CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #17 *ARREST*

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I didn't follow the CW case closely. Was he abusive?
I'm just wondering if PF really was abusive or controlling, maybe he was just lazy and uninvolved. Just because he had the baby doesn't mean he wanted to or have any more.
It's all just speculation. We just don't know.
 
My random thought is if custody was PF’s motive I pray KB’s parents get custody if that is what is in store for tomorrow’s hearing. Maybe that blow could cause him to talk...MOO
 
I didn't follow the CW case closely. Was he abusive?
I'm just wondering if PF really was abusive or controlling, maybe he was just lazy and uninvolved. Just because he had the baby doesn't mean he wanted to or have any more.
It's all just speculation. We just don't know.
We dont know. But all of the hairs on the back of my neck are up based on my expereince. He may have been abusive but no one saw. He could have been a master manipulator. It is what my gut is saying. IMO
 
<modsnip>

In the case you quoted, his income might have been useful to a woman who didn't have any.
 
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I didn't follow the CW case closely. Was he abusive?
I'm just wondering if PF really was abusive or controlling, maybe he was just lazy and uninvolved. Just because he had the baby doesn't mean he wanted to or have any more.
It's all just speculation. We just don't know.

We don't know anything about their relationship, but maybe it wasn't a relationship. Didn't they meet on an online dating site? For all we know it was a few hook-ups that resulted in a pregnancy. He may have been completely blindsided by the pregnancy, and even more blindsided that she was going ahead with the pregnancy. Maybe he stepped up as much as possible, perhaps genuinely enjoyed having a little girl to care for, and then there was perhaps a change of circumstances that meant even more changes to his life that he never expected or intended. Maybe he felt cornered by changes in his life that he didn't want, and that drove him to a breaking point.

All I know is that they had a child together and any plans for a life together were quickly sidelined.

I think I need to add the caveat that this is nothing more than trying to understand the dynamics of how they ended up in the situation where one is missing and presumed deceased and the other is in custody for murder. I'm not blaming anyone.
 
Happy you both are out and okay!!!! Not that versed on documented family dynamics of all abusers, but the one's (abusers) I have known come from families that enable, are complicit and are what is often referred to as "flying monkeys".
Thank you! Wow, I feel like this site is so theraputic. I love my WS community. I am only seeing this through a different set of eyes based on my experience. It is very chilling to me and I can almost envision the life they had. <modsnip: re discussing family members> IMO
 
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Thanks for the info. So is the preferred method, just to click the report button on the OP then?
Yes. Report and “scroll and roll” is the official stance, I believe. The mod will send a message explaining why their post was edited/removed. But I think it is helpful to let new people know they might be breaking the rules. I’ve seen a post “quoted” and then mostly deleted in the reply. With the RSBM included (respectfully snipped by me).
 
I can’t judge his parenting...but I do think he was committed and involved. I don’t see any reason to think he did not want custody, and every reason to think he did.
I agree with you & all others who hold this view. Also to add, my belief is KB may have expressed that she wanted to move back to her family with the baby. I would think his mother would be very attached to baby K. He may have done this all more for her than himself.
 
BBM

I have a different opinion about child care. I think that the first 6 years are the most critical in development. Socialization, stability, structure, routine etc. is very important even at 15 months. The priority should be about the child's wellbeing, not the parent's convenience. The child was well past the age of being dragged around with PF while he worked.

If Kelsey or her parents realized/believed that the child had her own needs, that conversation could have put PF on the defensive such that he may have felt that he was losing control of their child. The financial free ride would be over.

At 15 months, most children are walking, climbing, talking, exploring and soaking up the world. What sort of care could she receive with the donkeys?
I agree! Educational Day Care was absolutely the best thing for my child. She was shy and it really helped her to develop social skills. She was fascinated in everything and needed the stimulation every day, all day long. It would be nearly impossible for someone, especially an older woman with health issues, to provide that all day.
Although they do get sick a lot, once they get to Kindergarten they have developed immunity so that's less sick time from work later.
It wouldn't surprise me at all if Kelsey wanted her daughter to be in a day care environment rather than out on the ranch all day. Imo
 
I didn't follow the CW case closely. Was he abusive?
I'm just wondering if PF really was abusive or controlling, maybe he was just lazy and uninvolved. Just because he had the baby doesn't mean he wanted to or have any more.
It's all just speculation. We just don't know.

