CO - Jessica Ridgeway, 10, Westminster, 5 Oct 2012 - #10

[Eileen730]

Just a guess, but I would think whoever dropped the body did the deed in the dark of the night, didn't bother to "park" anywhere and was probably in and out in less than 3 minutes.

Maybe yes maybe no!
Sometimes it easier to hide in the light of day!

 

[csziggy]

The body was discovered early wednesday afternoon. LE may have some ideas about how long it had been there, but nothing has been released to the public. Nor have they said anything about the exact position of the body or if it was covered.

Yes, I realized that I had the day it was discovered wrong and edited my post, obviously after you quoted it!

 

[carbuff]

I agree NC. I think where the remains were placed is *sloppy* to use my own word.

It's sloppy because why not drive into Denver or another area and use a dumpster? IMHO there are probably countless human remains in landfills.

What is the ground like in that area? I know in parts of TX (some areas of Central and especially West TX) you can't dig but about 3-5 inches and you hit hardpan or straight out bedrock. Anyone know? If it's not, then why not drive over to colorado hills open space and obscure the remains there?

I think it might have just been sloppy. He planned her abduction and the subsequent crimes but he didn't plan throughly what he would do after or he did and his plans were messed up by some circumstances (out of his control).

Just thinking.

Hm, that could be. It is an interesting question.

There's a certain kind of urban person who drives out to the country to dump their trash. They throw bags of it off the side of the road and unload used refrigerators into streams. It's really crazy.

Every now and then there's a body, too.

It just seems to be the way some people think.

 

[GrainneDhu]

Not sure if it was from Tricia's radio show last night where I heard this...that this area may be frequented by "teens" for purposes of drinking and hanging out? Anyone else hear that, too?

If so, then vehicles in this area would not be unusual...

Judging from all the graffiti on the building, I'd say it's probably visited by teens.

Good point about people being used to seeing vehicles parked in the area.

 

[rosetattoo]

i'm very behind but I wanted to add another reason. DNA holds your medical status for most illnesses. Not all of it has been "decoded" yet, but at some point it will be. It can predict the likelihood of your getting heart disease, or diabetes, or dementia. This type of info would be such a boon to an insurance company, or to an employer who pays for your medical coverage... so it would not be crazy to think that if we started keeping banks of DNA data for people, this info would be sought out to be stolen and sold to the highest bidder. Much like the data linking your phone number and address with your browsing history is now.
The government is not the place to trust with this info, imho, and I am a liberal who actually believes in the benefits of a bigger government!!

Does anyone remember the movie "Gattaca"?

 

[SapphireSteel]

Judging from all the graffiti on the building, I'd say it's probably visited by teens.

Good point about people being used to seeing vehicles parked in the area.

Are there many animals prowling about?

It doesn't look like it would be a good spot for say, a bear, due to the lack of vegetation.

But what do I know? We have kangaroos and they are vegetarians.

Locals, is there likely to be a sizeable four legged predator around there?

:dunno:

 

[danzn16]

Obviously not. We're talking about Jessica Ridgeway.

But speaking of guns ... (maybe we can get back on topic)

Does anyone know what the laws are in Colorado regarding convicted felons having a conceal to carry permit? Is it a possibility that LE has gone over a list of all conceal to carry permit holders, perhaps to see if there is anyone of interest? I'm thinking the perp either knew her name to lure her, or used force of some kind ... flashing a gun perhaps. Although I know it may go against logic that the perp would have acquired a gun legally, you never know ... I know a lot of security officers have guns as a job requirement. Security guards will also have an official looking uniform, often a badge for identification, and an official looking car. A lot to think about ...

felons can not have a concealed carry permit. not in any state. and i seriously doubt any criminal would have a concealed carry permit. you have to take a class, you have to your fingerprints put into LE database, your have to have a psych background check, and criminal backgroud check. I can't think of any crime done by a concealed carry holder. These are law abiding citizens. Criminals don't abide by laws and will obtain a gun illegaly and don't care about laws restricting them and will not want their fingerprints on file.

 

[Kat]

Hm, that could be. It is an interesting question.

There's a certain kind of urban person who drives out to the country to dump their trash. They throw bags of it off the side of the road and unload used refrigerators into streams. It's really crazy.

Every now and then there's a body, too.

It just seems to be the way some people think.

It just doesn't jibe with me for some reason carbuff. Because abducting a child in daylight (she was abducted approx. an hour and half after sunrise). Many people are up and about getting ready to start their day for work or heading to work...so to me that indicates he thought about this--he fantasized about this--he probably spent time working out the details of how to get physical possession of her.

Then after reading so many of these cases on here carbuff--you and I both can probably speculate with a certain amount of accuracy what crimes may have possibly been commited while she was in his possession.

He wanted to make ID difficult (if we assume that the reports of the remains not being intact are from him--they may not be) but let's assume they are---he wanted to obscure identity.

Then he drops the remains by the side of a road? :waitasec:

Was that just an indication of the lack of regard he had for her? I don't know but the amount of time it takes to plan an abduction in order to have that person alone with you so you can commit further crimes against them...it just seems to me that he would have planned a better disposal site. That's why I'm wondering if he didn't get surprised by some unexpected circumstances. Something that made him panic and just get rid of the remains quickly.

