DC - Savvas Savopoulos, family & Veralicia Figueroa murdered; Daron Wint Arrested #19

[blessedlife]

I think it will still take 30 days to receive it. The instructions say you have to take the form into the court house. Wish there was a way to get a digital copy and pay online! If you find there is, please share the info!!! TIA!

I shall post tomorrow after I find the information on the transcript. I do think they email them but I'll find out. CANT WAIT!


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[TexMex]

OMG!!!! FABULOUS! Is that bacon-wrapped shrimp???? [emoji200]


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Yes ma'am

 

[Peliman]

First, let me say I don't know if JW is involved or guilty of any crime here. If LE thinks he's guilty, given JW's work relationship with SS, and the fact that the only people who could confirm or deny certain assertions by JW are dead, makes proving it much harder than someone who didn't spend time in the S home, drive their cars and "know their business". Information that is considered suspicious by LE (and some WSers) that can be explained away with an innocent explanation is not going to be very valuable to the prosecution. The defense only needs one juror to have reasonable doubt. If LE had JW's DNA on pizza crust, I think he would not only be an official "suspect" but he would be in jail. Anything other than that or JWs fingerprints on the murder weapon in the victims' blood, can be excused with a carefully crafted story by JW and attorneys. There isn't anyone alive who can support or refute JW's degree of access to the crime scenes.

Guilty or innocent, LE will have a hard time building a case against JW unless they have his participation on video somewhere. If that was the case, I think they would have arrested him.

How about his phone metadata? incoming and outgoing calls, txt, photos. Computer, memory sticks, seized car? I'm sure everythings been looked at in the lab for a connection. That's not saying something could come up in the future, there's always a place for the future.

 

[rkf]

Exactly. And I think LE is NOT still saying this, for all we know (until we get transcript) the article may have filled in with that quote from early in the investigation in order to mislead. It actually mischaracterizes the Lead Detective statement if those two parts weren't from the same statement at the prelim.

It could have been the words of a question from DT: "Detective Owens, isn't it true that JW was told that he had more information than he was initially giving?”

Det. would have answered a simple "yes or that's true" and the spin begins.

I swear, some of the fast and loose journalism these days is edging closer to the National Enquirer. Not that I'm accusing the wtonline of anything like this.

moo. moo. moo.

ITA. It's really been a little soul shattering for me to realize how inaccurate MSM reporting has become, never mind the deliberate bias. I don't usually get into the minutiae of a story like I have with this case, so I usually don't know what I don't know. I am embarrassed by how naively I just swallowed whole most of what I read from "reputable" news outlets. I don't want to become one of those kooks who are paranoid about everything and don't trust anyone, but I know I won't ever again be able to take what I read at face value. Kind of sad, really.

 

[atthelake]

Wow! That's OUTRAGEOUS!!!! A public document is $3.65 a page!!!! Almost criminal in itself.


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Even the Jodi Arias trials transcripts are not that expensive iirc.

And ullhair: I've not heard that those sidebars and other transcripts have been obtained by Beth Karas or others yet.

 

[atthelake]

I'd contribute! I wish we could know how many pages before buying it. If it wasn't too long, I'd do it all, but four hours might be an awful lot of pages yikes.

Does anyone recall how we funded MusikMan during the FCA trial to get and share with us... within TOS of course. I don't recall how we funded him.... hmmmmm

 

[TexMex]

Ago had Owens concede that police found the registration to Savvas Savopoulos' red Mozler, which Owens' said cost as much as $300,000, in the driver's car along with the driver's passport and checkbook.
Later Owens testified that the driver regularly ran errands for Savvas Savopoulos, including bringing cars in for inspections and other repairs.

http://www.courthousenews.com/2015/07/20/quadruple-murder-case-suspect-appears-in-court.htm

 

[rkf]

The detectives are not the ones that process the DNA results. The forensics labs are months behind and backed up with DNA requests. But the investigators themselves pore over the cell logs and computer info in-house.

I understand that. This is clearly a high priority case, as they turned the pizza DNA around lightening fast! They have one suspect in custody, but continue to assert that they believe he didn't work alone. If they think DNA information would help identify another violent perpetrator, I'd think processing the remaining evidence, including what may be one of the murder weapons, would still be high priority. I think the detective is doing what you said earlier - trying to give away as little information as possible.

When I was a kid, my sister and I would thumb through the hymnal at church and add "between the sheets" at the end of the hymn names. We thought it was such a riot!!! I feel like we could play a similar game with LE statements by adding "at this time" after everything they say.
JMO.

