a $50,000.00 reward for any information that could lead to his wife's whereabouts.

So, I can't help wondering.

I finally found a link for the BoAz showing their hours, btw. If you scroll down at this link, it confirms that they are closed Sunday and Monday; open Tuesday, Wednesday, and Thursday from 11:30 am until 9:00 pm; open Friday and Saturday from 11:30 am until 10:00 pm.

Yes a truck would enter from Riverside Dr,it could have been parked farther down the path in the trees. Don"t know of any link between the Boaz and Yeonhee's family. The restaurant has been there for years and Yeonhee was only here 18 to 24 mos. I remember getting a flyer with the reward on it in my mailbox, thought it odd because it was only if she was found alive. Went down to the falls parking lot today and saw a tree with yellow plastic ribbon tied all over it. Don't know if this is because of Gen,but I don't think it was there in earlier visits. It was very forlorn feeling.

 

[Truth Prevails]

Yes a truck would enter from Riverside Dr,it could have been parked farther down the path in the trees. Don"t know of any link between the Boaz and Yeonhee's family. The restaurant has been there for years and Yeonhee was only here 18 to 24 mos. I remember getting a flyer with the reward on it in my mailbox, thought it odd because it was only if she was found alive. Went down to the falls parking lot today and saw a tree with yellow plastic ribbon tied all over it. Don't know if this is because of Gen,but I don't think it was there in earlier visits. It was very forlorn feeling.

Thanks, Sandpiper! You be careful poking around there.

I remember reading on Facebook that they tied yellow ribbons for Genevieve. So sad.

http://goo.gl/maps/LAHqF

I'm still more comfortable with Google; so I did the above from it. You can go in from the link and use the little man to take a look around. He won't go under the highway, but you can walk up and down Prince Street, and on Riverview Dr., until the overpass.

(I referred to Riverview Drive in a previous comment as Riverside Drive--sorry for this confusion.)

You know, I can't help thinking the local residents would have a good idea of who regularly takes vehicles in there, and any unusual ones.

If they would just keep these cases open and maybe offer a little reward through Crime Stoppers, (where you can call anonymously)--I can't help wondering what they might turn up.

 

[Sandpiper]

Thanks, Sandpiper! You be careful poking around there.

I remember reading on Facebook that they tied yellow ribbons for Genevieve. So sad.

http://goo.gl/maps/LAHqF

I'm still more comfortable with Google; so I did the above from it. You can go in from the link and use the little man to take a look around. He won't go under the highway, but you can walk up and down Prince Street, and on Riverview Dr., until the overpass.

(I referred to Riverview Drive in a previous comment as Riverside Drive--sorry for this confusion.)

You know, I can't help thinking the local residents would have a good idea of who regularly takes vehicles in there, and any unusual ones.

If they would just keep these cases open and maybe offer a little reward through Crime Stoppers, (where you can call anonymously)--I can't help wondering what they might turn up.

I don't know if people would notice vehicles going in there or not. The houses are really more spaced than they appear. The dark two story house on the water side backs completely onto that area of the road. The white house closest to the overpass has a blank side toward the path also. I noted this the first time I scoped the path out in the beginning. The rest of the road is on a slight downhill slope from the path.

 

[swedie]

Thanks, Sandpiper! You be careful poking around there.

I remember reading on Facebook that they tied yellow ribbons for Genevieve. So sad.

http://goo.gl/maps/LAHqF

I'm still more comfortable with Google; so I did the above from it. You can go in from the link and use the little man to take a look around. He won't go under the highway, but you can walk up and down Prince Street, and on Riverview Dr., until the overpass.

(I referred to Riverview Drive in a previous comment as Riverside Drive--sorry for this confusion.)

You know, I can't help thinking the local residents would have a good idea of who regularly takes vehicles in there, and any unusual ones.

If they would just keep these cases open and maybe offer a little reward through Crime Stoppers, (where you can call anonymously)--I can't help wondering what they might turn up.

Great maps/images and sleuthing Truth! And thank you for posting your valuable information and link regarding male/female suicides. :loveyou:

 

[LoyalSleuth]

Hi, LoyalSleuth. I apologize if you feel I'm butting in, and I hope you will forgive me.