Just speculating---doesn't mean I hold that opinion---thinking through my fingers

ETA: yikes carbuff it looks like I'm saying your post doesn't jibe. That's not what I meant haha just jumped off with what I was thinking...not directed at your post

 

[csziggy]

The site where the body was found is not visible from any homes.

Respectfully edited.

That's interesting since the person who was on Nancy Grace via telephone last week said he could see the activity of LE from his kitchen.

Aired October 11, 2012 - 20:00:00 ET

GRACE: Oh, dear. I`m going to go right now to Arvada, Colorado. Joining me is Jeff Stauffer. He lives right beside the area where the remains were found. Mr. Stauffer, thank you for being with us.

JEFF STAUFFER, LIVES NEXT TO SITE (via telephone): You`re welcome.

GRACE: Sir, how close is your house to where this body has been found?

STAUFFER: I`d say actually -- well, maybe a quarter mile away, if that far. I live up on a hill, so I kind of look down on the area back up to the open space of the park there. So I kind of watched everything.

GRACE: Mr. Stauffer, what did you observe? That`s what I was going to ask you. What did you observe?

STAUFFER: I did -- well, just yesterday afternoon, I actually thought there was a traffic accident there, you know, not knowing what was going on. And then it just stayed there for hours and hours, and through the night, obviously.

And so just watched, but I had no idea what had happened until I actually heard it on the news, which I guess was about 7:30 that they actually made it to the news. And then actually, my wife told me. So I watched the news at 10:00 o`clock, and then just they showed all the shots there, which is pretty much (INAUDIBLE) see from my kitchen window. So then this morning...

GRACE: Mr. Stauffer, you said they stayed through the night? What do you mean by that?

STAUFFER: Well, I`m assuming there was police through the night because there was a bunch of lights lit up there. They had a big fire truck that had the boom, had lights on that, that was shining on the area where that culvert was that they've been showing on the news, where they found the body or the remains.

And it was pretty lit up most of the night that I remember. You know, obviously, I went to sleep. But they were still there in the morning, and then there was other news crews that were down around that area this morning when I got up.

So I watched the news again. And I was just kind of watching -- they had to be at least 50 officers, I believe, that were kind of walking the area, and of course, you know, helicopters and everything else there, all kinds of truck and FBI personnel that I could, you know, see from vests and stuff from my kitchen, so...

http://www.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1210/11/ng.01.html

Emphasis added by me.

I checked the site on Google Earth and did not think any homes overlooked the area. Plus I Googled the gentleman and found where I thought he lived and didn't think that location could actually see the spot. Maybe he could see the glow of the lights over the hills and elaborated so he could be interviewed on TV, but it is kind of odd.

Oh yes - the reason I was looking at Google Earth was to see if there are street lights at the site where the body was left. No, there are not. It would have been very dark there that night.

 

[Tokalu]

I can't think of any crime done by a concealed carry holder. These are law abiding citizens. Criminals don't abide by laws and will obtain a gun illegaly and don't care about laws restricting them and will not want their fingerprints on file.

I agree, but my point is that I think this is someone that either knew Jessica from church (did she go to church?) or school, saw her name on her belongings, or was in an official car/uniform or had a gun. I really think security officers, school officials, even law enforcement officials, need to be looked at in this case. Security officers, at least in my neck of the woods, nearly always have a conceal to carry. Organized predators often get off on taunting LE, IMO this type of offender wants to get caught. BTK had a conceal to carry, he worked for a security company. I'm no expert, I just hope LE has cross referenced the conceal to carry list/people that bought guns in the area recently, or people who purchased things from police equipment stores, with a list of POIs or other tips in the case.

What are the rules on relaying information found on Facebook? There is someone who has a lot of interest in this case, but lives in another state and seems to have no family or friends from the area.

 

[izzyblizzy]

Are there many animals prowling about?

It doesn't look like it would be a good spot for say, a bear, due to the lack of vegetation.

But what do I know? We have kangaroos and they are vegetarians.

Locals, is there likely to be a sizeable four legged predator around there?

:dunno:

I live around here, (but up in the foothills west of Golden/Arvada). Just started reading on here today. Down there it would be coyote and fox. We do have bear and mountain lions up here, but it would be rare down there. Although there have been some cases of bears/elk etc wandering down into unusual habitats this summer because it has been so unusually dry.

But a coyote can do damage to Elk/deer carcass and certainly a child. (Although frankly I am convinced this is dismemberment, not animal damage to the body, just my opinion).

 

[KathrynL]

Are there many animals prowling about?

It doesn't look like it would be a good spot for say, a bear, due to the lack of vegetation.

But what do I know? We have kangaroos and they are vegetarians.

Locals, is there likely to be a sizeable four legged predator around there?

