DC - Savvas Savopoulos, family & Veralicia Figueroa murdered; Daron Wint Arrested #16

[BondGirl]

IMO interviews with JW, DW and their friends and families have been conducted by LE. IF (and IMO it's a stretch) they were ever neighbors, friends or ever met is known to LE.
IMO there is no connection at all.

NT's blog quoted LE source who stated LE "was aware of a connection between DW and JW".

 

[oceanblueeyes]

<modsnip>

So, assuming your knowledge is correct that DW acted totally alone. Only DW was involved in the planning and execution of this crime. In terms of JW, just another victim who for some reason got flustered and lied about his actions, what happens to him if he is a witness? Does he have to do anything else? Does LE say, looks like all of your stories check out, so feel free to leave the country for a while? Do they ask him to stay put? Do they clear him publicly, even though they are under no obligation to? Do they protect him because they fear some of DW's friends who aren't in jail might want to make sure JW doesn't give any info on the events of that day?

Who takes care of JW after LE basically ruined his foreseeable future?

What happens to him?


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People have a way of forgetting things over time and in due time I think JW will go on with his life. It may be harder for him to gain employment because everyone who has kept up with this case knows he lied to the police at first.

The DT will no doubt bring up his lies hoping to destroy his credibility. While that may happen usually the DA has evidence in hand that a particular witness wasn't involved in the crime and that is what will matter to the jury in the end. Who knows, he may come across as likable and may be a credible witness. I have even seen eye witnesses testify at trial who had a violent rap sheet a mile long yet the jury believed what they testified to in court because it was supported by the evidence entered.

Until and if he is arrested for anything the DA has no control over where he goes even if its overseas. Right now, he is free to go anywhere he pleases like any other citizen.

I don't think anyone will ever consider him a victim. He brought all the negative feelings about him from his own lies. He has no one to blame but himself if his life is turned upside down now. So he will be on his own and if his life is repaired from the damage he has done he will have to be the one who repairs it. First, he needs to stop telling outlandish tall lies.

I don't think they have him in witness protection but may have told him to move to another location from where he lived when they were first murdered. I am sure LE has given him numbers he an call if any threats are made against him in some manner.

IMO

 

[TexMex]

NT's blog quoted LE source who stated LE "was aware of a connection between DW and JW".

IIRC it was a WS poster who alerted LE of the research of the addresses done here. Must not have been damaging info based on JW not being arrested or charged IMO

 

[BondGirl]

IIRC it was a WS poster who alerted LE of the research of the addresses done here. Must not have been damaging info based on JW not being arrested or charged IMO

Yes, but we do not know that the "connection" LE was aware of had to do with the addresses.

 

[CoreyRocks]

You raise a very good point. I remember reading that someone said JW wasn't really fired and left because he wasn't getting enough hours. That may well have been what he told SS. He may have asked for something to help him through until he obtained other employment. If JW was fired, he could collect unemployment and also earn money part-time as long as it didn't affect his unemployment. If SS paid him "off the books" that would be even better.

JMO[/QUOTE


IMHO and I do not claim to have known them, but in all the things written about AS and SS is that the they were long time philanthropists.

As mentioned in this article :

Savvas and Amy Savopoulos actively participated in establishing American Institute of Welding, an*organization*offering a fresh start to people who have lost their jobs. The Greek-American philanthropist was always trying to help others and his charity work was mostly concentrated in Greece and the United States. - See more at: http://usa.greekreporter.com/2015/05/25/savvas-savopoulos-from-greece-to-d-c/#.dpuf

For instance ....they started the welding school to help those who did not have a.job learn a trade and get employment.

SS was above board and would not pay someone illegally which is what "off the books" means.

Respectfully my opinion.

 

[kammiemc]

People have a way of forgetting things over time and in due time I think JW will go on with his life. It may be harder for him to gain employment because everyone who has kept up with this case knows he lied to the police at first.

The DT will no doubt bring up his lies hoping to destroy his credibility. While that may happen usually the DA has evidence in hand that a particular witness wasn't involved in the crime and that is what will matter to the jury in the end. Who knows, he may come across as likable and may be a credible witness. I have even seen eye witnesses testify at trial who had a violent rap sheet a mile long yet the jury believed what they testified to in court because it was supported by the evidence entered.

Until and if he is arrested for anything the DA has no control over where he goes even if its overseas. Right now, he is free to go anywhere he pleases like any other citizen.

