Coronavirus - Global Health Emergency, 2019-nCoV #3

[What if...]

The 2008 recession happened for much different reasons - mostly from subprime loans and fraud in the banking and finance sectors.

Markets outside of China are still strong. The US market demand is still strong - people have some money and need to buy things. If China can't provide products, we can make them here in the US. We have our own raw materials and agricultural base.

ITA! I’ll also add (MOO), that the longer this thing drags on, and assuming that the virus remains relatively contained to China, this whole event will likely drive up markets elsewhere in the world. All markets will probably take some short term hits, largely due to decreased imports to China and manufacturing supply issues due to factories that are now closed in China. But in the long run, China will have to be focused on cleaning up the aftermath of this breakout (assuming they regain control of it), and they more than likely will struggle for years with PR issues which will require at least some level of proof that measures have been put in place that will greatly reduce the chances of a repeat.
More than likely, there are conversations in boardrooms around the globe that are taking place right now regarding options to either move (and/or) diversify their manufacturing plants in an effort to avoid another situation like this one. Any such moves will result in a net gain for any country on the receiving end of said changes.

China has a long history of providing cheap labor, and, unfortunately, you often get what you pay for.
In this particular case, the costs for the cheap labor aren’t specific to the quality of the products being produced, but rather the hidden costs that come into play with the non tangible philosophies and policies of various governments that are willing to put human rights, as well as the whole of humanity, towards the bottom of their priority lists.
I truly feel for the people of China, but I can’t say I have much sympathy for their ruling government. When it comes to the topic of viral outbreaks that have the potential for a devastating global pandemic - they have been PLAYING WITH FIRE for years.
Apologies for the rant, but I personally find this whole situation very (inset a wide variety of obscenities here!!)
The most disturbing part of this whole thing, at least in my opinion, is that it has never been a question as to whether or not a catastrophic event such as this one (or worse) would emerge from this corner of the world - the real question has always been “when?”
So, sorry, but not sorry!

 

[dixiegirl1035]

A gentleman on youtube said
that his WeChat comments
asking for prayers for Dr. Li Wehliang had been scrubbed, as well.


***
CHINA
WHERE IS CHEN QIUSHI?

I finally looked up what wiebo is... analagous to twitter here in US it looks like, and WeChat is like our group texts or private messaging through Facebook in the US.

 

[Amonet]

I think it's extreme to ban a financial group from posting on Twitter due to one article about someone others find not that respectable. It sounds more like something I'd expect to see out of China. I'm increasingly concerned at the constant attempt online to limit opinions and treating the population as too stupid to think for themselves so they need to limit their access to other opinions or ideas. MOO

Zero Hedge isn't simply a financial group. They spread a lot of Alex Jones type conspiracy stuff.

 

[gitana1]

From the last thread:

“Dylan Boles on Twitter
Chinese authorities are also spraying what appears to be a disinfectant in cities across central China.”

It is insane watching all this disinfectant being sprayed in these videos! (I’m not stating an opinion on the use of disinfectant, just saying they are spraying a lot of “what appears to be a disinfectant”. ) They’re using what appears to be similar apparatus to what we see used by exterminators when they spray for bugs, moo.

Reminds me of accounts of epidemics during past centuries. How they’d spray the streets with lime? carbolic acid, etc.

 

[Amonet]

JMO, the undercurrent of this discussion is the impact on business in China. Their leaders are more interested in protecting profits over public safety. There's likely very heavy pressure on the leaders of all developed nations to protect business interests.

It's not that simple though, is it? We all rely on those businesses for jobs and products that we need. The economy is about more than profits.

 

[Ruthbullock]

Reminds me of accounts of epidemics during past centuries. How they’d spray the streets with lime? carbolic acid, etc.

You surely can’t find fault with doing that, effective or not- surely that is trying to do what’s practical.

 

[gitana1]

Oh I believe he was being a good citizen while on his deathbed. After all, wife, child and baby on the way...

“A new coronavirus infection has been confirmed and its type is being identified. Inform all family and relatives to be on guard,” Li Wenliang typed into a chat group with his former medical school classmates on Dec. 30, according to Caixin, a Beijing-based media group. Soon, Li’s message would resonate much farther. As the spiraling crisis emerged, he came to be known as the whistleblower of a virus that ultimately took his life....

