Egypt Air flight 804 missing, 19 May 2016

[CARIIS]

Is this outfit accurate??

WOW Intially there were reports of distress calls so hummmm .

IMO only this makes a lot of sense! So maybe there was a fire after all............But could a bomb casue a fire around and around we go ! But this is very interesting IMO. and just seems to fit the first controlled descent, which is what you do!! and then everything went haywire.....

The pilot of the doomed EgyptAir flight spoke to air traffic control in Egypt for several minutes ,,,,, French television .....

...........the pilot told Cairo control about the smoke which had engulfed parts of the aircraft and decided to make an emergency descent to try to clear the fumes.
.....
.....directly contradicts the official claim that there was no distress call from the plane.The claims follow reports of leaked flight data showing trouble in the cockpit and smoke in a plane lavatory just before the plane crashed.


.....not confirmed by the French air accident investigation agency, the BEA.


.............. pilot of the Egyptair A320 had "a conversation several minutes long" with Cairo air traffic control after the plane ran into difficulties in the early hours of Thursday morning.

........pilot decided to make an “emergency descent”, depressurising the cabin, in an attempt to clear smoke fumes which had invaded the front of the aircraft. (account for windsheild alarms guys ??????)

...... on Thursday, there were contradictory claims about distress calls or signals.

"If they lost the aircraft within three minutes that's very, very quick,"

"They were dealing with an extremely serious incident."


Messages like these "generally mean the start of a fire," ................ I assume they are referring to ACARS!
.....

Greek officials say at 2:24 a.m. local time the flight entered the Athens sector of Greek airspace. Twenty-four minutes later, controllers chatted with the pilot, who appeared to be in good spirits.


http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...or-several-minutes-before-crash-a7041936.html

But then we get back to the core question why surpress this and who surpressed? Was it the folks that were abusing an aircraft? Was the fire a result of an abused airplane finally collapsing and a fire started. But now I suppose they will say a bomb casue the fire.

This only adds to my "shift" yesterday, and am staying on the mechanical side of the story more and more actually.

What about you guys???

It also "happens" to match no claims made -- moo

 

[dotr]

http://abcnews.go.com/International...pt-submarine-headed-plane-crash-site-39286137

This still image taken from video posted Saturday, May 21, 2016, on the official Facebook page of the Egyptian Armed Forces spokesman shows personal belongings and other wreckage of EgyptAir flight 804.

Officials have been cautioning that it was still too early to say what happened to the aircraft, but mounting evidence points to a sudden, dramatic catastrophe that led to the crash.

 

[dotr]

Is there anything further that can be done to improve black boxes?
If we have the technology to send submarines, ships, everything but the kitchen sink to help locate them, why can they not improve the design of the BB itself so that it is easier and quicker to find?
imo
Looks like a "tickle trunk" to me. imo.
https://www.google.ca/search?q=blac...UIBygB&biw=1366&bih=657#imgrc=p2Xk58cc-lx_wM:





http://www.wsj.com/articles/egypt-d...or-egyptair-flight-804-black-boxes-1463922980
.

The black boxes are equipped with beacons to help salvage teams find them. Detecting the signal underwater can be difficult, however, because of its short range. This task often requires specialized microphones.

The submarine likely could detect the signal from the black boxes, and could also be used to locate large parts of the plane, such as its fuselage, to help narrow the search area.

"We all know that the aviation industry is extremely cautious. They take a very long time to adopt new technology," said Blake van den Heuvel, a director at Canadian aviation technology firm DRS Technologies – a company which makes "floating" black boxes for aircraft.

Fifty-two days after Flight MH370 disappeared, its black box has run out of battery power, after apparently giving the search team some tantalising signals for three days before it went dead.

The emissions were never confirmed as being from MH370, as they stopped too soon for confirmation, and the submersible drone equipped with sonar and cameras sent down to the bottom of the ocean, where the signal was believed to have emanated, found nothing.

The black box – which contains the flight data recorder and cockpit voice recorder of a plane – is the key to uncovering what happened in an air crash.

It took two years to find the black box from the ill-fated Air France plane, even though its black box was only 6.5 nautical miles from the known crash site of the plane.

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/world/mh370-e...-technology-20140428-zr0vn.html#ixzz49OOhPf7j
Follow us: @smh on Twitter | sydneymorningherald on Facebook

 

[Gigi-G]

It is so confusing - the ACARS stuff, actually, IMO leans me toward rapid decompression as oppossed to fire. But the AcARs was going for three minutes, so it was not an instant event .Decmpression makes a mist/fog like thing, which I think may have trigger the smoke sensers..

