CO - The Stalking and Mysterious Death of Morgan Ingram #1

[twinkiesmom]

I am working from inference here, but it would seem to me that the Ingrams lived in the Los Angeles area in 2003, as the hospital which did the work up on the CO2 poisoning was UCLA, Mattel's Children's Wing. It's a top notch hospital, and there is reference to Toni giving information to the Dr they saw there for a second opinion after Morgan died. I suspect they contacted the Dr because they were looking for an underlying reason that may have caused Morgan to die (e.g. the unmade porphyria dx).

So I'm of the opinion that they lived in the area of Los Angeles before moving to Colorado. Given that they'd been in the Aspen Valley for 6 1/2 years prior to Morgan's death, that would give a move date of +/-'04 ish. (2011 - 6.5 = 2004, June). (The Dr visit at UCLA was in 2003).

What I'm wondering is which Dr. rx'd the amitriptyline in Colorado, as the rx was about 2 years old (or 1.5 years old), and how much she was given, and how much she used. It may be important to note that the paramedic on scene told Toni that there were no unaccounted for pills in the bottle, meaning none were missing. Unless it was an unused rx, some pills had to be missing, so that leads me to believe that say, out of a 30 pill rx, 28 remained, and those two missing pills were not enough to cause a lethal dose or buildup in Morgan. Or some similar number, given we don't know the mg of the dose or how many pills were given at the time the rx was filled.

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Herding Cats

Could the UCLA visit have been a second opinion or during a vacation visit? I remember Mom saying they had lived in that area of CO since the 70s. Also, believe they have an adult child living in CA.

 

[LadyL]

The only reference to crime scene handling I've heard (again, from the family blog) is that LE "cleared the house". Whatever that means. When I first read it, I thought it meant "verified there was no foul play by acceptable protocol and procedures". Later on, I thought maybe it meant "made everyone present leave and then whatever happened".

Granted, I may have missed something.

'clearing the house' means checking all rooms/closets etc. for suspects

 

[concernedmother]

A 20 yr old without any health problems doesnt fall over dead. That should have been a huge red flag (maybe not to family because they are grieving) but to LE.

 

[MayraMM]

My post about the CO poisoning ended up in the last page, and some might miss it, but I think it's important to note that her death would make the SECOND case of poisoning in her short life.

 

[LadyL]

In Colorado, all stalking is felonious. It's just degrees. There is no misdemeanor stalking, so either the cops weren't forthright with mom, or she misunderstood. I posted a link a couple of pages back that explained the degrees of stalking felonies and how they're bumped up to a higher level (usually repeat offender).

I think LE said in the beginning it would be a misdemeanour trespassing charge if they caught someone ... and that there was no solid evidence to warrant a felony charge of stalking at that point

that was my understanding anyway ... FWIW

 

[koalabear]

Hi all, this is my first post here. I have been following M's blog for a couple of weeks and have been reading all your posts here and WOW you guys are amazing.

Wanted to mention that has anyone looked into K's dad? He did (not sure if he still does) work at the same place mom said they all got their prescriptions filled. He was in a management role also, which may explain how K came to be working there.

He also has an extensive history of hunting (not sure if anyone has bought that up before) and there are some pics of K and his dad hunting, some similar to the quiet times in the blog. He has a lot of posts on a hunting website, ALOT.

Also someone mentioned finding E's name and FB. Any clues on where to go for this? Also curious about B's baby daddy, someone mentioned they figured out the father. Would like to know where to look for this too.

 

[MayraMM]

I think LE said in the beginning it would be a misdemeanour trespassing charge if they caught someone ... and that there was no solid evidence to warrant a felony charge of stalking at that point

that was my understanding anyway ... FWIW

Mom keeps referring to the time when the case was elevated to felony stalking, hinting at some specific event that caused that change in status. Either I read it as they were calling is misdemeanor stalking or I assumed that's what she meant.

I wish she'd tell us what the event was already!