...And yet Li was not dissuaded. He shared his ordeal online and carried out interviews with journalists through text message, conveying a picture of incompetence and mishandling of the virus at the crucial, initial stage of the outbreak. His insistence on speaking out defied a political system that does not tolerate dissent.“

...One doctor in Li’s chat group said they had always known him to have good judgment, according to one local media outlet. Many started stocking up on surgical masks and wearing other protective gear at work because of his warning. “


Doctor Who Sounded Early Alarm on Coronavirus Dies at 34

So if not for him many medical professionals would’ve been unwittingly exposed?

 

[gitana1]

You surely can’t find fault with doing that, effective or not- surely that is trying to do what’s practical.

What?

 

[AStartoSteerBy]

Post by MJPeony from the last thread:

“A couple of articles were posted upthread about some studies showing Asian males are much more likely to get this CV. I really feel like there must be some truth in this. Otherwise I feel we’d be seeing far higher numbers at this point in non-Asian countries. MOO.”

Somehow I’ve missed these articles. Can @MJPeony, or someone else, please provide a link? Tia.

___________________________________________________________________

Men may be more prone to coronavirus than women, Chinese study finds

www.scmp.com/news/china/society/article/3048295/men-may-be-more-prone-coronavirus-women-chinese-study-finds

Men appear to be more susceptible than women to the
new coronavirus that emerged in central China
last month, according to a study of 99 patients treated in Wuhan, where the outbreak began.
The study – published in The Lancet on Wednesday – was carried out by a team of doctors at Wuhan’s Jinyintan Hospital, which has handled a number of coronavirus patients, along with researchers from Shanghai Jiao Tong University and Ruijin Hospital in Shanghai.

The finding was in line with earlier observations that men with underlying health problems were more prone to the virus, but the latest study was based on a bigger sample size.

This is from on/about January 30, 2020

 

[gitana1]

I have always wanted to visit The Great Wall of China but after watching all this unfold it really puts me off ever visiting. It’s not just the illness which they will recover from but the lack of human rights and how they are treated. Then throw in their weird exotic love of eating wild animals ( imo) that makes me feel ill even thinking about. I now think my money can be better spent elsewhere.


IMO

100%.

 

[Medstudies]

So if not for him many medical professionals would’ve been unwittingly exposed?

You bet! Isn’t that a scary thought?! He saved so many lives, and got arrested for it.

 

[Amonet]

So 5 Brits caught it from 1 Brit visiting Singapore and yet Singapore only has 33 officially diagnosed...what are the chances he/she just happened to interact with one of those 33 people? I'm going to go with wildly under diagnosed over there right now.

I was concerned about that, too. I'm a bit relieved in one way that the Briton acquired it at a conference in Singapore that was attended by at least one person who was infected, and that's how he got infected. Not just walking around and sightseeing, but they have traced how he got infected. I think I read there were three people so far from the conference who've been confirmed in Singapore as being infected? Not 100% sure, and if various people at the conference have since returned to their home countries I doubt they've all been tested yet either.

On the other hand, it seems that the Briton who went to that conference went skiing in France before returning to the UK, and while there he passed the virus onto at leave five people at the skiing resort!

Then there's that cruise ship docked off Yokohama where there seems to have been a single index case and there are currently 61 confirmed infections on the ship from that single case!

I just don't see how this genie can be stuffed back in its bottle any more than with yearly flu epidemics?

 

[dotr]

Coronavirus: British nine-year-old in hospital in France
''A British man with the virus is said to be feeling well and in good spirits after being transferred from the cruise ship Diamond Princess to hospital in Japan.

Alan Steele, of Wolverhampton, who was on honeymoon on the ship, was moved to hospital on Friday while his wife, Wendy Marshall Steele, remained onboard. She had been in telephone contact with her husband and said on Saturday that he was still feeling healthy.

“Alan is well, Japanese doctors are excellent,” she posted on Facebook. “He is in a little room. Just doctor and nurse visit him.” She said she was also doing well but had “cabin fever” as she continued to be confined to her room on the ship.

There are nearly 3,700 other passengers and crew being quarantined on the ship. They have been offered access to mental health counselling and enhanced internet access.

In a video posted on Twitter, Rai Caluori, the executive vice-president at Princess Cruises, said: “We recognise that a situation like this can create unprecedented stress, so we’re also offering our guests and crew specialised telephonic mental health counselling if they should be experiencing such stress and mental health issues.”

