DC - Savvas Savopoulos, family & Veralicia Figueroa murdered; Daron Wint Arrested #19

[BellaVita]

If true -- and it was not a hail mary was he finally freed himself (as some articles claim he was not restrained when found burned) -- then it leads one to wonder...what more did DW want JW to do...or to know?

Also one of my big questions all along. That's why I'm SO curious about whether call was missed, answered or a voicemail. After going back and forth, I don't think it was a text due to the wording in the search warrants and quotes by LE. That is just my belief but could be wrong, of course. What WOULD be the purpose of that call? I feel that if DW instructed SS to try for more money, then there would have been a conversation or a voicemail. I don't think SS would hang up the phone without leaving a message because he'd be trying to save the family/VF. He'd leave a VM in the hopes JW would call him back. IF anything WAS said by SS, it did not seem to impact JW's activities in any. At least from what we know.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/local...9031d4-0adf-11e5-a7ad-b430fc1d3f5c_story.html

After delivering the ransom money on the morning of the fire, police said, Wallace drove to Chantilly, Va., to help finish building a martial arts studio, and authorities confirmed his location by tracking his cellphone and with receipts and surveillance video from a Virginia hardware store he visited. Police said that Wallace received a call from someone at American Iron Works informing him that his boss’s house was on fire and that he immediately drove to Woodland Drive.

It's not stated in this particular article, but after Lowes, I believe JW would have gone to the dojo and delivered the supplies he'd purchased. There's been nothing written anywhere that implies any other unusual things happened after the 11:54 call. I'd like to know what time the lawn crew was at the house. After getting the $40,000, I'd think DW wanted to get out of the house as soon as possible. It was becoming more and more likely that he'd be discovered after all that time in the house.

 

[BellaVita]

Agree about that--no mask means no witnesses alive. But surely DW had access to guns, which would have made the crime much simpler from his perspective. no gun + no mask + lawyer saying DW never intended to hurt anyone = maybe he WAS there without pre-planning the murders?

Guns make noise. Wint has stabbed a person before and threatened others with being stabbed. Bragged he was good with a knife. May have carried a knife at all times, IMO. DW was getting into trouble with LE constantly. Though he had no respect for the law and was willing to break it all the time, he may not have been willing to risk carrying a gun in MD or DC, especially being a convicted felon. He may have known and cared a great deal about a very stiff sentence if discovered with a gun.

 

[SpanishInquisition]

Now I'm going to guess and it's going to be a very subjective answer.

The first reason DW might do it is spite...he's not going to go down alone for this. He's not going to let JW go on with his life while he pays for this crime.

The second reason is really subjective....he might do it because for certain people, like me, there would be a huge transfer of anger from DW to JW. Because we know that SS tried to give JW a helping hand. We know he KNEW that family. And most of all, we know JW knew and spent time with that little boy. Whether it's fair or not, JW and DW would not be "equals" to me in the way I would view this crime. JW's betrayal and what that child suffered, would focus my contempt on JW.

So, he might do it in the thought that "once people found out who was there"...their anger and desire for very harsh punishment would escalate toward The Betrayer and away from him.

That is one reason that comment from the previous Attorney really resonated with me.

I thought with Hanover that he was angling for a plea bargain and I wouldn't be surprised if that's still the goal. If you turn state's evidence on others you're still admitting to what you did, just you're getting a reduced sentence in exchange for sending X number of others up, which potentially DW may be able to offer up multiple people that could be tried for felony murder. Regardless of whether JW was involved, I don't think that DW acted alone and that he could send multiple people away for life if he took a plea deal.

 

[katydid23]

I thought with Hanover that he was angling for a plea bargain and I wouldn't be surprised if that's still the goal. If you turn state's evidence on others you're still admitting to what you did, just you're getting a reduced sentence in exchange for sending X number of others up, which potentially DW may be able to offer up multiple people that could be tried for felony murder. Regardless of whether JW was involved, I don't think that DW acted alone and that he could send multiple people away for life if he took a plea deal.

But if his helpers are family members or gang members then he cannot snitch or he is dead anyway. So he is up a creek w/out a paddle.

 

[Peliman]

But if his helpers are family members or gang members then he cannot snitch or he is dead anyway. So he is up a creek w/out a paddle.

There's not much dealing room with DW even if he snitches. Not that I see the DA giving him. There is possible room for family or gang members to snitch on DW. Deals maybe in the workings, the rule is first in, first out.