I don't think anyone will ever consider him a victim. He brought all the negative feelings about him from his own lies. He has no one to blame but himself if his life is turned upside down now. So he will be on his own and if his life is repaired from the damage he has done he will have to be the one who repairs it. First, he needs to stop telling outlandish tall lies.

I don't think they have him in witness protection but may have told him to move to another location from where he lived when they were first murdered. I am sure LE has given him numbers he an call if any threats are made against him in some manner.

IMO

Great info. Thanks!
Also, I agree that JW created his own negative situation. I personally don't have much empathy for his situation, but I would think there would be some sort of professional code of conduct by which LE would make public statement that would help remove him from public scrutiny if he is no longer under their scrutiny. Or I would at least think JW would want to make it known that he is not under investigation. Would he be allowed to do that?

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[1&2&3]

I do believe that JW had exaggerated his accomplishments for many years. At some point, he realized he was not going to be the successful man he had hoped to be, therefore, he started adding extras to his life not realizing everything can be checked.

Unfortunately, there are too many young people with successful parents who do not have the incentive to get the training necessary to succeed in life. There are many causes for this so I won't even start on this subject!

What may have caused JW to be like this? From reading here, there doesn't seem to be a clear path of his school days up to this point in time. The exception being his time with auto-bahn. What has he done for the other years? Could it be possible he has a juvenile record that was expunged when he turned 21? I am not trying to cast a shadow on him, just curious what his high school days and afterwards were like.

My opinions only.

 

[AmazonianAbroad]

You raise a very good point. I remember reading that someone said JW wasn't really fired and left because he wasn't getting enough hours. That may well have been what he told SS. He may have asked for something to help him through until he obtained other employment. If JW was fired, he could collect unemployment and also earn money part-time as long as it didn't affect his unemployment. If SS paid him "off the books" that would be even better.

JMO[/QUOTE


IMHO and I do not claim to have known them, but in all the things written about AS and SS is that the they were long time philanthropists.

As mentioned in this article :

Savvas and Amy Savopoulos actively participated in establishing American Institute of Welding, an*organization*offering a fresh start to people who have lost their jobs. The Greek-American philanthropist was always trying to help others and his charity work was mostly concentrated in Greece and the United States. - See more at: http://usa.greekreporter.com/2015/05/25/savvas-savopoulos-from-greece-to-d-c/#.dpuf

For instance ....they started the welding school to help those who did not have a.job learn a trade and get employment.

SS was above board and would not pay someone illegally which is what "off the books" means.

Respectfully my opinion.

It is not illegal to pay household workers cash off the books when they are occasional employees of limited earnings. Since JW appears to have only worked two days a week, and this was possibly short term and unskilled labor, he likely would have qualified. It isn't unlawful to have neighborhood kids spring clean your garage, etc..

 

[al66pine]

"What happens to him if he is a witness"
What happens to any man interviewed, by LE, who gives different versions on 3 points; who, when confronted w forensic evd, changes his story on one point; who admits to LE he lied?
If/when DDW is tried, JW gets on stand, testifies, is subject to direct & cross exam, and is exposed as having given diff versions on 3 points and having lied to LE about events of that day. The jury is instructed about the weight to give his testimony.

"Who takes care of JW after LE basically ruined his foreseeable future"
Is his foreseeable future ruined? By LE? How? Did LE disclosure to public thru affidavits, etc. of JW's lies ruin it? In the course of investigating deaths, LE interviews ppl, collects & analyzes evd, etc. Crim chg's are brought. Can LE keep its investigation findings secret and say to judge - We can't give you any details, like what JW told us about the money drop but we think DDW killed Mr S. Do you mind waiting until trial? IDTS. Some info is released pre-trial.

Not like some whacko LEO decided: 'I don't like JW's looks, so let's issue a media release and let the world know he lied.'
Did LE commit illegal acts in interviewing or investigating him? IDK and have no reason to think so, and I hope not.

JW's claims about his vehicle racing - info he made public on his SM and has bn subject to public scrutiny since posting. If unexpected sleuthers put it under the magnifying glass and found discrepancies, exaggerations, or outright lies (<---IDK which) imo, any blame lies at JW's feet, not LE's. Some folks here said - JW fudged a bit on some racing results, so what? If ppl care about that, meaning care either about accurate standings or JW's lack of inattn(?) to accurate detail re standings, then okay; if ppl don't care, then okay. Is it relevant to his testimony? IDK. Is it relevant to other ppl's future dealings w him, well, that's up to them, isn't it?

Should LE offer protective custody for him? IDK.