I have addressed suicide statistics for the province of New Brunswick in previous comments, but I have since found figures pertinent to the city of Saint John, specifically.

http://www12.statcan.gc.ca/health-s...rchType=Contains&SearchPR=01&B1=Deaths&Custom

And here is the map showing the broad expanse of Zone 2--light green area--encompassing a larger swath than the city of Saint John, proper.

http://www.statcan.gc.ca/pub/82-583-x/2011001/article/11480-eng.pdf

Particularly, I hope you will note the difference between the male and female numbers. They are asking us to believe that three women, all within the last year, threw themselves in the river to drown.

I live in Moncton--and the Moncton suicide rate is higher than Saint John--but I assure you they do not happen every day.

Now, yes, the media will report a suicide as an sudden accidental death--to spare the family; but, believe me, word gets around and we hear that it was a suicide.

We are a sad lot at those funerals--left with only our feelings that we let our friend or loved one down.

I did live in Saint John for a little more than eight years, and I can say with absolute honesty that it is a vibrant, beautiful port city. The people are warm and caring; they are not the depressed, suicide driven folks that their law enforcement is currently making them out to be.

:cow:

Thank you for posting this TP. It does show some clarity around the vast difference between males and females. I agree the 3 women all throwing themselves into the river does seem inaccurate or questionable.

Do we know cause of death for any of them? I have searched and have not been able to find anything.

TP, you are doing amazing work, have you hared any of this with the detective in charge of these cases?

 

[Truth Prevails]

Excellent thought about a connection between Yeonhee and the restaurant.Could she have been on her way to work early that morning to prep for lunch.I wonder what day of the week she went missing,whether the restaurant was closed that day.....I'll try to find out who the google who the owner might be re: Mr Han. Thanks for the great thought Truth!

BBM - I have been searching, too; but have had no luck.

I know that in my area most South Koreans are small business owners. I visit a convenience store almost everyday that a South Korean couple purchased about three years ago--they didn't change it's name or anything.

6:00 am is such an early hour to be out, and it would be quite cool in April.

I know I used to leave around 7:00 am to walk to the bus stop to catch the 7:10 am bus. The city was pretty quite at that hour.

While I was searching, I came across another link showing the hours for the BoAz Restaurant, and this one does show a Sunday opening from 11:30 am until 3:30 pm.

I'm guessing the Facebook one is more accurate as they probably update that one themselves.

Still, they could have been open until 3:30 pm on the Sunday Genna disappeared. She was right in that area within an hour, so she could have gotten there within the tail end of people leaving. (Supposing they don't rush people right out.)

http://discoversaintjohn.com/places/boaz/

 

[Truth Prevails]

I don't know if people would notice vehicles going in there or not. The houses are really more spaced than they appear. The dark two story house on the water side backs completely onto that area of the road. The white house closest to the overpass has a blank side toward the path also. I noted this the first time I scoped the path out in the beginning. The rest of the road is on a slight downhill slope from the path.

I see what you mean--I went in on Google and took a better look.

Did you notice that they have the entrance blocked off with a cement barrier? You can see it here:

http://goo.gl/maps/Yaz8j

I know that doesn't always work in my area, either. If they are determined enough they can find a way around it.

I wish they would put up some surveillance cameras--either hide them, or maybe paint them with neon paint with a warning that says: "If you do anything here, it is going to be recorded!"

 

[Truth Prevails]

Thank you for posting this TP. It does show some clarity around the vast difference between males and females. I agree the 3 women all throwing themselves into the river does seem inaccurate or questionable.

Do we know cause of death for any of them? I have searched and have not been able to find anything.

TP, you are doing amazing work, have you hared any of this with the detective in charge of these cases?

This is really all that has been officially release. Pretty sketchy. I don't think we are going to hear any more, either--not even about Genevieve.

Shelby Dawn Williams:
Gone Missing: Saturday, September 22, 2012 (last seen in the uptown area)
Remains Found 21 days later: Saturday, October 13, 2012 (at Long Wharf)
Cause of Death: Quote: "An autopsy performed at the Saint John Regional Hospital on Oct. 14 and DNA tests helped determine the identity and the cause of death, said Henderson.