 

[Amonet]

Sorry typos lol.

Seriously, this has me wondering all kinds of things now.

So, does this mean if someone gives off an “aerosol virus-laden plume” in the stall next to you, you can breathe it in? I’m not sure this refers strictly to surface contamination or touching it?

Given the height of the toilet compared to the walls of the stall, I would say that the walls would contain the 'plume'.

But if you take a young child into the stall with you, then even if they don't 'go', get their hands washed afterwards in case they were wiping their hands over the stall walls? And that's something that would be prudent to be aware of if someone in the house comes down with it, that the toilet and washbasin need disinfecting, and the walls and floors too if there are little ones in the house who put their little hands *everywhere*. Personally I don't go around touching my walls so I'm not that concerned about that method of germ transfer in my own home.

 

[gitana1]

I really wish my school would stop the study abroad trips for now. We are sending dozens of people to Philippines and Indonesia soon who will come right back to our classrooms and offices.

ETA that sounds so selfish but I’m just really worried about it. People here think it’s a joke.

I think this epidemic is going to cause worldwide economic catastrophe if Asia becomes increasingly more isolated.

I remember it seemed like just a couple days with no to few flights at the time of 9/11 caused a ripple in the airline industry financially that became like a domino effect. At least to my untrained eye.

I realized then how easily a major event can impact the economy worldwide.

The one good thing is we have the internet and computers, Skype, whatever, now. Which makes it easier to conduct business without flying somewhere. But what about tourism? Isn’t that major in some of these countries?

 

[gitana1]

I agree. And I am wondering why our federal government seems to be so cavalier about the situation. The government did not stop flights to or from China, private industry made that decision.

Is the low key attitude towards Coronavirus due to the fact that they don't want people to panic? In reality, are they behind the scenes trying to figure out what to do if people in the United States start getting sick?

I am not worried. What happens will happen, I can't control it. That being said, I am not traveling anywhere.

The netflix series pandemic is so apropos right now. There’s a female epidemiologist who is featured on there who specializes in responding to and preparing for epidemics, pandemics. I bet she’s super busy right now.

 

[JerseyGirl]

Citizen Journalist Covering Virus Outbreak From Wuhan Goes Missing

China’s internet watchdog has stepped up its policing efforts, announcing on Wednesday it would conduct “targeted supervision” on the largest social media platforms including Weibo, Tencent’s WeChat and ByteDance’s Douyin. The regulator has already frozen a raft of social media accounts, then stepped up online scrubbing to quiet a wave of confused outrage over the death of the doctor that first raised red flags about the disease.

 

[gitana1]

JMO, the undercurrent of this discussion is the impact on business in China. Their leaders are more interested in protecting profits over public safety. There's likely very heavy pressure on the leaders of all developed nations to protect business interests.

And it’s crazy because by not taking it seriously and addressing it quickly and allowing medical professionals to be protected and on alert (instead of unwittingly exposed and/or exposing), this could've been controlled more. Now based on their response to this no one wants anything remotely to do with anything chinese.

Absolute stupidity. Their game playing and cover ups and silencing have snowballed this thing.

 

[Betty P]

More than likely, there are conversations in boardrooms around the globe that are taking place right now regarding options to either move (and/or) diversify their manufacturing plants in an effort to avoid another situation like this one.

Agree. No one could foresee this disaster happening, right? Post WWII businesses and govt. understood these hazards pretty well. China isn't the only trade partner with these vulnerabilities. I do feel sorry for the citizens of China, it must be getting pretty terrible over there. I hope they get this epidemic under control soon.

 

[dixiegirl1035]

Citizen Journalist Covering Virus Outbreak From Wuhan Goes Missing

China’s internet watchdog has stepped up its policing efforts, announcing on Wednesday it would conduct “targeted supervision” on the largest social media platforms including Weibo, Tencent’s WeChat and ByteDance’s Douyin. The regulator has already frozen a raft of social media accounts, then stepped up online scrubbing to quiet a wave of confused outrage over the death of the doctor that first raised red flags about the disease.

Yes, I couldn't remember the foreign names that the WHO head spoke of working with those companies to help squash rumors and misinformation etc to do such today. He said that WHO is supporting such iirc, did others hear that also?