 

[katydid23]

<modsnip>

I think they say the pizza is A MATCH with his DNA. It is the vest that is said to be 'similar'--

 

[SpanishInquisition]

so the DNA on the vest is 'iffy.' But luckily, when it comes to the pizza crust:



In asking Judge Rhonda Reid Winston to find probable cause in the case, Assistant U.S. Attorney Laura presented a police report that says DNA from the uneaten crust of a pizza in the Savopoulos home is a match for Wint's profile in an FBI database.

They're both iffy according to the article: "Technicians have not completed statistical analysis, however, to determine how rare the DNA profile recovered from the pizza or the vest would be in the population, Owens said."

 

[SpanishInquisition]

But if his helpers are family members or gang members then he cannot snitch or he is dead anyway. So he is up a creek w/out a paddle.

Seeing how he's on record threatening to kill family members and that didn't get him killed, I don't see how sending them away for life in prison is any worse...actually that would be an improvement.

 

[facundo]

Can anyone tell me how to find TOS on Tapatalk? Or.....give a summary of a "broken quote". I'm not clear on what that is. Thanks!


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

If I understand your question, an example of a broken quote is when you drop the terminal quote in a citation, e.g. [/QUOTE]

 

[stmarysmead]

Taking only a knife to a situation where you alone must manage three adults and a child just does not work for me.

So, did DW expect to find only one person? If so, he had to have had information about this family and their daily life (however much it proved in error.) I can see entering with only a knife if you think what you want is already there and you will only encounter a housekeeper. But without inside info, it's a huge risk. This really troubles me.

I keep thinking about NG's comments that seem to indicate that she was told money was being delivered to the house for the DOJO opening. I know she has made conflicted statements. But if DW thought that money was in place and only VF would be in the house, he might think a knife and a quick in and out would suffice.

I can't imagine planning to managing 3 adults and a child, overnight, and taking only a knife and going alone. Granted he is no member of Mensa but certainly he has some street smarts.

 

[SophieRose]

I think DW uses knives because they are a weapon of choice in Guyana. He didn't come to the USA until he was 20. Look up Guyana cutlass crime.


http://webcache.googleusercontent.c...ls.aspx?cid=16951&hl=en&gl=us&strip=1&vwsrc=0

Handguns, knives, machetes, or "cutlasses" tend to be the weapons of choice. Criminals may act brazenly, and police officers have been both victims and perpetrators of assaults and shootings.

Here's a home invasion that happened in Guyana around the same time as the SS home invasion.

http://guyana.hoop.la/topic/oversea...ow-granger-to-start-fixing-this-crime-problem

The men, who were armed with cutlasses, placed the weapons to her and her daughter&#8217;s neck threatening to cut them off if she doesn&#8217;t say where the US currency and jewelry were.

She began to beg and told the men that she didn&#8217;t know.

The men then placed the cutlass again under her baby&#8217;s chin and again threatened to cut her neck off.

The woman said she continued to beg and heard a commotion outside. Her aunt who was in her bedroom opened the door and saw the men hacking away at her husband.

 

[stmarysmead]

L

I think DW uses knives because they are a weapon of choice in Guyana. He didn't come to the USA until he was 20. Look up Guyana cutlass crime.


http://webcache.googleusercontent.c...ls.aspx?cid=16951&hl=en&gl=us&strip=1&vwsrc=0

Handguns, knives, machetes, or "cutlasses" tend to be the weapons of choice. Criminals may act brazenly, and police officers have been both victims and perpetrators of assaults and shootings.

Here's a home invasion that happened in Guyana around the same time as the SS home invasion.

http://guyana.hoop.la/topic/oversea...ow-granger-to-start-fixing-this-crime-problem

The men, who were armed with cutlasses, placed the weapons to her and her daughter&#8217;s neck threatening to cut them off if she doesn&#8217;t say where the US currency and jewelry were.

She began to beg and told the men that she didn&#8217;t know.

The men then placed the cutlass again under her baby&#8217;s chin and again threatened to cut her neck off.

The woman said she continued to beg and heard a commotion outside. Her aunt who was in her bedroom opened the door and saw the men hacking away at her husband.

Horrible. But this is a gang invasion. I can see a group going in with knives that included DW. But just not one guy, one knife to a family home where in addition to family, he could also encounter employed help. What if some former Navy Seal was their insurance agent and had stopped over? What if a couple young men who were friends of the daughters were chatting with Mom in the kitchen?

Without insider knowledge, DW was walking into a very large family home with only a knife and no idea who or HOW MANY people might be inside?

A group of men with knives, yes. Not DW alone.

I also have a suspicion that there might have been a woman in the mix. Some of this torture could have been some sort of vile macho "showing off." IMO only.

 

[James Bond]

If Ago is the top dog in the PD division he is clearly a competent attorney. Why would he throw some serious shade on JW if JW was already "cleared" by the PD? Makes no sense in my book.