No further details will be released, he said."
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-brunswick/body-found-in-saint-john-harbour-identified-1.1226320


Yeonhee Choi: (Seven months after Shelby)
Gone Missing: Monday, April 22, 2013 (last seen on Prince Street at 6:00 am)
Remains Found 63 days later: Monday, June 24, 2013 (at Long Wharf)
Cause of Death: Quote: "The Saint John Police Force issued a statement Friday saying an autopsy determined there was no foul play in the death of Yeonhee Choi."
http://metronews.ca/news/canada/736585/n-b-police-identify-body-found-in-harbour/


Genevieve Cormier: (Five months after Yeonhee, and one year plus one week after Shelby)
Gone Missing: Sunday, September 29, 2013 (Last seen just beyond the BoAz Restaurant, West, heading towards the path she was known to travel, at 4:30 pm approximately.)
Remains Found 34 days later: Saturday, November 2, 2013 (at Anthony's Cove—across the top tip of the Bay of Fundy)
Cause of Death: Quote: "Foul play not suspected in death of Genevieve Cormier [OR] Police still waiting for autopsy report before ruling out foul play in Saint John teen’s death"
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-b...ected-in-death-of-genevieve-cormier-1.2355421

BBM (in your comment) - Hmmmm, something tells me my views would not be appreciated. I've been hoping he reads here--but that is quite a long shot.

 

[Sandpiper]

I see what you mean--I went in on Google and took a better look.

Did you notice that they have the entrance blocked off with a cement barrier? You can see it here:

http://goo.gl/maps/Yaz8j

I know that doesn't always work in my area, either. If they are determined enough they can find a way around it.

I wish they would put up some surveillance cameras--either hide them, or maybe paint them with neon paint with a warning that says: "If you do anything here, it is going to be recorded!"

Entrance wasn't blocked when Gen went missing. They were doing some kind of work,something to do with water pipes at the side of the path, there was even a small steamshovel digger thing just off the entrance.

 

[jillybean51]

www.cbc.ca/.../new-brunswick/saint-john-woman-still-missing-1.1184297

A little more about Shelby Williams.She disappeared at midnight.Not sure if she had any ties to West side.

 

[jillybean51]

Saint John woman still missing
Shelby Williams was last seen on Sept. 20th
CBC News Posted: Sep 28, 2012 6:18 PM AT Last Updated: Sep 28, 2012 8:00 PM AT






Shelby Williams has been missing since Sept. 22nd.

Saint John police are asking for help in finding a 20-year-old woman who's been missing for nearly a full week.

Shelby Williams was last seen Sept. 22nd at midnight in the uptown area. The disappearance of Williams, the mother of a three year old son, is a mystery to her family and friends. They say it's not like her to be out of touch.

"No idea, none at all," said Cody Hicks, a close friend of Williams. "It's not like her at all. She has a son. She was supposed to see him the next day. If something happens, she would call. But no calls."

Hicks says Williams constantly updated her Facebook page but there have been no posts from her since the 18th. Because she hasn't been calling or texting, Hicks says he's starting to fear the worst for his childhood friend.

Saint John police say they don't have any leads.

"We are requesting any information at all that the public might have, in regards to Miss Williams to contact the Saint John police at 648-3333," said Sgt. Ron Cooper of Saint John Police. "And we also encourage Miss Williams herself to contact our department in regards to her well-being."

Police say Williams was known to hang around Waterloo Street, an area many people connect with illicit drugs and prostitution. Hicks says she was staying in the area because she had to.

"She was staying in First Steps, as a place to stay, because she was pregnant and needed the assistance and that's in the Waterloo Area," said Hicks. "Also, her friends live on Garden Street, right next to Waterloo. No, she's not a prostitute."

Hicks says Williams lost her pregnancy near the end of August. He says she was feeling that loss but otherwise coping.

He describes his friend as an intelligent girl who managed to graduate high school, in spite of being a teenage mom, and in spite of some brief struggles with substance abuse. Hicks believed her troubled days were behind her.

Shelby Williams is described as being 5'4" tall, weighing approximately 110 lbs, slim build, hazel eyes and shoulder length brown hair. She was last seen wearing a bright green coat.

 

[Truth Prevails]

Entrance wasn't blocked when Gen went missing. They were doing some kind of work,something to do with water pipes at the side of the path, there was even a small steamshovel digger thing just off the entrance.

How interesting, Sandpiper. Thank you for this.

Gosh, I wonder if there was any work going on in the area when Yeonhee went missing.

 

[Truth Prevails]

www.cbc.ca/.../new-brunswick/saint-john-woman-still-missing-1.1184297

A little more about Shelby Williams.She disappeared at midnight.Not sure if she had any ties to West side.

