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is the snarkiness of the words regular and accepted procedure for the legal community? it almost seems like the defense is poking the Judge and being rather rude. I'm not up on my legal procedure or wording but is it commonplace to be so disrespectful?
 
So...if a defense expert has reviewed the reports of the State's expert and his opinion is that he'll let you know IF the State's expert says anything false at trial, but that "hasn't happened yet"...doesn't that mean that the defense expert agrees with the report of the State's expert?

I read that a couple of times myself and :waitasec:. haha! I took it as they don't know yet WTH their strategy is and they are praying the SA experts say something even slightly off that they can jump on and exploit to confuse the jurors. They are not willing to commit to anything. Not gonna fence themselves in at all.

They're still hoping for their BIG BREAK! :rolling: Alrighty then. It is getting a little late though. Tick-tock...tick-tock....
 
nums, I'm not sure I would have titled it a "Response" to the SA's motion because as you say, it was filed after the hearing and after HHJP entered his order granting the SA's motion. Whatever they want to call it is okay with me as long as they filed the response and complied with the Judge's order, which is basically all this is.

I didn't think so either, it just goes to show which attorney is filing what, that has to be a JB filing.
 
So...if a defense expert has reviewed the reports of the State's expert and his opinion is that he'll let you know IF the State's expert says anything false at trial, but that "hasn't happened yet"...doesn't that mean that the defense expert agrees with the report of the State's expert?

B I N G O!!!!!!!! Unfortunately there is no prize.
 
Now I am more confused than ever- in the defense response that lists 13 of their expert witnesses, I am confused as to what Dr Barry Logan will testify about. It says he will testify that the air testing by Oakridge labs is not a recognized scientific method. I thought Dr Logan was testing items (shorts and laundry bag?) for touch DNA. The items were being sent to him in PA after JP denied the defense request to send them out of the country to Eikelenboom in the Netherlands. Why would he be testifying about air samples? (Unless he has already completed the testing for touch DNA and found nothing?) Were those items ever sent? If so, when?
http://www.cfnews13.com/static/articles/images/documents/SKMBT_C45210121512020.pdf
 
Questions after reading the Expert witness info:

Were we expecting a Frye hearing for anything related to botany?

What are they trying to say in #4 on Huntington's info?

Why does he need 2 people Fairgrieve & Furton to testify about the cadaver dogs alerts?

Does this mean Henry Lee can not testify about DNA, as Eikelenbloom is listed for DNA?
 
I read that a couple of times myself and :waitasec:. haha! I took it as they don't know yet WTH their strategy is and they are praying the SA experts say something even slightly off that they can jump on and exploit to confuse the jurors. They are not willing to commit to anything. Not gonna fence themselves in at all.

They're still hoping for their BIG BREAK! :rolling: Alrighty then. It is getting a little late though. Tick-tock...tick-tock....

I think that is why everything seems so confusing-because it is. And it is due to JB's inexperience and not seeming to be a clear orderly thinker or knowing how to prioritize. He is in so far over his head that I think he doesn't know what to do next. He is drowning in confusion.
A death penalty qualified attorney should be taking the lead so JB can learn. Even though CM is on board, I don't think he is leading. And I don't think CM is even helping JB much based on courtroom appearances.
Just a totally chaotic mess. If JBP gets thru this with no appeal issues (based on JB's incompetence) it will be a miracle.
 
Questions after reading the Expert witness info:

Were we expecting a Frye hearing for anything related to botany?

What are they trying to say in #4 on Huntington's info?

Why does he need 2 people Fairgrieve & Furton to testify about the cadaver dogs alerts?

Does this mean Henry Lee can not testify about DNA, as Eikelenbloom is listed for DNA?

I think the defense can have as many experts testify as they want-but JAC will not fund them beyond what JBP has already approved. Sorry, no reference . Anyone know where to find that hearing when JBP stated which experts would be paid for?
 
Am I to assume that any "false" testimony by the State's expert witnesses will be taken care of by the defense experts? That is the weirdest way to put it.

In my mind, "false" equals "lie". That is a rather juvenile way to say that experts have studied the evidence and have come to a conclusion based on their training and experience. If it disagrees with the defense "facts" they are lying?

Has Baez ever heard of the term "difference of opinion"?

Actually, it sounds like something Casey would write.
 
IMHO, I think this response is like a slap in the face to Judge Perry and SA. I hope SA files a response stating that JB is still not complying with the Order. His response was snippy and did not explain anything as far as a summary which the Judge ordered him to give. I hope Judge Perry does not let him get away with this as a response.
 
Questions after reading the Expert witness info:

Were we expecting a Frye hearing for anything related to botany?

What are they trying to say in #4 on Huntington's info?

Why does he need 2 people Fairgrieve & Furton to testify about the cadaver dogs alerts?

Does this mean Henry Lee can not testify about DNA, as Eikelenbloom is listed for DNA?

Some of these same thoughts were spinning within my head, so it's nice to see someone post about them!