A cold, cruel world for a 26 y/o man? Maybe so.
I'd like to think he's in no way involved beyond innocent courier duty. I hope he can get some traction (pun intended) w his career and life paths, whatever they may be.

...So, assuming your knowledge is correct that DW acted totally alone. Only DW was involved in the planning and execution of this crime. In terms of JW, just another victim who for some reason got flustered and lied about his actions, what happens to him if he is a witness? Does he have to do anything else? Does LE say, looks like all of your stories check out, so feel free to leave the country for a while? Do they ask him to stay put? Do they clear him publicly, even though they are under no obligation to? Do they protect him because they fear some of DW's friends who aren't in jail might want to make sure JW doesn't give any info on the events of that day. Who takes care of JW after LE basically ruined his foreseeable future? What happens to him? ...

 

[al66pine]

If there are others involved and in custody, wouldn't LE want to put the public at ease by announcing they have more killers or all of them in custody? They could do that without naming names.
Or make the announcement they now know DW acted alone and people don't have to worry that there are more animals roaming free that were related to this specific murder.
Anything either way. As far as I know, LE hasn't said anything recently that they're actively searching for others involved for this.

bbm

Devil's advocate here -
Just because LE arrested and detained some animals as responsible for these deaths, does that mean there are no other animals roaming free and capable of doing the same?
Maybe it would comfort some local residents to know of the arrests. Should they be so comforted as to backslide to not locking doors & windows, not using alarm systems, etc? IOW would LE want to give impression of no or low danger?

Is there any time and place where there are no 'animals roaming free'? Doubt it.

IDK what the best approach for LE is - making announcements or radio silence.

 

[FelicityLemon]

It is not illegal to pay household workers cash off the books when they are occasional employees of limited earnings. Since JW appears to have only worked two days a week, and this was possibly short term and unskilled labor, he likely would have qualified. It isn't unlawful to have neighborhood kids spring clean your garage, etc..

bbm

Yikes, please, do you have a link to support that legal advice? I'm pretty sure it is illegal to pay someone "off the books" hence the description. It's been many years, but I worked for a CPA and this was an issue back in the mid '80s, and I'd bet it's the same today.

There are laws regarding taxes to be paid. Under $1,900 per year, it can be considered a contract worker vs employee and paid via 1099, but taxes are to be paid on that and the recipient is responsible for the employers' portion of taxes.

People do it all the time (not report income or paying someone cash) but that doesn't make it legal.

 

[FelicityLemon]

bbm

Devil's advocate here -
Just because LE arrested and detained some animals as responsible for these deaths, does that mean there are no other animals roaming free and capable of doing the same?
Maybe it would comfort some local residents to know of the arrests. Should they be so comforted as to backslide to not locking doors & windows, not using alarm systems, etc? IOW would LE want to give impression of no or low danger?
Is there any time and place where there are no 'animals roaming free'? Doubt it.
IDK what the best approach for LE is - making announcements or radio silence.

I know what you're saying and agree, but I was speaking specifically of this crime, that's why I added the qualifier.

But, people really do want to know if anybody involved in this crime exist, are they in custody, is the public safe from these people?

People always want to know the bad guys get caught. Nobody relaxes completely after something like this even if everybody gets caught or killed because we know it can happen again. There are no isolated crimes. If it happens once, it will happen again.

Curiosity, satisfaction that the bad guys are taken care of, one less evil piece of crap off the streets.

Example: I lived in Newport Beach and worked in Huntington Beach during Ted Bundy and was alert, but more than that, what terrified me especially was the Night Stalker. He hit above and below us on the coast. I never would have been a victim of Bundy, but anybody in a huge area could have been a victim of the NS because of the nature of his crimes and there was no pattern.

After TB and RR was caught, people were immensely relieved and relaxed a bit, but many never reverted to life before these monsters. Heightened awareness and security for sure.

DW is in custody, but until we learn either way, people want to know.

 

[kammiemc]

"What happens to him if he is a witness"
What happens to any man interviewed, by LE, who gives different versions on 3 points; who, when confronted w forensic evd, changes his story on one point; who admits to LE he lied?
If/when DDW is tried, JW gets on stand, testifies, is subject to direct & cross exam, and is exposed as having given diff versions on 3 points and having lied to LE about events of that day. The jury is instructed about the weight to give his testimony.

