Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #25

[Starkville]

I think it's rather hypocritical for people to berate others for speculating about possible issues SW may have had, then continuously refer to him as a "narc," and post photos to "prove" he didn't have a psychotic break (a photo isn't enough info to rule out a diagnosis any more than it is to rule one in). There is plenty of discussion regarding whether CW is a sociopath or a psychopath, and nobody has his psych eval handy, either.

If it's not okay to even discuss possible issues SW may have had, then it's not okay to discuss what possible issues CW had. Yes, he's the one accused, but that doesn't mean we suddenly have enough information to diagnosis him! And, he's accusing her, so we have every right to consider what kinds of issues would likely exist if his story is true.

It is reasonable, considering his defense, to explore his version, and look into the dynamics and interactions within the family is part of that.

We do lots of speculating at WS. That's part of what we do!

Also, people keep saying, "but he was charged with ____." Okay, so since when do charges = conviction? Never. We don't convict people without a trial. So the fact that the DA had enough evidence to feel comfortable charging him with those charges does not on its own mean he's automatically guilty!

NOBODY HERE HAS EVER EXCUSED HIS ACTIONS. Ever. Trying to see what his possible motive was is not excusing him. Recognizing that the dead had flaws while living is not excusing him nor disparaging SW--it's looking at lots of different angles.

My first reaction seeing his interview was, "omg he killed them all!" After hearing his story, though, I thought, "well, perhaps not." At this point, I think it's more likely than not that he killed the girls, but I still have reasonable doubt. I'd like to see the causes of death, times of death, items and clothing which were or were not with the bodies, etc. I simply need more information to make my conclusion. There's nothing wrong or disrespectful or stupid about that!

I don't know what piece of evidence would absolutely change my mind. It's an "I'll know it when I see it" kinda deal. If the girls have Chris size bruises on their necks, well then that's a huge piece of evidence against him, and my opinion would be greatly influenced by that!

But I reserve my right to withhold judgement ABOUT EITHER OF THEM, while I explore and wait for more evidence. It's gotten beyond tiresome being accused of being a CW fangirl, or somehow "against" SW--it's so twisty and unnecessary. For example, a few days ago, I said something about how Nico wasn't in the forefront of Chris's mind while this was going on. That was twisted into "Chris just somehow miraculously forgot his wife was pregnant." That's an example of the ongoing absurd twisting, and it's not really helpful to anyone.

Flourish, I am really with you on this. Being totally

I just don’t see CW (or SW!) as narcissist personalities.

If I were giving my armchair internet therapist diagnosis, I’d say CW had a walloping case of learned helplessness and repressed rage.

JMO

 

[Savmom]

And some families do have chronic long term illnesses, because you don't does not mean that others can't.

YES, YES, YES!!!

My oldest (son) was a very healthy child. Typical boy with cuts, bruises, breaks, etc. But his overall health was very good. Rarely sick, couple colds/flus but no chronic illness ever.

My youngest (daughter) was the opposite. From birth she had a myriad of undiagnosable symptoms. We went through 23 doctors by the time she was 4yo before we discovered what was wrong (too many things to list lol but the worst is Temporal Lobe Epilepsy that almost killed her).

My dh & I also have health problems. I cannot tell you how many so-called "concerned family members" accused us of abuse because of all the doctors we were taking her to! Their reasoning was well your oldest is fine and she looks healthy and her symptoms seemed eerily similar to ours. OK.

Needless to say, if dr's believed for one second that SW was attention seeking with the girls health or whatever, they would have been on it like stink on crap. No way they would give her actual medicinal scrips for imaginary mom-created illnesses!

 

[violet101]

Having her kids constantly sick goes against the whole Thrive lifestyle to me, so I would think if she was really making something up it would be the opposite. I just don’t think having little ones sick a lot is abnormal. We only know about it all because she posted everything on fb.

 

[Madison418]

Flourish, I am really with you on this. Being totally

I just don’t see CW (or SW!) as narcissist personalities.

If I were giving my armchair internet therapist diagnosis, I’d say CW had a walloping case of learned helplessness and repressed rage.

JMO

And I would say your armchair internet therapist diagnosis is probably pretty close to accurate IMO

 

[Silver~Bell]

I’m not an expert in the oil business but I would take “inactive” to mean that it’s not in use. So I would imagine an empty tank just sitting there.

If it’s being used for storage, then it would be “active.”