One would think a couple of things about a bomb, quicker (Acars on has to mean a relativily intact machine to run) . The drop in altitude , as oppossed to at that point falling out of the sky, now, IMO seems to be the cockpit crew doing what you do when decompression occurs - get down and quick.

So lets say the first drop was at the captains input- still in control of the aircraft.. Decompression is rough (!) on fueslage skin! The plane had been worked hard. So lets say on the controlled decent , intially, the plane experieced more stressers and started to truly but realivily slowly , shed some stuff, which adds to the problem obviously!

And at 9000 feet it was catastrophic structural failure. The items shown today had nothing to indicate, an explosion, fire or soot, and not really ( I am talking about soft stuff -like the purse clothing) was basically intact.

But if you think about they were now down to 9000 feet, not falling from 37000. I get the visualization of the light stuff sort of floating down . Just from the video today. A sneaker that looks brand new with a small hole. I must admit when I saw it, I pondering if we were being BSed - it did not even look like it had been marinating in salt water for hours??

If we are gonna say bomb, that probably would have ignited the fuel as well - so why is nothing showing any evidence of fire. The cockpit window stuff is also interesting- might that have been the intial weak spot from metal fatigue??

That kinda feels congruent, as well, with getting no reply from the plane a bit earlier in the sequence by the tower. They were busy dealing with an increasing issue, decompression is really loud, they might have not even be able to hear the tower calling - its loud!!( They must get on oxygen masks to live! Busy guys. Answering a tower when your world is going mad is a matter of priorites!! IMO

I feel as if the bathroom senser alarm was the one in the front right behind the cockpit as opposed to the image of a fire spreading from the rear bathroom. That would be congruent with (window in cockpit as start of structural failure.

Pure speculation for sure but the ACARS and debris , in conjunction with what I learned today about the actual flight utilization rates posted earlier. I was instantly struck when I saw how they were flying her, but did not have a concrete defination.

If you look at the numbers posted earlier -I expected utlization to a bit higher for other carriers than what I learned.

But it seems as if 10 hours in the air was round average, this thing was going 17 hours a day. That was much more of a difference than I thought. So basically it makes her much older than just the "purchase" date, and erronous perception created by media calling her a young girl!!

She was old, worked to death, and metal fatigue can often start slower and progress, which seems to be what was occuring as opposed to this sudden assualt on a planed. She was in control for the 17000 foot drop , ACARS reporting, so it just does not, today, hit me a truly instant deal.

I suppose we could say a bomb that was not all the big, or in the right location could initiate in flight breakup, but the visual of this plane blowing out of the sky , only IMO seems less than yesterday.

ACARS has a warning (AIR EXCESSIVE CABIN ALTITUDE) for rapid decompresion which did not happen?

This is really a good two minute deal of what I am starting to think. Notice a couple of things the mist that I think may have activated the smoke, the plane still relativily intact for a peroid of time. I think if we put this plane (Aloha) in the exact location as Egypt it would be the same result but but Aloha had an airport close.

I think this would start a smoke detector!! Here is decompression:

[video=youtube;IPpb5S0dF_I]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IPpb5S0dF_I[/video]



Pure specualation on my part!

Agreed. There's no soot no blackening. Nothing deems to give up any vital clues.. after watching that video I came up with this. The first explosion. Check out the debris. N the dummy. Dummy lost an arm.. didn't MSM state there Was an arm amongst the debris?

I MOO. A small incendiary device. Possibly made to fit in a cell fone?
Wouldn't be a huge boom. But slow burner as battery heats up. N a small explosion. Would be enough to start a series of catastrophic proportions..

Just speculation

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[Gigi-G]

Agreed. There's no soot no blackening. Nothing deems to give up any vital clues.. after watching that video I came up with this. The first explosion. Check out the debris. N the dummy. Dummy lost an arm.. didn't MSM state there Was an arm amongst the debris?

I MOO. A small incendiary device. Possibly made to fit in a cell fone?
Wouldn't be a huge boom. But slow burner as battery heats up. N a small explosion. Would be enough to start a series of catastrophic proportions..

Just speculation

Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk

https://youtu.be/4yG2h1aDB6k

I forgot to add link :0

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[watcher9]

Would cell phones work in a Mediterranean flight? Pictures and messages to their loved ones?

 

[gregjrichards]

Would cell phones work in a Mediterranean flight? Pictures and messages to their loved ones?