"Who takes care of JW after LE basically ruined his foreseeable future"
Is his foreseeable future ruined? By LE? How? Did LE disclosure to public thru affidavits, etc. of JW's lies ruin it? In the course of investigating deaths, LE interviews ppl, collects & analyzes evd, etc. Crim chg's are brought. Can LE keep its investigation findings secret and say to judge - We can't give you any details, like what JW told us about the money drop but we think DDW killed Mr S. Do you mind waiting until trial? IDTS. Some info is released pre-trial.

Not like some whacko LEO decided: 'I don't like JW's looks, so let's issue a media release and let the world know he lied.'
Did LE commit illegal acts in interviewing or investigating him? IDK and have no reason to think so, and I hope not.

JW's claims about his vehicle racing - info he made public on his SM and has bn subject to public scrutiny since posting. If unexpected sleuthers put it under the magnifying glass and found discrepancies, exaggerations, or outright lies (<---IDK which) imo, any blame lies at JW's feet, not LE's. Some folks here said - JW fudged a bit on some racing results, so what? If ppl care about that, meaning care either about accurate standings or JW's lack of inattn(?) to accurate detail re standings, then okay; if ppl don't care, then okay. Is it relevant to his testimony? IDK. Is it relevant to other ppl's future dealings w him, well, that's up to them, isn't it?

Should LE offer protective custody for him? IDK.

A cold, cruel world for a 26 y/o man? Maybe so.
I'd like to think he's in no way involved beyond innocent courier duty. I hope he can get some traction (pun intended) w his career and life paths, whatever they may be.

Sorry, yes I totally agree that he has ruined his own foreseeable by his own actions. I don't have a lot of empathy for his position. But, if he is fact totally innocent (some people seem VERY sure that it is a fact that he is not involved on any level due to the absence of addl arrests 7 weeks out and Occam's razor) LE could with one statement clear up suspicion around him and say that they had been barking up the wrong tree, especially if he is going to be a witness for the prosecution.

I am not saying it SHOULD work that way. But I would think from an ethical standpoint they might feel compelled to.


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[DeDee]

You raise a very good point. I remember reading that someone said JW wasn't really fired and left because he wasn't getting enough hours. That may well have been what he told SS. He may have asked for something to help him through until he obtained other employment. If JW was fired, he could collect unemployment and also earn money part-time as long as it didn't affect his unemployment. If SS paid him "off the books" that would be even better.

JMO

Hold on there a minute, missy. Not many people can collect unemployment benefits if they are fired from their job. Each state is different on the rules. Unemployment benefits are not automatically distributed. For the most part, a fired employee must present a valid reason why the termination was not due to any fault of his own. The state's unemployment agency determines the qualification decision.

 

[MyBelle]

BBM

I think you are taking the Prosecutor's statement out of context. Iirc, the word used was 'believe' which changes the entire meaning or some other subjective word usage. I am sure at the time they were working under the assumption he did have help. They have had time to rule that in or out by now.

I haven't seen any documents where the Prosecutor makes any affirmative statement confirming Wint absolutely had help. The word usage of 'believe' is nothing more than "I think" (theory-at the time) and isn't factually based.

And what high intelligence would he need to do this crime? I see nothing that shows me he had to be a brilliant individual to pull this off all by himself. Although I don't think he is dumb either.

It doesn't take much brain power to force entry into a home and grab one of the startled/frightened females who were in the home with a 10 year old boy. They would all comply trying to save each other. Tragically, it has happened before several times with only one lone perpetrator involved.

When Savvas arrived home he would do nothing to provoke the man who held his family, and housekeeper hostage. That is why pizza was ordered at 9:30pm when they were trying to keep him calm giving him anything he wanted.

What intelligence would be needed for Wint to direct a very intelligent man, who certainly knew about financial matters.. to do all of his dirty work for him seeing to it the 40K was delivered as DW demanded?

Once he murdered them all, he took his blood money, he set the fire, and walked out. I don't see a very complex plan that would even require a highly intelligent mastermind. DW knew Savvas was wealthy already before going in to his home.

There is absolutely no reason why LE wouldn't announce they have made further arrests if they have done so. They weren't shy about telling everyone in short order they had arrested Wint. They would do the same if there were other arrests. Imo, they haven't arrested anyone other than Wint in connection to this specific crime. I have no doubt the media continues to call LE everyday looking for any updates if they exist. They would want the area citizens to know they are continuing to arrests others involved in this case.

The thing about prior SWs and continued ongoing investigations they are constantly evolving and what LE may have suspected or believed or thought at first is not where the investigation has taken them now. I think they have thoroughly investigated this case for almost 8 weeks, and found no involvement of others other than Wint.