I don't understand the use of the word inactive either if it has oil in it. If the well(s) are inactive, the tank battery would eventually be pumped out and the oil sold and a pumper wouldn't need to visit...MOO

 

[brookryn]

I do not understand why doubting that she was ill and that she was faking her kids illnesses have anything to do with this case .
What does it matter if her kids did or did not have asthma? What does it matter if some people think that she took them to the doctors too often?
What does all that prove? Lots of people go to the doctors very often. It does not mean that they are mentally ill. It means that they have ongoing conditions and no one can tell another person how often they should see a doctor.

I think the skepticism comes from that it’s probably that some are speculating SW’s image that she presented to the world that they were upper middle class, money was supposedly flowing with the mlm, & that her relationship with CW was peachy keen; when in fact it all was a fairytale she portrayed. That kind of behavior has red flags written all over it.

Before I get flamed for this- SW, CCW, BW, & NW did NOT deserve to die. All the crazy hoopla of above paragraph is no justification for the murders. It’s not placing blame. CW told a story (which while he is a definite proven liar & his “story” should be taken with a grain of salt), it’s also important to look at how it could be possible, and/or why/what led him to supposedly snapped in a rage killing his family members. Wanting to know the truth however doesn’t make someone a CWfangirl. I think we can all agree that we all want the truth to this horrific crime.

I’m 99.9% sure he did all the murders based on his actions after & what charges state, but I also like to look outside the box. Not all cases are black and white, and I think there will be a few more shockers to come. And if some of the rumors are actually proven to be true, well I for one won’t be shocked at all. I also think CW was banging more than a few APs. I wouldn’t be surprised if both had APs, or if one of the APs isn’t in the same group of friends/MLM group. When ya do shady things, shady things happen. MOO.

 

[MassGuy]

This is not directed at those who need more evidence to believe C.W. killed them all. This is directed at those who believe that SW killed her kids, and thus, CW’s story is true.

Specifically, what evidence can you point to that makes you feel this way?

Why do you think this scenario is more likely than the alternative?

How do you discount CW’s post offense behavior?

Some of us are trying to understand your point of view. Thanks!

 

[MerryB]

Its interesting that you mention midwives and chiropractors, my sister in law used both. The chiropractor was who diagnosed and treated the allergies. Never understood that. I wonder if SW was interested in the holistic approach to the medical problems. Not that it matters but it is very strange to me how my sister -in -law explained the way the kids were tested by the chiropractor. I had never heard of them treating allergies before that. Jmo

Yes, she was. IMO this is where many of the diagnoses came from. I’ll find a link to her SM post of baby Bella receiving chiropractic manipulation & will add it here.

 

[Inthedetails]

delete

 

[NuttMegg]

I don't understand the use of the word inactive either if it has oil in it. If the well(s) are inactive, the tank battery would eventually be pumped out and the oil sold and a pumper wouldn't need to visit...MOO

By "battery" do you mean the collection of tanks at that pad?

 

[Inthedetails]

delete

 

[NuttMegg]

oops, dup.

 

[CFlo]

I found Trinket78's posts about separation -

What's not clear to me is why CW continued to have sexual relations with SW which would result in a pregnancy if he wanted a separation? He was having an affair with his co-worker, surely he could refuse SW for any number of reasons.

Hiya @PrimeSuspect. First let me apologize if this post is jumbled more than scrambled eggs! I’ve tried to fix, but in my current view on iPad, it still seems well.... like scrambled eggs LOL.
We all can speculate on that until the cows come home and offer up a dozen or two scenarios that some of us lived in our own lives, but we really can’t state as fact for CW/SW. And none of the VIs actually lived with this family, AFAIK, so they cannot state as fact either (which I have seen them all readily admit here, fortunately).
As for sex while having affairs, who knows and I don’t think he really knew why, somtnat dofficult, of not impossible to try to pinpoint. IMO.
BUT, I have unfortunately been in both the wife and AP scenarios (AP in my case I believed lies and was prior to SM where I could’ve seen public posted family dynamics with my own eyes). One VI stated SW “loving up on him”via her public SM posts was the reason that CW deleted/inactivated his FB. Again, in their opinion but given my experience, I believe they are correct there. And, CW shows this in the interviews, IMO.
So given that, speaking of my ex husband:
He was raised Catholic
Was US Navy for 24 years
Was married prior to me, with two children.
Long story short, after a year post separation, he admitted cheating on me 17 times (other women, other MEN, and with men/women couples).
His reason was later that I was so loyal and did nothing wrong, but he had lived, 47 years at that point, believing he MUST live a certain “way”. And he wanted his cake and eat it too.
I could go on and on with the parallels as to my experiences vs. CW and or SW, as a lot of us could. But, in my own experience as laid out, an AP is a lot different than a spouse. IMO, SW was a great spouse (others may not see that, that’s their opinion). My last experience was he would do any thing to make it up to his wife. And she being “clock ticking” age (either biologically, which isn’t my opinion or scientific facts, or part of THEIR plan) could’ve fell for it. He preyed upon her emotions and female hormones, point blank.
I am one of those that believe that HE wanted and encouraged for the 3rd child though, so given all the above, I could be bias as I formerly posted.
I have more my own thoughts/facts but don’t feel comfortable divulging here at this time.
I have read all available SM and MSM and that’s the conclusion I’m sticking with until more is provided to us all.