Doubtful not at the altitude the plane was at on a budget airline that most likely does not have cell/wifi onboard. I checked the Egyptair website no mention of these services. Even in 2016 cell tower service in the Middle East has a long way to catch up.

 

[jslk]

I watched Justice with Judge Jeanine on Fox News last night and she had a security specialist guest on from Paris. He said he had landed in Paris a few hours after this plane was believed crashed and they never checked his passport when the plane landed at CDG airport. He also said perhaps no terrorist group had claimed responsibility due to this being a test run. If this is true that CDG never checked passports what else are they dropping the ball on? It is deeply concerning.

Regarding compensation I appreciate the cause of the crash needs to be determined but the three orphaned children in Cairo whose parents have been killed in this disaster for example need help now in order to eat and live. They should be protected from suffering more than what they already are. Some organisation has to step up to the plate and help these suffering families meantime. There should be a fund airlines pay into to provide immediate financial help to the families of crash victims regardless of how a plane has been brought down.

Wth is with people not having their passports checked, in this day and age?! I have NEVER arrived in another country and not been checked out: how the hell does it happen?!

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[gregjrichards]

Is there anything further that can be done to improve black boxes?
If we have the technology to send submarines, ships, everything but the kitchen sink to help locate them, why can they not improve the design of the BB itself so that it is easier and quicker to find?
imo
Looks like a "tickle trunk" to me. imo.
https://www.google.ca/search?q=blac...UIBygB&biw=1366&bih=657#imgrc=p2Xk58cc-lx_wM:

View attachment 95028



http://www.wsj.com/articles/egypt-d...or-egyptair-flight-804-black-boxes-1463922980
.

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/world/mh370-e...-technology-20140428-zr0vn.html#ixzz49OOhPf7j
Follow us: @smh on Twitter | sydneymorningherald on Facebook

I agree with you entirely. Frantically searching for boxes under the 1000's of feet below the sea within 30 days in 2016 is absolutely ridiculous. The search for the MH370 black boxes every day before the batteries for the signal ran out was infuriating. The technology exists to do away with black boxes they could send video and voice recordings from the cockpit in real time via satelite to the airline HQ along side all the information about the plane. But airlines just haven't been willing to pay the money for it. Change is happening slowly though with regulatory bodies intending to implement it but several years from now.

 

[gregjrichards]

Wth is with people not having their passports checked, in this day and age?! I have NEVER arrived in another country and not been checked out: how the hell does it happen?!

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I don't know if its because airport workers are over worked, poorly paid, have little to no job satisfaction or what it is that is causing some workers not to do their jobs properly but it puts us all in greater danger.

 

[MelmothTheLost]

Wth is with people not having their passports checked, in this day and age?! I have NEVER arrived in another country and not been checked out: how the hell does it happen?!

It depends on where he has flown from. France is part of the Schengen zone, ie a free travel zone which covers much of the EU. If you board a plane in a Schengen country, thereby undergoing security screening at the point of departure, and land in another Schengen country, they don't bother to check your passport at the landing point. In effect the flight is treated as an internal flight.

The UK and Ireland are not part of Schengen, so if you fly in from a Schengen country you still go through passport control.

 

[watcher9]

Egypt deployed a submarine on Sunday to hunt for the black box flight recorders of the EgyptAir plane that crashed in some of the deepest waters of the Mediterranean Sea with 66 people on board, President Abdel Fattah al-Sisi said.
and
Sisi said that underwater equipment from Egypt's offshore oil industry was being brought in to help the search.

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world...air-black-box-recorders/ar-BBtklPa?li=BBnb7Kz

 

[gregjrichards]

"Smiling into the face of her father this is four-and-a-half months-old Joumana – the youngest victim of the Egyptair crash.

Wrapped up warmly in a pink baby-grow the infant can be seen just days before her young life was cruelly snatched away in the air disaster before it had hardly begun.

The baby-girl was the youngest of the 66 passengers and crew to perish when the Egypt air plummeted into the Mediterranean Sea in flames.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...rother-flew-family-holiday.html#ixzz49P6Go0XJ
Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

R.I.P little Joumana 4 months, her brother Mohamed 2 years old, their parents and all the victims. Caution these photos may be upsetting I'm in tears.

 

[jslk]

I hadn't thought about Schengen. 😮

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[gregjrichards]

It depends on where he has flown from. France is part of the Schengen zone, ie a free travel zone which covers much of the EU. If you board a plane in a Schengen country, thereby undergoing security screening at the point of departure, and land in another Schengen country, they don't bother to check your passport at the landing point. In effect the flight is treated as an internal flight.