 

[ttcRider]

A 20 yr old without any health problems doesnt fall over dead. That should have been a huge red flag (maybe not to family because they are grieving) but to LE.

She didnt look too healthy in some of the pictures posted... she was loosing weight and had dark circles under her eyes. I am surprised she wasnt admitted to the hospital for exhustion. IMO

 

[marycarney]

She didnt look too healthy in some of the pictures posted... she was loosing weight and had dark circles under her eyes. I am surprised she wasnt admitted to the hospital for exhustion. IMO

Regular people are not admitted to the hospital for exhaustion. You have to be paying out of pocket (read that: Hollywood-type) to get admitted for a condition which can be treated at home.

 

[ttcRider]

Regular people are not admitted to the hospital for exhaustion. You have to be paying out of pocket (read that: Hollywood-type) to get admitted for a condition which can be treated at home.

Have we learned if she was under a dr.'s care and perhaps treated at home?

 

[alwaysonmymind]

BBM
I am HIGHLY SKEPTICAL of a paramedic telling a family member this. They do not operate in the world of making these determinations, and once she was declared dead, they would have packed their bags, and left the scene in the hands of law enforcement. Also, at the time, how would ANYONE have suspected the Elavil - the cause of death being undetermined at the scene.

Exactly.

 

[Cazzie]

I've been re-reading the blog looking for something, and found this that didn't "hit" me before.

http://morganingram.com/wordpress/?p=859

Aug. 30...Morgan came home with a group of friends and they all looked at the stalker photo from the early morning hours (and are freaked out). This is the same day that Morgan later sends the email to LE about K (after Mom told her about E coming over earlier and mentioning that K lives in the neighborhood).

WHO was in this group of friends that came over and were shown the stalker photo?

 

[crymesolver]

Tragic story, thanks to everyone for their input and hard work. It is only a matter of time before this culprit prays on another target as about 95% of stalkers are serial in nature and will not stop. I feel pretty confidant that (K) is the perp in question here and it is only a matter of time before he crawls out of his little mole hole and messes up. IT appears that this suspents father is possibly a manager at a grocery store of some type, so maybe he had access to medication. I will not say I am 100% sold that this was a murder, but clearly the result of months of mental abuse.

Stalking is a terrible crime because it is tough to find something to arrest these guys(girls) for. I had a friend who was a stalking victim and the police couldn't do much to help, eventually the guy moved on to new victims, he is now on his 5th or 6th victim (all have had restraining orders against him) but the guy has only had minor charges against him in the past 6 years.

Let's work together to get some justice for this family.

 

[MayraMM]

Interesting tidbit of info I came across while researching chronic carbon monoxide poisoning: "A more unusual carbon monoxide poisoning symptom is an unexplained sense of a presence or something is watching. Many ghost houses have been found to have carbon monoxide leaks - usually from cracks/partial blockages in old chimneys and faulty boilers."

Not saying this is relevant, but it sure is interesting.

 

[Herding Cats]

Mom keeps referring to the time when the case was elevated to felony stalking, hinting at some specific event that caused that change in status. Either I read it as they were calling is misdemeanor stalking or I assumed that's what she meant.

I wish she'd tell us what the event was already!

LOL. Me too. I think the misdemeanor label means that no detective would be assigned, and several parts of what the family called evidence were not collected (e.g. the footprint(s), and so on).

Could the UCLA visit have been a second opinion or during a vacation visit? I remember Mom saying they had lived in that area of CO since the 70s. Also, believe they have an adult child living in CA.

I think it's the sister who lives out here, because the brother lives nearby.

I, too, recall that someone said they lived in the area since the 70's, but can't recall (without searching) if it was the parents, or a reply to the post.

It could have been a vacation, at that. I will have to go back and find out now. LOL.

SBM.

I hope you feel better soon, HC. Surely there are a few healers sprawling around.

Oh yes, I've got critter healers aplenty. Grace is hanging on the sofa with me, and Boogs is sitting next to me (on the other side, thank you very much).

I can't remember who said it, but I too think it would be highly unlikely that a paramed was counting pills. However, I also know that they have, in the past, done just that. It may have happened exactly as Mom says, but then I wonder how they'd know how many pills were missing. (And I know they do count meds, because I've seen them do it...with my father. OTOH, he wasn't dead in his bed, but being transported to the hospital, and it's a different state, so there may be different protocols).

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Herding Cats

 

[Herding Cats]

Ah, here is the quote about the 70's...

" We have actually been in Colorado off and on (mostly on) since the mid 70′s, and I love this place, even after this happened, because I know it’s not the place it’s the monster, and the atmosphere that allows the monster to exist."

http://morganingram.com/wordpress/?p=1020
Scroll down, it's in one of TIngram's replies from Sept. 5.

Still, there is room for her to have been living in Los Angeles area in 2003. Or, as was suggested upthread, it could have been on a vacation or longer term visit.

Best-
Herding Cats

 

[MayraMM]

The brother's FB page says he was educated on the streets of LA and now lives in Las Vegas. So part of the family at least spent significant time in Los Angeles. They could have been visiting there when the CO poisoning was diagnosed.

As for a pill count, that would only happen by the paramedics (usually the coroner's assistant would be out there doing it) if there was cause to believe there was an overdose, for instance vomit around the mouth, pill bottles on the nightstand, a note indicating pills were taken, or someone saying it might have been an overdose. In this case, tho, a pill count would be invalid since the prescription was so old. Logically, ALL the pills should have been used already, so unless someone had a count before M was found (and why would anyone count pills in an old bottle of meds?), there'd be no way to even begin to guess how many pills should have been in the bottle.

 

[Lera213]

http://www.denverpost.com/ci_21450983?source=bb

 

[Lera213]

HC you are not allowed to feel ill, got that! *hugs*

 

[gitana1]

I am new to this case so forgive me for being ignorant. I just started reading this thread and the parent's blog. Being a lawyer, I operate on logic and look for evidence. Certain things are very apparent or follow patterns when it comes to crime. Others, not so much, so their needs to be some questioning.

Here are my questions, if anyone cares to ask:

1. If there was four months of constant stalking and footprints, why does the police say they found no evidence of stalking.

2. Was there ever any evidence that the motion detectors went off? (I;m only up to the 14th day on the blog).

3. If there was constant stalking, why only one possible photo of the stalker?

4. How do they believe the stalker killed Morgan? I'm getting the sense that they believe he snuck in and drugged something of hers, causing her to OD, after determining that she used to take the medication and thus framing her for suicide. Am I right?

If so, this would fit no known profile or MO of murdering stalkers that I have ever heard of. Stalkers kill in three ways - one, in a sudden rage after a first or final advance is declined; two, in a building rage after their multiple advances are rejected, or; three, in a thrill kill type scenario.

In virtually every case of stalking murders, the murder is up close and personal and involves bloody violence. These are not people who just want to see their victims quietly die. Instead, they want to possess the victim and/or cause them great fear and/or pain. Which brings me to question 5:

5. How does the family or others square Morgan's death with a stalker scenario?

I am very familiar with stalking. I was stalked myself for 8 years. Several of my clients are or have been talked including one I just got a restraining order for today. I feel like I am missing something here. Can anyone fill me in?

I read the last page I think. I agree this girl showed no evidence at all of being a drug user. But has anyone discussed possible hysteria? I don't want to downplay the seriousness of the allegations, especially since a beautiful girl with everything to live for, suddenly turned up dead, for no reason at all. But it is a question.

Or, is it possible that this girl became fed up with living in fear as a result of a real stalker?

6. If not the stalker, who is in the photo they believe is the stalker and where was it taken and why would a person be in that location at the time it was taken?

Again, my apologies for being so ill informed and hopefully my ignorance will not lead to anyone becoming offended. This young lady should not have died and what the police have to say about what happened hear seems lacking. There are holes either way.