The link won't open for me, Jilly; but from your longer comment I think it is this one: http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-brunswick/saint-john-woman-still-missing-1.1184297

And I came across this seven minute radio interview which is based on that write-up, and contains a little more information: http://www.cbc.ca/shift/2012/10/01/the-search-for-shelby-willams/

I did a transcript of the interview. In case the link won't play, I'll attach it below as a separate file.

I'll quote this one sentence from the transcript because it says that she did live on the west side:

Quote: They started off in Maces Bay; they later moved into town on the west side.

In a separate search, I did find her name as a graduate from Saint John High in 2011.

(I'm afraid we might get our comments removed as going too far off topic; so I apologize to the mods in advance for that trouble.)

 

[swedie]

Some interesting points I highlighted in this report regarding Yeonhee C. Wonder what early morning hours to her husband is? Did she sleep at all or just stay up all night and for whatever reason left before he awoke. He said they had only lived in NB for 18 months and sometimes she got lonely and homesick. I would assume he went through her clothing to figure out what she was wearing when she left or maybe she never changed into night clothes that night...

MOO.

The search efforts have been focused primarily around the family's lower west side home on Prince Street and the nearby Reversing Falls, where Choi often goes walking. But so far, there has been no sign of her, Han said.

He said he and his wife made supper together on April 21 and watched television until the early morning hours. When he woke up at about 7 a.m., she was gone, he said.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-b...sband-issues-plea-for-public-s-help-1.1393803

 

[Truth Prevails]

Some interesting points I highlighted in this report regarding Yeonhee C. Wonder what early morning hours to her husband is? Did she sleep at all or just stay up all night and for whatever reason left before he awoke. He said they had only lived in NB for 18 months and sometimes she got lonely and homesick. I would assume he went through her clothing to figure out what she was wearing when she left or maybe she never changed into night clothes that night...

MOO.

The search efforts have been focused primarily around the family's lower west side home on Prince Street and the nearby Reversing Falls, where Choi often goes walking. But so far, there has been no sign of her, Han said.

He said he and his wife made supper together on April 21 and watched television until the early morning hours. When he woke up at about 7 a.m., she was gone, he said.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-b...sband-issues-plea-for-public-s-help-1.1393803

As the details released are so scant, we don't know. April 22nd was a Monday, so their daughter would have had to get up for school, too.

It's as likely that she was able to provide a description of what her mother was wearing, as it is that they had to look through her clothes to see what was missing.

She sounds beautifully dressed to me, so I have trouble believing that she would have slept in those clothes.

Mr. Han also said that she loved both him and their daughter very much, and that she liked it here in Canada. Some of the reason that they moved here was because they wanted their daughter to improve her English and pursue her education.

Another small detail it gives, is that she was 'maybe' carrying a backpack. That's interesting because it could suggest that she was going somewhere specifically--not just an aimless walk.

Video at link as well as write-up: http://atlantic.ctvnews.ca/50k-reward-offered-in-case-of-missing-saint-john-woman-1.1260200

I can't forget: seven months after Shelby and five months before Genevieve. Similar disappearances; similar endings--in a relatively small city with a relatively low suicide rate; particularly amongst women. :cow:

 

[Sandpiper]

As the details released are so scant, we don't know. April 22nd was a Monday, so their daughter would have had to get up for school, too.

It's as likely that she was able to provide a description of what her mother was wearing, as it is that they had to look through her clothes to see what was missing.

She sounds beautifully dressed to me, so I have trouble believing that she would have slept in those clothes.

Mr. Han also said that she loved both him and their daughter very much, and that she liked it here in Canada. Some of the reason that they moved here was because they wanted their daughter to improve her English and pursue her education.

Another small detail it gives, is that she was 'maybe' carrying a backpack. That's interesting because it could suggest that she was going somewhere specifically--not just an aimless walk.

Video at link as well as write-up: http://atlantic.ctvnews.ca/50k-reward-offered-in-case-of-missing-saint-john-woman-1.1260200

I can't forget: seven months after Shelby and five months before Genevieve. Similar disappearances; similar endings--in a relatively small city with a relatively low suicide rate; particularly amongst women. :cow:

This backpack detail bothers me also. Was it a backpack backpack or one of those purse kind of packs? You wouldn't carry a backpack on a walk, I don't even carry a purse on a walk,but I guess if it was one of the purse type it wouldn't be so bad. Maybe she wanted to stop for a coffee somewhere. How does someone just disappear off the face of the earth? Maybe she planned on catching a bus. Did they ever find the pack anywhere?