 

[SpanishInquisition]

IMO. The DNA from "a" relative (trying to stay in TOS) and DW would be quite different. Different enough that it would be readily apparent that said relative's DNA is not DW's DNA. Also, IMO, "theoretically" speaking, if a relative's DNA is also in the database, the two would be easily differentiated. I think the DNA on the pizza is unequivocally Daron Wint's as it was matched in a database. I just don't think DNA allows that much wiggle room. This is an opinion of mine due to following crime stories for years. Have not researched links right now to support this, so JMO right now.

I've already posted links on this prior to getting your post, but Arizona did tests on that where what was considered a 'match' (9 loci) went so far as turning up a match between a white convict and a black convict and there's other research out there where you have a 13 loci match where the 13 loci match come from relatives. You can have what is considered a very strong DNA match, but even with a high loci match that could be a [close] relative. <modsnip>

 

[stmarysmead]

If Ago is the top dog in the PD division he is clearly a competent attorney. Why would he throw some serious shade on JW if JW was already "cleared" by the PD? Makes no sense in my book.

Thanks was not enough. Excellent point. Makes no sense to me either.

 

[SophieRose]

If Ago is the top dog in the PD division he is clearly a competent attorney. Why would he throw some serious shade on JW if JW was already "cleared" by the PD? Makes no sense in my book.

That's what defense attorneys do. There was a cold case in the Bay Area that was solved by DNA a few years ago. A woman was stabbed to death in her apt in the middle of the day. Like most cases involving a husband or spouse, LE investigated the bf. The couple had a fight a few days before but had made up. Police cleared him. Years later LE has a match, a neighbor who they believe was burglarizing her apt when she walked in. His DNA was found underneath her nails and one of his pubic hairs near the body (no sexual assault.) Well, his defense was that the boyfriend did it, that he had plenty of time to get to the apt from his place of employment. The guy was found guilty and he's still arguing that the bf was not checked out enough as part of his appeal process.

 

[katydid23]

If Ago is the top dog in the PD division he is clearly a competent attorney. Why would he throw some serious shade on JW if JW was already "cleared" by the PD? Makes no sense in my book.

Ago 'plan B'd' him. They choose a 'Plan B.' That's what some defense attorneys call it when they point their fingers at a different target to create doubt. It does not matter if they are cleared or not if they can stir up some suspicion and raise questions.

 

[al66pine]

Taking only a knife to a situation where you alone must manage three adults and a child just does not work for me....

bbm sbm Having a gun w him during home invasion could have given DDW (potentially more) leverage thana knife alone.Yes, firing it would have made noise, possibly catching attention of neighbors who could call 911.
Houses are close together there, but perhaps noise risk would be reduced by home size? Not like a home invadee (?) would call a perp's bluff or think, "Home invader, go ahead and shoot, neighbors' calls to 911 will have LE in no time." Or silencer?

If DDW had fired gun in home, seems that info would be 'out.' If he had gun but did not fire it, what forensic evd could LE have detected? Likely none, imo. Sadly, no survivors to confirm or dispute.

Just speculation - DDW could have used his (own, borrowed, stolen? hypo) gun to threaten, in addition to menacing w knife.

 

[BellaVita]

<modsnip> I've already posted links on this prior to getting your post, but Arizona did tests on that where what was considered a 'match' (9 loci) went so far as turning up a match between a white convict and a black convict and there's other research out there where you have a 13 loci match where the 13 loci match come from relatives. You can have what is considered a very strong DNA match, but even with a high loci match that could be a [close] relative.

Thanks for the link about the Arizona study. VERY interesting. I believe some of the Troyer info would most likely come into play if there is DNA that is degraded. I calculated the numbers and the odds of matching loci are even more infinitesimal than at first glance IMO. In the AZ study of 65,000 felons there were 122 total matches of 9 loci. That amounts to .0019 of 1 percent. The 20 who match at 10 loci amounts to .0003 of 1 percent. The other study in IL yields similar percentages. But I see where some defense lawyers may feel they could hit the jackpot with some of this info. As long as there are decent samples, I think anything offered by the defense to refute lab results would be smoke and mirrors and would depend on the jury whether it's effective or not.

Staying within TOS, I believe there may have been other DNA in the database besides Darron Wint that could be a closer match than some others, but in the end, LE issued an arrest warrant for Darron.

 

[Sparky]

Folks,
DW's brother is off limits, as he's not been named a POI/Suspect. His cousin can only be brought in and discussed from the MSM link posted previously. He has also not been named a POI/Suspect. :tyou: