GA GA - Shirley, 87, & Russell Dermond, 88, Putnam County, 2 May 2014 - #11

[dancinunderthemoon]

Seems rediculously cold to do such but in history it was done alot.....Depends on how desperate the person is or maybe a new and rewarding business venture or something was at their fingertips
This scenario makes sense to me.

Still I can't help but wonder if all these 2014 putnam co deaths weren't connected in some way at times may 2 Dermonds, May 8 RE Agent, Aug Judge commits suicide then 2016 Lydia Ivanditti, all were probalby connected and all died of injuries to the neck area and water was involved except the judge dont recall how he died except suicide and LI and D's were connected by the Community church and the Arts Center where the bridge club held meetings that LI was managing

I wish we had more facts........

Very interesting, hockeyguy. I've always thought the motive was inheritance. When you mentioned inheritance being paid early, it reminded me of something I heard a few years ago. There was a wealthy man in town, who had a troubled daughter. He was approaching 90, when his daughter asked him for her inheritance upfront. He declined, and fortunately, for him, she wasn't prone to violence, only addicted to pain meds. As a parent, I can't imagine the feeling of having a child ask for their inheritance early. To me, an inheritance, is something passed down to children, AFTER a parent dies.

IMHO

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

Thats remarkable! 25 years is a very long time! We also have one in GA the tara Grinstead case where a "phone call" was made turning in someone, getting the ball rolling for a conviction

It happens, seems unbelievable that it can when in the midst of it all and seems to be nothing to go on

I have renewed hope this will get solved. In my area they just solved a 25 year old murder/rape case and it was someone who the victim knew .
I

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

She was actually, what was it a few weeks?

But Maybe thats EXACTLY why the body surfaced...........the killers who did everything else right BUT keep her body hidden didnt know about gases the body produces? Yet the reports say her body wasn't meant to be found. However.... She was found in wide, big, open water where people fish often and where there is a boat launch not far away and any boaters would have to travel up river towards her since the dam is just below the launch

Also, the family is doing nothing and haven't even contributed to the reward fund and if they did, it was not more than $1000 because the big donors were named

adult CHildren Left town without attending vigil held by church, left very quietly and discreetly and quickly IMO, same way they arrived

and if you remember, they decided to WAIT TO HOLD DADS FUNERAL UNTIL THEIR MOTHER FOUND, did they expect she was dead as well? I think I"d be so distraught over my fathers death and the details of it that Im not sure i could think so soundly and as if it's a business decision instead of emotional....i thought that odd........did they KNOW she would be found soon?

If she hadn't been found a death certificate could still be obtained, i know it usually takes time, my friends still waiting on her husbands Death cert due to him being missing basically, under the D's circumstances however, would a judge go ahead and produce a death certificate sooner for mom since most abductees aren't discovered so quickly and given Mr D's manner of death, it's likely she is dead too

So maybe that was the reason for the beheading?? Since the family waited to find her to have a funeral in order to have both........maybe a judge would have assumed the same of her fate....seems logical but IDK

Trying to catch up on this case. Been in the process of moving and haven't checked this in several weeks. My only issue with it being a murder to get early inheritance payout is that Mrs D wasn't found right away. Why would they risk the delay in getting money by putting her in the lake? My gut instinct about their adult children doesn't give me a good feeling. If this were my parents or grandparents I would stop at nothing to find the killers

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

haha, oh god, not sure what "I" was thinking, but still I think they'd have left behind an angry mess besides Mr D's

#8- An affair that he had and they didn't want anyone to ever know about

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

No, but I know SS said it was something like a hammer.........I dont know but that's a good point! however, they aren't sure he was "KILLED" in the garage............He wa definitley beheaded in the garage

But like you, IM wondering how he got there or was he taken in there after he was hit or shot outside possibly

If we had alittle more evidence we might know

Gargae is defintley not hidden except for garage door being closed, any cars would have been seen first thing, it's wide open to the street, but they're on a culdesac, less traffic but doenst mean no one ever goes in there

Does anyone remember SS saying something about the murder weapon being something of value from inside the house? I may have dreamed that lol but wanted to ask.
And does anyone know if Mr D had a gun that he may have kept in his car? Just thinking about why he was killed in the garage

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

I had wondered if he heard that during the investigation too Hockyguy....but if those were his own thoughts,........was he referring to religious extremists? Or was he leading the investigation as others have done in the past in blaming a crime on a cult, one they were actually guilty of....scott peterson case

I remember in the beginning Keith Dermond said it was the work of a cult but did SS tell him this or did he just assume? If he just assumed what would make him think it was a cult?

 

[auburnmomof2]

I just had a thought about the garage in regard to why he was there and house was left in pristine condition. If....big IF....it were someone who might gain financially from the sale of the house after their deaths, then maybe the body in the garage would be easier to clean up than if it happened in the house. Or maybe the house would more likely sell if the murder scene was not in the actually living part of the home. Just brainstorming here. Sometimes I feel like this case is like a game of clue, professor plum in the......with the.....

 

[wildebeest]

I just had a thought about the garage in regard to why he was there and house was left in pristine condition. If....big IF....it were someone who might gain financially from the sale of the house after their deaths, then maybe the body in the garage would be easier to clean up than if it happened in the house. Or maybe the house would more likely sell if the murder scene was not in the actually living part of the home. Just brainstorming here. Sometimes I feel like this case is like a game of clue, professor plum in the......with the.....

I like your thinking, here. Makes a lot of sense to me that selling the house might be a little easier if the crime was committed in the garage.

IMHO

:goodpost:

 

[colette]

Shirley was found 10 days later...
Weighed down by a pair of 30-pound concrete blocks, her corpse bloated and surfaced facedown in 46 feet of water. By boat, the spot lies some five miles from her home, in a wide bend above the Wallace Dam.
http://www.macon.com/news/local/crime/article30230859.html

Not everyone knows that a weighted body can come up IMO

 

[watcher9]

Yeah I always thought that was odd too, i got complacent in my thinking and after reading up on some other cases, it's was clear again, this is NOT NORMAL....oh and about the early pay out ...nOW THAT makes sense!!! They got it now.....yes I really think you are on to something.....with this type of murder, I wouldnt be so nonchalant about the investigation of it.........He did say he didnt think the lying woman, whoever she was, had anything to do with it but remermber he said "but I never say never"........SURE DO WISH we knew who she was for certain.....but how many female relatives do the Dermonds have, they're all deceased since the D's were almost 90, no family living around the area. and WHO would be so interrogated......i guess we can speculate who and we have....

I love your enthusiasm in this case. Thank you for keeping the thread going.
Even though I'm more on the fence for an unknown perp, you do throw out a lot of ideas to think about.
On this post, relatives? I can't remember if the obituary for either of them listed any relatives other than their children, like grands and great grands, nieces or nephews?

 

[watcher9]

I had wondered if he heard that during the investigation too Hockyguy....but if those were his own thoughts,........was he referring to religious extremists? Or was he leading the investigation as others have done in the past in blaming a crime on a cult, one they were actually guilty of....scott peterson case

Foxfire contacted SS about the cult theory. He was posted a lot about it. A new thread was made just for the cult discussion and we were not to talk about that on this one. I don't know if anything has changed since back then.

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

Hey, thanks watcher9, i do know of FF theory and the thread.....I guess I was just comparing cases and how cults have been blamed, not blaming the religious extemists just wondering if that's what he might have been pointing too

ANyone heard any more from tax247, he seemed to pop in a few times and disappears for long periods of time.............

Foxfire contacted SS about the cult theory. He was posted a lot about it. A new thread was made just for the cult discussion and we were not to talk about that on this one. I don't know if anything has changed since back then.

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

Wow thank you Watcher9....sometimes I feel like im talking to myself LOL.........but your welcome.
The Dermonds deserve it to be alive and open

I recall something or pondered it I guess, that there was no family around, RD's mom lived with them when they came to ga i found out but his dad mustve passed prior

Surely all their siblings and cousins and inlaws are in NJ or passed on

It's amazing what our thoughts can conjure up, with so little to go on

If we ever find out who, we'll probably all be surprised and then say....you know , in hindsight, yeah i can see that.... haha

I love your enthusiasm in this case. Thank you for keeping the thread going.
Even though I'm more on the fence for an unknown perp, you do throw out a lot of ideas to think about.
On this post, relatives? I can't remember if the obituary for either of them listed any relatives other than their children, like grands and great grands, nieces or nephews?

 

[2Hope4]

The memory of these people needs justice. I hope there's movement soon in this case!

 

[watcher9]

Maybe one reason the family delayed MrD's funeral was they were hoping his head would be found?

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

I dont know, maybe, still not going to have an open casket funeral, Im sure they hoped to have him all there though.....but I recall an article stated they were waiting for their dads funeral until they found her........i guess they could hope she would be able to attend? Even after all she'd been through, on second thought, no, i think they knew she was dead too, for whatever reasons

Maybe one reason the family delayed MrD's funeral was they were hoping his head would be found?

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

Well, I guess the fact that she surfaced and that they even put her in the water seems to suggest they didnt know.............on the other hand, SS said "she wasn't meant to be found" yet she was.....I suppose if they DID know she would surface

oh wait..........sudden clarity............WHY was she in open water?? Wouldnt they have put her in a more hidden area if they didnt want her found? She was in the main river practically....ill have to look that up again but thought the fishermen who found her were passing by..........