 

[atthelake]

I hope the prosecution does not have to rely upon JW as a major witness in this case. Because the defense is going to have a lot of ammo from the investigators publicly calling him a liar.

Katydid23, I know your dad was a defense atty, and you have a lot of leaning towards that... But but but............

WTF does it matter if he lied as to the case against Wint? I see this posted again and again... but I really do NOT understand how this impacts/gives an *out* as to Wint?

Can you expound please as you have the most knowledge here...yet I just am not *getting* how even if JW was involved (for a defense strategy) how that impacts giving a pass on Wint with Wint DNA on pizza, in house, on items etc.

What does that matter for the WINT case? I just don't follow this logic of the post as to my thought of *so what* it he lied. Wint was THERE, Wint had DNA in multiple places.. What does JW have to do with lessening this charge.

:thinking: :thinking: :thinking:

 

[Bootsctr]

Does anyone recall how we funded MusikMan during the FCA trial to get and share with us... within TOS of course. I don't recall how we funded him.... hmmmmm

That's interesting. I remember the MusikMan.

 

[katydid23]

Katydid23, I know your dad was a defense atty, and you have a lot of leaning towards that... But but but............

WTF does it matter it he lied as to the case against Wint? I see this posted again and again... but I really do NOT understand how this impacts/gives an *out* as to Wint?

Can you expound please as you have the most knowledge here...yet I just am not *getting* how even if JW was involved (for a defense strategy) how that impacts giving a pass on Wint with Wint DNA on pizza, in house, on items etc.

What does that matter for the WINT case? I just don't follow this logic of the post as to my thought of *so what* it he lied. Wint was THERE, Wint had DNA in multiple places.. What does JW have to do with lessening this charge.

:thinking: :thinking: :thinking:

good questions.

"WTF does it matter it he lied as to the case against Wint? .. but I really do NOT understand how this impacts/gives an *out* as to Wint?"

It matters if JW LIED to detectives because it impeaches the rest of his testimony. So if the state wants to rely upon JW as proof that the money was dropped off to DW, then his testimony can be seen as less credible if the defense can show he is a liar. And even lied to them that day in the interview.

"...*so what* it he lied. Wint was THERE, Wint had DNA in multiple places.. What does JW have to do with lessening this charge."

TRUE. Going after JW will not lessen the impact of the DNA etc. The only way they can do that is by attacking the forensics team, the lab, and possibly accusing someone of setting him up.

They may be putting JW in that position with these initial attempts.

 

[atthelake]

I am not sure I understand all of the suspicion and innuendo concerning JW's car being behind the police tape and him returning hours later.

I think LE has already corroborated his statement that he got a call from AIW about the house fire. If he had lied about that we would not be hearing him 'not' a suspect. So he drove quickly to the home and parked nearby just before the tapes went up.

I am pretty sure he stood around with others who were watching the tragedy unfold. At some point he had to see that his car was taped in. Where did he go? Wherever he went, he had to have explained it well because he was interrogated by detectives immediately upon his return. If he had been torching the Porsche or fencing stolen jewelry , imo, he would have been discovered. I think his whereabouts were able to be corroborated. JMO

I'm getting dizzy .. 180 degrees dizzy...


[video]https://www.google.com/search?q=youtube+i%27m+so+dizzy+my+head+is+spinnin g&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8[/video]

https://www.google.com/search?q=youtube+i%27m+so+dizzy+my+head+is+spinnin g&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8

 

[facundo]

Wonder what the defense plans to argue - "No, you did not drop off the $40,000."?

They can try to trip him up with questions and go round and round on his lies during the interview. They can't get into his resume padding or fact stretching on web sites as was done here. It would get an objection immediately. They may not be so convincing to the jury in totally discrediting his testimony.

 

[rkf]

That's not what just happened to us in the McStay case. The prelim hearing transcripts were sold for 200 bucks but were not allowed to be displayed on the net under penalty of law. Very frustrating.

If they tell you you can't share it online, make sure they show you where that rule is stated in writing.

 

[stmarysmead]

Yes ma'am

If we only lived closer and you invited me to dinner, I believe you could convince me of anything. 😍

 

[rkf]

How about his phone metadata? incoming and outgoing calls, txt, photos. Computer, memory sticks, seized car? I'm sure everythings been looked at in the lab for a connection. That's not saying something could come up in the future, there's always a place for the future.