I thought that this response to the court's order might show Baez's expert's opinion in regards to the water level at the dump site. It doesn't. This is just one specific example where I think Baez's response to the court's order falls short. I'm not sure Baez has complied fully with the court's order.
 
I think the defense can have as many experts testify as they want-but JAC will not fund them beyond what JBP has already approved. Sorry, no reference . Anyone know where to find that hearing when JBP stated which experts would be paid for?

Casey Anthony: Budget Hearing 5/6/10

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2X75NfB9KFU&feature=related[/ame]
---contains the links to wftv for the 3 1/2 hr. hearing

http://boards.insessiontrials.com/s...-(4-14-10-TO-10-1-10)&p=14440899#post14440899

-----transcribed ----begins @ part 2------
 
Re Dr Spitz not finding any signs of trauma and not being able to determine a cause of death. Neither did Dr G so what's his point??
I'm glad he chose to go sweeping with his analysis rather than in the detailed fashion she did. No signs of trauma suggests he examined a living person or a person whose age or health status would suggest their sudden death could be of natural causes. A child with a heart defect on a transplant list or a child with diabetes may possible just suddenly die but that certainly doesn't apply to Caylee. Even if the defense tried to interject some malady that might explain Caylee dying of natural causes, at no point in the search for a living Caylee has any member appealed to anyone to bring her back let alone to bring her back because she needed her insulin or puffers or heart medication to live.
So he couldn't determine an actual cause of death but he won't be able to call it death from natural causes on the stand. I also don't believe they jury will accept the concept of no trauma when they'll be groslly traumatized by the autopsy photos. Dr G stated she found no signs of skeletal trauma. Caylee could have died from blunt force trauma to an organ that caused her to hemmorage internally to death. She could have died black and blue with bruising over every square inch of her body, and still have no skeletal trauma. Her abuser didn't break bones. So what??
I wonder what the going rate is for an expert to claim that a dead baby wrapped in gargabe bags in the woods with duct tape wrapped around her skull, didn't suffer trauma. Or maybe Caylee committed suicide. Seriously are we to believe that??
An ME without an official documented autopsy report shouldn't even be allowed on the stand IMO, but if he is, fear not. He can't explain anything more than the fact that Caylee never sustained a broken bone. The word Trauma in medicine is used in association with a specific event or body system. Traumatic brain injury, skeletal trauma, emotional trauma, traumatic amputation...... That's why Dr G stated there were no signs of skeletal trauma period because that's all she could determine with what she had to work with.
He says there's no signs of trauma. I say every juror in the court will see it differently and think he's insane.

Seems to me the defense experts are going to create reasonable doubt in their own defense strategy only. The SAO has a case that is built like blocks, solid. The defense wants us to believe it may not be murder on one hand, but may have been and if it was, somebody else did it, but may not have because Caylee is still alive living with someone named Sixto. Or did he move out lol???
Imagine Caylee Gonzalez living openly in NYC and not a single NG, JVM, National Inquirer or useless blogger noticing the likeness and reporting it? It's mindboggling, but not as mindboggling as the email parroting ICA's last story dated 12/10/2010.
Who are these people?
Sorry about the rant but:banghead::banghead: :banghead:
Does anyone know which expert was dropped or if the defense got their homework done by 12pm yesterday?
 
Re Dr Spitz not finding any signs of trauma and not being able to determine a cause of death. Neither did Dr G so what's his point??
I'm glad he chose to go sweeping with his analysis rather than in the detailed fashion she did. No signs of trauma suggests he examined a living person or a person whose age or health status would suggest their sudden death could be of natural causes. A child with a heart defect on a transplant list or a child with diabetes may possible just suddenly die but that certainly doesn't apply to Caylee. Even if the defense tried to interject some malady that might explain Caylee dying of natural causes, at no point in the search for a living Caylee has any member appealed to anyone to bring her back let alone to bring her back because she needed her insulin or puffers or heart medication to live.
So he couldn't determine an actual cause of death but he won't be able to call it death from natural causes on the stand. I also don't believe they jury will accept the concept of no trauma when they'll be groslly traumatized by the autopsy photos. Dr G stated she found no signs of skeletal trauma. Caylee could have died from blunt force trauma to an organ that caused her to hemmorage internally to death. She could have died black and blue with bruising over every square inch of her body, and still have no skeletal trauma. Her abuser didn't break bones. So what??
I wonder what the going rate is for an expert to claim that a dead baby wrapped in gargabe bags in the woods with duct tape wrapped around her skull, didn't suffer trauma. Or maybe Caylee committed suicide. Seriously are we to believe that??
An ME without an official documented autopsy report shouldn't even be allowed on the stand IMO, but if he is, fear not. He can't explain anything more than the fact that Caylee never sustained a broken bone. The word Trauma in medicine is used in association with a specific event or body system. Traumatic brain injury, skeletal trauma, emotional trauma, traumatic amputation...... That's why Dr G stated there were no signs of skeletal trauma period because that's all she could determine with what she had to work with.
He says there's no signs of trauma. I say every juror in the court will see it differently and think he's insane.