The UK and Ireland are not part of Schengen, so if you fly in from a Schengen country you still go through passport control.

The guy had flown in from the U.S. Thanks for the information about Schengen.

 

[Jersey*Girl]

Hey everyone, long time no see... :winkkiss:

Not that I think this has anything to do with this downed plane, but I thought this was an interesting coincidence:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...political-vandals-eerily-accurate-threat.html

'We will bring this plane down': The ominous graffiti message scrawled on the underside of doomed EgyptAir plane by political vandals in eerily accurate threat
Aviation workers at Cairo Airport believed to have been behind the threat
Scrawled message was written on doomed jet by group of political vandals
Not militant threat but made as a result of political instability two years ago
EgyptAir has initiated stronger security checks at the airport since attack
By IMOGEN CALDERWOOD FOR MAILONLINE
PUBLISHED: 18:46 EST, 21 May 2016 | UPDATED: 03:30 EST, 22 May 2016

The EgyptAir passenger jet that plunged into the Mediterranean Sea killing all 66 people on board was once attacked by a group of political vandals who scrawled an eerily accurate threat on its underside.

Aviation workers at Cairo Airport were reportedly behind the attack on the plane, which saw the graffiti message 'we will bring this plane down' written on it in Arabic.

Some workers also wrote 'traitor' and 'murderer' in messages directed at Egypt's president Abdel Fattah el-Sisi - a play on the phonetic similarity between the last two letters in the plane's registration SU-GCC and the leader's surname.

The attack, which came two years ago, was not connected to a jihadi threat but rather to the nation's unstable political situation at the time.

According to unnamed officials at Cairo Airport, who revealed the details in an interview with The New York Times, the attack came as a result of unrest after former general el-Sisi ousted the elected president Mohamed Morsi in 2013.

 

[Jersey*Girl]

Don't know if this has been posted yet:

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-36340610

EgyptAir crash: The internet fakes and rumours
20 May 2016 Europe

Ball of fire
As speculation grew over what happened to the EgyptAir flight more incorrect information was being shared.

A video on the website viral-videos.today claimed to show a ball of fire supposedly spotted by witnesses around the time the jet disappeared.

The footage was tweeted by @githii with the post: "SAD.... A woman recorded this ball of fire in the sky, believed to be #EgyptAir #MS804".

It was also picked up and included in a news report by 7 News Sydney, which tweeted: "Residents of Greek Island claim they saw a ball of fire in the sky around the time #MS804 disappeared.@ChrisReason7"

But the fireball was in fact footage recorded last year in California.

The tweet has since been removed from 7 News Sydney's account.

 

[cujenn81]

Hey everyone, long time no see... :winkkiss:

Not that I think this has anything to do with this downed plane, but I thought this was an interesting coincidence:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...political-vandals-eerily-accurate-threat.html

'We will bring this plane down': The ominous graffiti message scrawled on the underside of doomed EgyptAir plane by political vandals in eerily accurate threat
Aviation workers at Cairo Airport believed to have been behind the threat
Scrawled message was written on doomed jet by group of political vandals
Not militant threat but made as a result of political instability two years ago
EgyptAir has initiated stronger security checks at the airport since attack
By IMOGEN CALDERWOOD FOR MAILONLINE
PUBLISHED: 18:46 EST, 21 May 2016 | UPDATED: 03:30 EST, 22 May 2016

Heyyyyyy Jersey*Girl!

 

[Niner]

So - no black boxes yet??

:tyou: in advance!

 

[Jersey*Girl]

Automatic messages about smoke

French aviation officials revealed Saturday that the plane sent automatic messages about smoke in the front of the aircraft just before it crashed.

France's revelation confirmed flight data that CNN obtained from an Egyptian source. That flight data indicated smoke alerts occurred near the cockpit minutes before the crash.

The data came through the Aircraft Communications Addressing and Reporting System, or ACARS, which sends messages between planes and ground facilities. A screen grab of data has time stamps that match the approximate time the aircraft went missing.

There were indications of problems with a heated window in the cockpit, a sliding window in the cockpit, smoke in the lavatory, smoke in the avionics compartment below the cockpit, a fixed window, the autopilot and the flight control system.

The alerts don't necessarily mean a fire occurred on the plane or that the crew even knew about the alerts, which are automatically transmitted, aviation experts cautioned.

There have been electrical problems with window anti-ice heaters in A320s. In 2003, the Federal Aviation Administration required windshields replaced in all A320s in the United States. It's not known whether Egypt followed the FAA directive.