I still say, while I think JW is an arrogant lying braggart blowhard, and was a terrible employee.... he will not be involved in the murder of this family.

IMO

I didn't take the prosecutor's statement out of context nor do I believe the Judge did. JW may not be involved in this murder but what does that have to do with the charging document for Wint? NOTHING. The prosecutor stated the basis for his belief. He obviously hasn't changed his mind because NOBODY has been charged with the other felony crimes involved in this case.

JMO

 

[MyBelle]

Hold on there a minute, missy. Not many people can collect unemployment benefits if they are fired from their job. Each state is different on the rules. Unemployment benefits are not automatically distributed. For the most part, a fired employee must present a valid reason why the termination was not due to any fault of his own. The state's unemployment agency determines the qualification decision.

No need to be condescending. JW was employed in Maryland, a state that does provide unemployment to employees fired for no reason at all and so far, we have not been given a reason for JW's termination.

In Maryland, employees work "at the will" of their employers. This means, in the absence of an express contract, agreement or policy to the contrary, an employee may be hired or fired for almost any reason -- whether fair or not -- or for no reason at all.

http://www.dllr.state.md.us/labor/wagepay/wpatwill.shtml

 

[FelicityLemon]

http://www.dllr.state.md.us/employment/unemployment.shtml

"Unemployment insurance provides benefits to persons who are unemployed through no fault of their own and who are ready, willing and able to work, and actively seeking work."

We don't know if he was fired, and if so, the reason for it.

 

[MyBelle]

RSBM

Basing on the assumption all is true that JW was not involved with the crime, the reason why I added protective custody is because JW would be a witness for the prosecution. The horrific actions committed in this crime would scare the daylights out of a person, and LE could fear JW may become nervous/dicey over testifying. Mr SS had several phone conversations during the hostage period and those conversation are surely being dissected. We have limited knowledge at this time, however as an example Mr SS could have used the word "we" instead of "I" in conversations, or something of that affect to pass on a clue. We just don't know at this time.

DW may very well be in jail, but how many partners in crime does DW know that are not in jail? Eliminating a witness that could testify he delivery 40k to the SS home would not be positive for the prosecution.

Thank you for your thoughts. We keep each other on our toes.

I seriously doubt the Justice Dept. is going to place into protective custody any witness who has admitted he lied to police. JW has a credibility problem with police and he'll have one with a jury. That's his problem.

JMO

 

[MyBelle]

People have a way of forgetting things over time and in due time I think JW will go on with his life. It may be harder for him to gain employment because everyone who has kept up with this case knows he lied to the police at first.

The DT will no doubt bring up his lies hoping to destroy his credibility. While that may happen usually the DA has evidence in hand that a particular witness wasn't involved in the crime and that is what will matter to the jury in the end. Who knows, he may come across as likable and may be a credible witness. I have even seen eye witnesses testify at trial who had a violent rap sheet a mile long yet the jury believed what they testified to in court because it was supported by the evidence entered.

Until and if he is arrested for anything the DA has no control over where he goes even if its overseas. Right now, he is free to go anywhere he pleases like any other citizen.

I don't think anyone will ever consider him a victim. He brought all the negative feelings about him from his own lies. He has no one to blame but himself if his life is turned upside down now. So he will be on his own and if his life is repaired from the damage he has done he will have to be the one who repairs it. First, he needs to stop telling outlandish tall lies.

I don't think they have him in witness protection but may have told him to move to another location from where he lived when they were first murdered. I am sure LE has given him numbers he an call if any threats are made against him in some manner.

IMO

Actually the U.S. Attorney can control J.W.'s travel by placing him on the no fly list. And if he inquires as to the reason, I'm sure they will helpfully point out that he has admitted he lied to law enforcement.

http://www.cnn.com/2015/04/15/travel/americans-no-fly-list-feat/

 

[rkf]

Isn't the house around 10k square feet? I definitely would consider a house that size a mansion. From the media's perspective, how many murders happen in houses bigger than this?

The property records say the SS house is 7828 sq. ft. If that's a mansion, then I live in a mansion (and I don't live in a mansion. I live in a 5-story townhouse). I think of a mansion as being the home on an estate. The S house is much bigger than the average DC home, but it's not even the biggest home in the neighborhood. This is their neighbor - I would consider this a mansion, but I don't know the square footage. https://www.facebook.com/pages/Aust...d-Avenue/461193620630887?sk=info&tab=overview