Shirley was found 10 days later...
Weighed down by a pair of 30-pound concrete blocks, her corpse bloated and surfaced facedown in 46 feet of water. By boat, the spot lies some five miles from her home, in a wide bend above the Wallace Dam.
http://www.macon.com/news/local/crime/article30230859.html

Not everyone knows that a weighted body can come up IMO

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

I LIKE THAT!!! Watch my next few posts.....

Well, I guess the fact that she surfaced and that they even put her in the water seems to suggest they didnt know.............on the other hand, SS said "she wasn't meant to be found" yet she was.....I suppose if they DID know she would surface

oh wait..........sudden clarity............WHY was she in open water?? Wouldnt they have put her in a more hidden area if they didnt want her found? She was in the main river practically....ill have to look that up again but thought the fishermen who found her were passing by..........

I just had a thought about the garage in regard to why he was there and house was left in pristine condition. If....big IF....it were someone who might gain financially from the sale of the house after their deaths, then maybe the body in the garage would be easier to clean up than if it happened in the house. Or maybe the house would more likely sell if the murder scene was not in the actually living part of the home. Just brainstorming here. Sometimes I feel like this case is like a game of clue, professor plum in the......with the.....

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

Ok, more clarity!! Or revelations....for me anyway! Hit me like a gut punch

I keep asking WHY turn the body after he was beheaded, according to podcast, his left foot was dragged in his own blood by 12 " or a little more.........His head was then pointing easterly if my directions are correct....someone correct me if not please

If it was, this might make investigators think it was a religious sect but the thing that makes it NOT look that way is that she was not left in this position as well

There were towels under his torso preventing the blood from running out the garage door intot he garage

WHY? ..they didnt want him discovered RIGHT AWAY

Mr D was beheaded,something that implies great anger and very personal act

They didnt behead Mrs D or dismember her becuase they didn't have a beef with her, in the killers mind, she had to go and had to be used as a too for their escape

SO..They didnt want Mrs D found RIGHT AWAY either...

WHY didnt they want her found right away? To confuse the investigation, they made escape with that critical 48 hour window of opportunity

she was removed and dumped in the lake with 2 30 lb cinderblocks wrapped in fish netting (i assume this type netting)

WHY? Why was she found in open water? Because they wanted her found but didnt want her found RIGHT AWAY either...remember that 48 hr opportunity

why was she not dismembered? Because they weren't mad at her as it appeared they had great anger with Mr D.

Why was her body not wrapped in plastic or fish netting completely with more weight in a more secluded area? Becuase they knew she would surface in the open water

Why not more than 2 30 lb cinder blocks as she weighed at least 150 lbs....I dont know how that works, just using weight logic and bodies float in the water anyway until the lungs are filled... ....because they wanted her found but NOT RIGHT AWAY

Interestingly she was found right beside a buoy!!! what better way to notice someone, which I think was coincidence but are buoys checked by DNR? if she were under water in a plastic bag, NO ONE would have thought anything of it had it been months or a year later or even noticed it as well in dark water in a cove

then the gases cause the body to rise......but NOT RIGHT AWAY and being in open water a passerby fisherman or LE would easily spot her

The issue of some female family member lying to investigators,

The issue of someone turning off or tampering with or whatever, Dermonds personal home security system in the weeks before the murder, I think it was when daughter was there, I think she said she forgot to set it? Who KNOWS

Maybe That explains the mystery on the inheritance to the heirs if mom wasn't found

Sale date of Dermond home .........5/30/2015 deed and map 837 712

Pay off of Lien ....2016

Lots and lots of activity of family finances online in 2012 and 2016 then one in 2017

There is another interesting fact Hockey guy noticed but not telling and now I see why LE holds back SOME information, i think SS could have shared more but maybe one day we'll know why

On the other hand............SS does not think Family is involved nor does he think his friend Tex McIVer is guilty of malice against his wife, I am not so sure but that's my opinion

However, it appears that if you are an "alleged" upstanding citizen of his community or from family wealth, his "instincts" kick in and with no ryhyme or reasons doesnt think you are guilty, no real evidence, just doesn't think you are but let you be a drug dealer or petty thief, you are going DOWN, murder though, NAH...you have money, you are an upstanding citizen of the communtiy becuase we all know they dont commit crimes.........whatever..........

the majority of murders are committed by a family member

Mom's post said that Dermond was beheaded in the garage to possibly prevent the home sale from being too affected, since Mr D wasn't found inside the home, a little less extreme? No damage to interior. less personal to buyers?

I like that! Especially in conjunction with my most recent thoughts....

 

[dancinunderthemoon]

interesting statement on the Ziegert's case..........thanks for sharing , Hockeyguy

For more than two decades, it seemed the crime would never be solved despite dogged efforts by investigators and a CONCERTED PUSH BY Ziegert's FAMILY TO KEEP THE CASE ALIVE.

we only find in this case, no efforts to even contact local LE on the case, SS even said or was it KD THAT they havent been in contact? HOCKEYGUY, do you remember