Not that either of these guys is smart enough to pull it off, but assuming they had to talk via phone/text, a burner phone is $15 at AT&T and you can get a plan with unlimited text and calls for $2/day and you're only charged for the days you actually use it! What a deal! Even if the phones and records could be found, one or both would need to say something incriminating to prove JW was involved. Just knowing each other or even talking to each other, two fellow car enthusiasts, who may have had friends or family members who lived near one another at some point, wouldn't be enough to tie JW to the crime IMO. Not to the degree of legal certainty needed to convict. If the prosecutor doesn't think he can win a conviction, s/he's not going to trial.

 

[atthelake]

Here is what I find strange about the defense going so hard at JW. It seems very odd because what do they hope to accomplish?

They seem to be implying that JW was somehow involved. IF that is true, and he is a co-conspirator with DW, like some here believe, then HOW DOES THAT HELP DW'S CASE? If they shine the light on JW, doesnt that threaten DW even more? What if JW is forced to make a deal and then he tells all? JW is the ONE MAN that can put DW on death row.

So it leads me to believe he is a red herring.

http://missourieducationwatchdog.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/redherring.gif

 

[stmarysmead]

I got the impression from DW's PRIOR attorney that he might concede he was in the house. There was a statement to the effect that when we knew WHO was in the house and what was going on, we would view DW in a more favorable light. There was another statement to the effect that DW did not want to see the family hurt.

But at the hearing, it seemed as if DW was abandoning that tactic. Even he should know that they have nailed him as a perpetrator....he can style himself as the laid-back merciful perpetrator, or the perpetrator who was distracted and dining on pizza when things got violent...but they have nailed him to this horror.

And as I have posted before, if JW is squeaky clean, he is about the poorest choice DW can make as his alternative perp. JW will have been throughly investigated every which way.

Very, very strange.

 

[rkf]

good questions.

"WTF does it matter it he lied as to the case against Wint? .. but I really do NOT understand how this impacts/gives an *out* as to Wint?"

It matters if JW LIED to detectives because it impeaches the rest of his testimony. So if the state wants to rely upon JW as proof that the money was dropped off to DW, then his testimony can be seen as less credible if the defense can show he is a liar. And even lied to them that day in the interview.

"...*so what* it he lied. Wint was THERE, Wint had DNA in multiple places.. What does JW have to do with lessening this charge."

TRUE. Going after JW will not lessen the impact of the DNA etc. The only way they can do that is by attacking the forensics team, the lab, and possibly accusing someone of setting him up.

They may be putting JW in that position with these initial attempts.

But even if JW "set him up", DW was still at the crime scene, leaving his DNA (pizza, vest) and acquiring the DNA of the victims (bloody shoes). Is the defense going to say that JW, with his phone pinging in VA and seen on bank video in MD, held the victims hostage for 23 hours and murdered them by himself? Meanwhile, he acquired some pizza crust with DW's DNA on it at a party and brought it with him in a brown paper bag, so as not to further contaminate the evidence or destroy the DNA, and left it at the S house? He also procured some of JW's sweat to add to the vest with SS' blood and somehow managed to splash some of the victims' blood on DW's shoes, without him knowing it? Oh! And set a fire that burned just enough to alert firefighters, but not enough to burn up the pizza crust that was needed to finger DW.

ITA that JW has made himself an impeachable witness with the lying, but IIUC, DW receiving the $40,000 is not necessary for him to be guilty of felony murder. It might add motive, but even without it, the prosecutor can say this was a grudge murder, as evidenced by the completely unnecessary torture of the victims. What else does JW provide the prosecution that is essential to the case? Maybe help with establishing a timeline, but that can be done with records, which don't rely on JW's truthfulness.

Unless DW's attorneys can convince a jury that JW committed the murders without DW's help, I don't see how bringing JW into the picture helps DW at all. Reasonable doubt that DW acted alone doesn't make him not guilty of acting. JMO

 

[jjenny]

Here is what I find strange about the defense going so hard at JW. It seems very odd because what do they hope to accomplish?

They seem to be implying that JW was somehow involved. IF that is true, and he is a co-conspirator with DW, like some here believe, then HOW DOES THAT HELP DW'S CASE? If they shine the light on JW, doesnt that threaten DW even more? What if JW is forced to make a deal and then he tells all? JW is the ONE MAN that can put DW on death row.

So it leads me to believe he is a red herring.

I agree. Seems defense is grasping at straws.
Any sort of discrepancy they will jump on, even if it doesn't help their client. Unfortunately nothing can put DW on death row because there is no death penalty on the table.