:dunno:

Coyotes for sure. We have them around here, and it's a highly populated area. moo

 

[miabellamoure]

It just doesn't jibe with me for some reason carbuff. Because abducting a child in daylight (she was abducted approx. an hour and half after sunrise). Many people are up and about getting ready to start their day for work or heading to work...so to me that indicates he thought about this--he fantasized about this--he probably spent time working out the details of how to get physical possession of her.

Then after reading so many of these cases on here carbuff--you and I both can probably speculate with a certain amount of accuracy what crimes may have possibly been commited while she was in his possession.

He wanted to make ID difficult (if we assume that the reports of the remains not being intact are from him--they may not be) but let's assume they are---he wanted to obscure identity.

Then he drops the remains by the side of a road? :waitasec:

Was that just an indication of the lack of regard he had for her? I don't know but the amount of time it takes to plan an abduction in order to have that person alone with you so you can commit further crimes against them...it just seems to me that he would have planned a better disposal site. That's why I'm wondering if he didn't get surprised by some unexpected circumstances. Something that made him panic and just get rid of the remains quickly.

Just speculating---doesn't mean I hold that opinion---thinking through my fingers

Anyone who abducts the most precious possession a family could have...a beloved child has zero regard imo.

On that note...it's all about him now. I think the perp does have regard but, only for his selfish-self.

He's delighting in dragging out the process of his crime. He deposits little pieces a little bit here and there...entertaining himself while LE & the public try and connect the dots.

 

[ZhaZhaHa]

I agree NC. I think where the remains were placed is *sloppy* to use my own word.

It's sloppy because why not drive into Denver or another area and use a dumpster? IMHO there are probably countless human remains in landfills.

What is the ground like in that area? I know in parts of TX (some areas of Central and especially West TX) you can't dig but about 3-5 inches and you hit hardpan or straight out bedrock. Anyone know? If it's not, then why not drive over to colorado hills open space and obscure the remains there?

I think it might have just been sloppy. He planned her abduction and the subsequent crimes but he didn't plan throughly what he would do after or he did and his plans were messed up by some circumstances (out of his control).

Just thinking.

Hard clay. The dirt out here sucks and is pretty hard to dig in. There has been very little moisture and so that makes things worse. It DID snow on Friday, but not much at all, not enough to collect (where i was anyway, but I did see cars in Boulder with about an inch of snow on top).

 

[IHAVENOCLUE]

We have the same thing in the town I live in in MA, you need to pjysically go to the PD, give your info, sign an agreement, and results are mailed to you. although other towns have them online. I requested one years ago and there must have been 20. But if I do a search on family watchdog and it brings up one or two.

where I live there are more than one search vehicles for RSO...

We can get pic, map of address,,age, identifiable marks, and what the incident(s) were...

I consider us lucky!

 

[miabellamoure]

I live around here, (but up in the foothills west of Golden/Arvada). Just started reading on here today. Down there it would be coyote and fox. We do have bear and mountain lions up here, but it would be rare down there. Although there have been some cases of bears/elk etc wandering down into unusual habitats this summer because it has been so unusually dry.

But a coyote can do damage to Elk/deer carcass and certainly a child. (Although frankly I am convinced this is dismemberment, not animal damage to the body, just my opinion).

I agree with you also that the first is probably the case but, considering the location and if the remains were still contained within some kind of bag then I would guess that that would be the work of the animals that inhabit that area.

I have Yorkies and even as little as they are they can turn a large kitchen trash bag inside out scattering every minute shred of garbage from here to there...lil' beasts.

 

[smh]

Are there many animals prowling about?

It doesn't look like it would be a good spot for say, a bear, due to the lack of vegetation.

But what do I know? We have kangaroos and they are vegetarians.

Locals, is there likely to be a sizeable four legged predator around there?

:dunno:

My house backs to open space here in CO a bit south of the metro area. And we do get tons of coyotes (fairly big ones), foxes and the occasional mountain lion. Bears have been reported but I've never seen one in the open space.

 

[Kat]

Hard clay. The dirt out here sucks and is pretty hard to dig in. There has been very little moisture and so that makes things worse. It DID snow on Friday, but not much at all, not enough to collect (where i was anyway, but I did see cars in Boulder with about an inch of snow on top).

Thanks Zha that pretty much explains why he just didn't dig! You ruled that out in my mind~ I appreciate it

 

[ZhaZhaHa]

Are there many animals prowling about?

It doesn't look like it would be a good spot for say, a bear, due to the lack of vegetation.

But what do I know? We have kangaroos and they are vegetarians.

Locals, is there likely to be a sizeable four legged predator around there?

:dunno:

Bears maybe if they're headed to town (where the people and food are), but this time of year I think most are headed back towards the mountains to get ready for hibernation.

Mountain lions have been sighted out by me, and I am further east than Arvada, so this is a possibility.

Biggest predator in this area is coyotes. They most certainly hunt this area. We also have large birds of prey, and if there were any remains left, they certainly could be responsible. Mostly hawks, but there are bald eagles here and there.

ETA: you'll also find fox, raccoons, skunks, etc etc etc out there

 

[ZhaZhaHa]

Thanks Zha that pretty much explains why he just didn't dig! You ruled that out in my mind~ I appreciate it

Sure! Gardening in Colorado is a PITA!