 

[Layla123]

There have been cases where parents have made excuses for unnecessary doctor/medical visits. I think some posters are looking if that's a possibility in this case. I don't think anyone is saying it's for sure what SW was doing, but they are looking at the possibilities. You know it's sort of looking at everything, throwing it at the wall and seeing what sticks. I don't see anything wrong with looking at everything. JMO

My granddaughter has bad allergies, she has an inhaler and an epi pen nearby at all times. She’s been hospitalized several times for asthma, where she’s had it so bad she could barely breathe. It is terrifying to see a child in that condition. It looks like they are dying. We are all on high alert whenever we are responsible for her care because not only do we have to constantly be on the lookout for known allergens, we have to constantly be watching to make sure she doesn’t suddenly start gasping for air because she was exposed to something new that set her off. Children do die from asthma attacks. I hope you all wouldn’t accuse us of being overprotective and of showing signs of having Munchausen syndrome by proxy. We just love her very much and don’t want anything to happen to her.

 

[MsBetsy]

I'm just so unbelievably sad for Shan'ann. As every hour, day, week passes there is no let up to my sadness and I watched the video someone posted earlier where she talked about her life, the bad times and how Chris lifted her from all of that. She spoke with such hope and happiness - but now (and only now) I can see/feel that she was 'kidding herself'. Whatever hurt happened in her first marriage and during the health challenges was probably nothing compared to what actually went on in that house with CW, but how desperately she wanted everything to be good, perfect even. How desperately she wanted and deserved her 'Happy Ending', her fairytale. And how hideously opposite her fate was to be. I can't get over this. The only thing I wish for is that these angels can rest in peace, together. I don't like the dishonouring of her by the dissection and (mis?)interpretation of her every move on social media.

That's exactly why she reminds me of Laci Peterson. She only saw, or preferred to see the beauty around her. As if she was shielded by that safe exterior. She couldn't see her husband for who he was, even though he had affairs and she was aware... but in denial. Neither one of them were good at expressing emotions. But she had them, and he didn't. At least not when it came to anyone other than himself. She never saw it coming, either. Jmo

 

[Layla123]

What gives you the impression that SW may have grown tired of always pushing him to carry his weight?

All the high praise she constantly gave him in her videos. It was a bit over the top. IMO.

 

[Jennifer17]

Yes, she was. IMO this is where many of the diagnoses came from. I’ll find a link to her SM post of baby Bella receiving chiropractic manipulation & will add it here.

But what is the point that you are making? She killed her children because she used a chiropractor?

 

[Tippy Lynn]

There was something like that yesterday, but it was clearly a joke, and the person on the receiving end of the joke was laughing too, many of us were. Anyway, I get posts deleted if I talk about other posters......jokes aren't OK from time to time?

I know what I saw and it clearly wasn't a joke so we must be talking about different posts. Anyhow, it's probably best if agree to disagree and move on.

 

[Marli61]

Wow, they must have a way to transmit the backup camera images back to the field house. Our trucks did not have that, but maybe it's needed for OSHA requirements for a "spotter" if the rear of the truck obstructs the back view. Does your husband drive a truck bigger than a pickup? Our pickup trucks had the cameras and a beep-beep-beep to warn it was backing up. Where my son works the tank trucks have an automatic backing program that runs, the guys don't touch the controls, it backs up for them. But he drives a little hotshot pickup F250 and all it has is the GPS.

Ok... I've got new info from Mr. Marli. He says the pkps that are equipped with this at his work are a 1/2 ton, 3/4 ton & ton. Among other alerts, such as; no seat belt, speeding, erratic driving (stopping abruptly, rapid acceleration from stops, passenger present, etc), it gives an alert when the pkp is put in reverse. This all goes into a computer program that is monitored by safety personnel. It will give a report at the end of the month, but can be looked at at any given time.
@WildWest

*edited to fix broken unnecessary quote

 

[Silver~Bell]

By "battery" do you mean the collection of tanks at that pad?

Yes, tank battery, the storage tanks, the water tanks.