Seems to me the defense experts are going to create reasonable doubt in their own defense strategy only. The SAO has a case that is built like blocks, solid. The defense wants us to believe it may not be murder on one hand, but may have been and if it was, somebody else did it, but may not have because Caylee is still alive living with someone named Sixto. Or did he move out lol???
Imagine Caylee Gonzalez living openly in NYC and not a single NG, JVM, National Inquirer or useless blogger noticing the likeness and reporting it? It's mindboggling, but not as mindboggling as the email parroting ICA's last story dated 12/10/2010.
Who are these people?
Sorry about the rant but:banghead::banghead: :banghead:
Does anyone know which expert was dropped or if the defense got their homework done by 12pm yesterday?

Rant away.......you are entitled.

Homicide is the killing of a human being due to the act or failure to act of another. Criminal homicides include murder and manslaughter. Non-criminal homicides include killing in self-defense, a misadventure like a hunting accident or automobile wreck without a violation of law like reckless driving, or legal (government) execution. Suicide is a homicide, but is rarely prosecuted. Assisting or attempting suicide can be a crime.

http://definitions.uslegal.com/h/homicide/

I think Dr G got it spot on. Frankly, as a juror, I'd be insulted is some well known "rent a doc" tried to tell me that an apparently healthy toddler, not reported missing for a month, who was found in swampy woods, was triple bagged with three separate pieces of duct tape still attached to her ravaged tiny skull...... was the victim of an accident or death by natural causes. :furious: And :waitasec: wasn't Mommy claiming this child was abducted. Coroners are allowed to take into account known facts in a criminal investigation.

"The horrible thing that happened is-- this is the honest to God’s truth. Of everything that I’ve said, I
do not know where she is. The last person that I saw her with is Zenaida. She’s the last person that I’ve seen my daughter with."
 
IMHO, I think this response is like a slap in the face to Judge Perry and SA. I hope SA files a response stating that JB is still not complying with the Order. His response was snippy and did not explain anything as far as a summary which the Judge ordered him to give. I hope Judge Perry does not let him get away with this as a response.

I agree to an extent. I gotta say though this was a lot more than I expected to see. I want to see Part 2, (the exhibits).

I do have a problem with no inclusion of summary opinions; however, from what I can tell most of these experts don't really have a basis for differing "opinions" from the SA's experts. Sometimes the things that aren't said speak volumes. They just plan on sitting back and hoping there is something.....anything....said in their testimony that the defense expert can refute, or at least cast doubt. For example, of course Spitz could not determine a COD. :rolleyes: Neither did Dr. G. Spitz will testify that it cannot be proven that Caylee died as a result of a homicide. I'm anxious to hear his theory when the SA asks him to explain the duct tape. That should be an interesting exchange.
 
I think that is why everything seems so confusing-because it is. And it is due to JB's inexperience and not seeming to be a clear orderly thinker or knowing how to prioritize. He is in so far over his head that I think he doesn't know what to do next. He is drowning in confusion.
A death penalty qualified attorney should be taking the lead so JB can learn. Even though CM is on board, I don't think he is leading. And I don't think CM is even helping JB much based on courtroom appearances.
Just a totally chaotic mess. If JBP gets thru this with no appeal issues (based on JB's incompetence) it will be a miracle.

-----------------
I think JB. insists on being lead,that is why everyone jumps ship.They know a catastrophy when they see one.CM. has nothing to lose.CM. is ready to give it up and retire anyway.Think of the Jury hearing all about the death smell from so many people along with KC's words about the stink."if they ever find the body guess who will spend eternity in jail".You KC..those were her own words.:furious:
 
Why the heck are they being so tight-lipped about Freeman? Seems he is the ace that they are trying to keep up their sleeve.

The good folks at HM have dug up some interesting information about him, which leads to some also-interesting theories about how the defense plans to use him...

http://thehinkymeter.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=986&p=8782#p8782

My idea is different than the one discussed over at HM. Apparently they think over there that Freeman will try to establish some sort of existing condition that lead to Caylees death.
I just read an article authored by Freeman. "The Ethics of the Third Party Medical Evaluation"
"The purpose of this discussion is to present the scientific weaknesses inherent in the self-serving DME or IME opinion, one that embraces junk science as its core (I define junk science as the use of scientific terms and formulae applied inappropriately for the express purpose of lending credence to an opinion that is clearly lacking in validity). The following are the primary scientific and logical transgressions of such opinions that invalidate them.."


http://www.doereport.com/20050603freeman.php
This is possibly what he will testify to-that the prosecution experts are testifying to "junk science" so they will get paid, and so that the prosecution will continue to use them (and pay them) in future cases. In other words, telling the prosecution what they want to hear. That's not exactly what the article is about, but it is a twist of the same theme.
That would explain all the "false testimony" of prosecution witnesses referenced by Baez in his expert witness list.
 

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