The fact that he took her to his ferrier jobs leads me to believe that he was proud of having a daughter, while at the same time unaware or unconcerned about the needs of a 15 month old child. Children change so quickly at that age. One day they're sucking on a bottle and sleeping most of the day, needing little more than a few diaper changes, and the next thing you know they're swinging off the drapes and needing to learn how to use the toilet in close proximity to the toilet.
 
I agree with you & all others who hold this view. Also to add, my belief is KB may have expressed that she wanted to move back to her family with the baby. I would think his mother would be very attached to baby K. He may have done this all more for her than himself.

I understood that she had her dream job. Wouldn't that suggest that she was living where she wanted to live?
 
I cannot imagine how difficult it would be for a VI to post with any frequency or in depth discussion of an on going investigation. She was most probably instructed by LE to not post or share on any MB or SM.

The time that PF had custody of Baby K before his arrest must have been an unimaginable tightrope to walk for LE and the family. :(
ITA.
 
True story and not meant to go off topic but it is kinda on topic. I went through a divorce when my son was a teenager. Hooked up with my junior high school crush at a high school reunion shortly after. I grew up with him. Thought this was the real deal. He was kind, loving, supportive and took a big interest in my son. He lived in a small mountain town not far from Woodland Park. My son was struggling with issues surrounding the divorce. He grew to love and trust this man. We moved up to this small mountain town on top of a mountain where there was a gate, like PF's. There were cows, horses, chickens. We were isolated from my friends and family. It was a family property. The emotional and physical abuse started and it was life changing. No one can hear and the family living in different outbuildings and campers ignored it. It was gaslighting. At first I felt loved and protected, then I was in fear for my and my sons lives. The family was complicit. I will never ever forgive myself for putting my son and I in that horrible situation. I could have very easily been KB. There is so much danger out there everywhere, and looks can be deceiving. Other families had no idea. This was a church going family. Just sayin'. Doubt I will ever recover emotionally, nor my son. But we did it. There are strange families out there who appear to be normal. IMO And they protect their blood above everything. Edited to say that I had a good job and my own money that was snuffed out due to this man and his families weird beliefs. I was a trusting and vulnerable person, and I see Kelsey this way. For a time, we lost everything....our souls, our self respect, our innocence , and our security. But we got out, in a bilzzard with what we had on our backs.
That is spine chilling - and very much on topic, IMHO. I think this is very likely the situation KB was in. Thank God you got out of that squirrel cage. Sending hugs.
 
I understood that she had her dream job. Wouldn't that suggest that she was living where she wanted to live?

I think the idea of her moving away, or wanting to, comes from thinking they were no longer a couple. But I believe he only told her family they had broken up. Nothing else points to a break-up. Still, he may have feared she might take the child away or marry someone else, if they did break up soon, i.e if things were shaky.

But it is impossible to know what their relationship was as of that last day, and we will never know, imo. He won’t talk, won’t tell the truth if he does, imo, and no one else seems to know her feelings. Jmo
 
I agree! Educational Day Care was absolutely the best thing for my child. She was shy and it really helped her to develop social skills. She was fascinated in everything and needed the stimulation every day, all day long. It would be nearly impossible for someone, especially an older woman with health issues, to provide that all day.
Although they do get sick a lot, once they get to Kindergarten they have developed immunity so that's less sick time from work later.
It wouldn't surprise me at all if Kelsey wanted her daughter to be in a day care environment rather than out on the ranch all day. Imo

At 15 months, she would have been changing every week. Kelsey was a pilot, no small achievement. I'm assuming that Kelsey wanted more for her daughter than looking backwards in a truck driving from work site to work site all day. How was PF managing normal activities for a 15 month old such as toilet training, fine dexterity, meals, language, social interactions with peers? I could easily see that as the concern regarding their daughter at 15 months of age.

Every child has to build immunity, the sooner the better.
 
I agree with you & all others who hold this view. Also to add, my belief is KB may have expressed that she wanted to move back to her family with the baby. I would think his mother would be very attached to baby K. He may have done this all more for her than himself.

The more I think about this, the more it makes sense. If the PF/KB relationship was deteriorated as I suspect it was, I doubt PF had anything good to say to mother about KB. And mother appears to have spent a lot of time with the child.

Whether KB could just take off with the baby to Idaho, probably not. But it is very possible that PF and mother would think it perfectly legal.

Gone forever. Without any way to prevent it. Hmmmm...
 
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