 

[jillybean51]

This backpack detail bothers me also. Was it a backpack backpack or one of those purse kind of packs? You wouldn't carry a backpack on a walk, I don't even carry a purse on a walk,but I guess if it was one of the purse type it wouldn't be so bad. Maybe she wanted to stop for a coffee somewhere. How does someone just disappear off the face of the earth? Maybe she planned on catching a bus. Did they ever find the pack anywhere?

I agree Sandpiper.Boots ,tights and leather jacket as well.Not typical clothes to put on in the morning ,for walking in.It also bothers me that K9 dogs picked up nothing in this case as well.Also ,because these poor woman were found in the water,does not necessarily mean that they entered the water at the Reversing Falls location,if they were perhaps taken to another location first.moo

 

[Truth Prevails]

This backpack detail bothers me also. Was it a backpack backpack or one of those purse kind of packs? You wouldn't carry a backpack on a walk, I don't even carry a purse on a walk,but I guess if it was one of the purse type it wouldn't be so bad. Maybe she wanted to stop for a coffee somewhere. How does someone just disappear off the face of the earth? Maybe she planned on catching a bus. Did they ever find the pack anywhere?

I know, I wish we had more confirmed details to work with.

All I can find is that she was 'maybe' carrying a black backpack. They say that she had left her wallet, cell phone, and credit card at home.

No--as far as what has been released, they have never found the backpack--or anything that any of the women were known to have had in their possession at the time of their disappearance.

So, if she had a backpack, what would she have in there? This is a stretch, but maybe her lunch--if she was heading to somewhere she intended to stay for a few hours; and maybe a few toiletries like a tube of lipstick; and/or maybe a book to read. For me, this would definitely point to the fact that she didn't leave home with any thoughts of suicide in her mind.

Why she wouldn't have at least put her cell phone in there, I admit, is a mystery; but, maybe she just didn't use it that much.

I thought I read that Genevieve had 'maybe' had a backpack with her, too; but I can't find it right now. I did look quickly, and I came up with that it was the young man standing beside her at the counter, in the picture, that had the backpack. (You can see it in the picture.)

Maybe that's what I was thinking of--but if anyone remembers hearing that Genn also possibly had a backpack, please let me know.

 

[Truth Prevails]

I agree Sandpiper.Boots ,tights and leather jacket as well.Not typical clothes to put on in the morning ,for walking in.It also bothers me that K9 dogs picked up nothing in this case as well.Also ,because these poor woman were found in the water,does not necessarily mean that they entered the water at the Reversing Falls location,if they were perhaps taken to another location first.moo

BBM - Oh, Jilly--that thought is rising in me, too.

Shelby: Missing 21 days.
Yeonhee: Missing 63 days.
Genevieve: Missing 34 days.

Maybe their body weights had something to do with it too; Shelby was the lightest at 110 lbs; Genna seems to be in the middle with 120 1lbs to 125 lbs; and no weight has been given for Yeonhee.

I wouldn't put her much beyond 130 lbs to 135 lbs, though.

This is the evil that we are beginning to glimpse. Prayers aren't enough, but I pray anyway.

 

[LoyalSleuth]

BBM - Oh, Jilly--that thought is rising in me, too.

Shelby: Missing 21 days.
Yeonhee: Missing 63 days.
Genevieve: Missing 34 days.

Maybe their body weights had something to do with it too; Shelby was the lightest at 110 lbs; Genna seems to be in the middle with 120 1lbs to 125 lbs; and no weight has been given for Yeonhee.

I wouldn't put her much beyond 130 lbs to 135 lbs, though.

This is the evil that we are beginning to glimpse. Prayers aren't enough, but I pray anyway.

if we only knew approx days in the water, we would have something to link to abduction. We would be able to question where they were for x days if only in water for y days.

I am sure the police know from the autopsy reports how ling they were in the water, and maybe this is why they are reluctant to follow the abduction / murder theory?

Believe me, I am on the side of justice for these women, if its warranted, but I like to play devils advocate and explore all options...