General Discussion and Theories #3

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Murphys Law .... good find with the "seat frame" picture , thank you , ..... looks like part of a seat to me with covering and foam padding removed (burned) .... but because it does not have the rest of the seat attached (backrest etc) makes me think it could be the base frame from one of the rear jump seats .... they are often one component and hinged to fold up (no backrest) .... I'm not sure what type of rear seats were in TB's truck .... or even if they were removed by DM ... so just a guess on my part.

Another thing is the "seat frame" shown in your picture is on the field of corn stubble which means it was placed there sometime after fall 2012 harvest .... a farmer would never leave debris or scrap lying in a field like that .... yet strange if DM would leave it in the open like that .... better to just toss it into the woods 10 feet away.

I see Archangel7 replied about the pile of brown steel I beams behind the barn ... that is what they are ..... building framing or structural components .... maybe from the dismantled old Pearson hangar but they look too new to me .... the old hangar was WW2 vintage . I believe old hangar support walls were wood beams (from memory) .... will try to look up interior pics again and try to see if any steel I beams or metal roof trusses.

AM
 
Thank you very much ArchAngel! Your contributions are much appreciated!!
Do you think these materials were brought in by one of the support teams or extracted from the barn?
I'm still baffled...Particularly by the I-beams. That's what caught my attention initially. Would the UCRT have foreseen a need for such materials?
 
swedie said:
ML thanks for the links. I noticed in this video link at 1:35 you can see about five barrels through the open barn door. Maybe they were not hidden at all as someone has repeatedly suggested, but have been sitting in this area all along. It was reported only empty barrels were removed from the barn and I highly doubt they would have moved full ones. Especially when it was not know what chemicals were in them, as that could pose a risk to move them. MOO.

http://london.ctvnews.ca/video?clipId=1002986

Empty barrels will be brought out of the barn, and samples will be taken from full barrels.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/kitch...d-farm-searched-by-opp-haz-mat-team-1.1828554
Click to expand...

Good thoughts as usual Swedie! I always enjoy your thoughtful posts
Re BIB - this footage was taken on the third day of the search. So it's possible they were moved to that visible location over the 3 days. Rightfully, or wrongfully I am one of those theorists that believes (for the time being) that the barrels were hidden - not necessarily in the hay but nevertheless well hidden.
I have read but can't find a link reporting that police had entered the barn albeit for less than 1 hour on at least one of the two previous searches.

Regardless of their original location, and whether they were hidden or in plain sight, IMO, the subsequent care and attention given those barrels was unprecedented - handled with multiple hazmat units, catalogued, photographed etc.
 
Archangel7 said:
The numbered items are apparently leftover/surplus parts from a metal building. In the "old days" all that type metal was painted in a "red lead primer" paint for weather/rust proofing.

The longer items are I beams with factory clips fabricated for angle/knee bracing.(strength/support)
The lighter colored long piece appears to be a galvanized(coated) ladder cage. It surrounds you as you climb so yo can't easily fall away from the ladder.

used-steel-buildings-for-sale-1_zpsa1979b57.jpg


images_zpsb71198c0.jpg
[/URL]

N_ladder_BR1939_copy1_zps47ef7726.jpg
Click to expand...

I'm wondering now if the farmland was purchased only as a dumping ground for Millardair's leftovers building supplies and wastes. With DM saying his father was frugal, I can see this may have been the case, not wanting to part with items he had paid for but not able to use such as the beams. Surely there are regulations at the property in Waterloo where the hangar sits which does not allow for scraps and clutter to be left on the property.

I can also see someone lying to a real estate agent about the real intent of purchasing property, as I assume turning it into disposal land would be greatly frowned upon. No wonder WM was along for the farmland tours. WM had plans for the property and it wasn't for DM's dream house at the time. No fact, JMO.

Maybe one day that may have been an option, but the real reason for the property was left out. Did DM have intentions of building himself a nice little playhouse out there on the farmland to house stolen vehicles but couldn't could not persuade dear old dad into funding it? Did DM believe with dad out of the picture money would start rolling in via inheritance but that day never arrived as WM's case was still under investigation. Stealing vehicles may have been the intended money maker as he could have been getting hard up for money. All JMO.

MsS or someone else familiar with real estate, may you can answer this question. After WM' death, would DM be able to sell property which belonged to his father before his estate was settled? The stumper is the Distillery condo and how he managed to pay for it. I assumed the majority of it was paid off upon initial purchase, balance paid May 7th, and could it be DM and MS purchased it together (money) but it was only put in DM's name as it would have been less obvious who had money and where they got their money? Not many people would question where DM got his money from but I don't recall anything stating MS was employed, so it would be hard for him to explain away where he get his money from to purchase a condo with DM. Just a hunch and MOO.
 
If you look at the video again at 1:55 you can see weeds maybe even a bush growing up between the piles of I beams and the other materials. Must look for a better picture to see if we can see weeds growing round stuff. That grey rectangular box also looks like it is sitting in longish grass. Then again it was reported LE were seen raking and other things around the barn so...

If the I beams were left over from the new hangar construction, I could see them still looking new only a year of so later. JMO.

http://london.ctvnews.ca/video?clipId=1002986
 
Murphys_Law said:
Thank you very much ArchAngel! Your contributions are much appreciated!!
Do you think these materials were brought in by one of the support teams or extracted from the barn?
I'm still baffled...Particularly by the I-beams. That's what caught my attention initially. Would the UCRT have foreseen a need for such materials?
Click to expand...

In my opinion, a HazMat team/unit wouldn't have that on hand, it looks too much like surplus and has specific fabrication traits(like for a designed, engineered, specific structure) as opposed to generic beams for say, train derailment support bracing.

We had support trailers with testing equip., fresh air, zoot suits, adsorbent, booms, offloading hoses, wading pools, tarps, drums, stuff like that.
If any heavy equipment was needed it could be brought in however.
 
swedie said:
If you look at the video again at 1:55 you can see weeds maybe even a bush growing up between the piles of I beams and the other materials. Must look for a better picture to see if we can see weeds growing round stuff. That grey rectangular box also looks like it is sitting in longish grass. Then again it was reported LE were seen raking and other things around the barn so...

If the I beams were left over from the new hangar construction, I could see them still looking new only a year of so later. JMO.

http://london.ctvnews.ca/video?clipId=1002986
Click to expand...

Yes, I do agree there is grass growing between the piles...but the grass is long in all the surrounding area. In which case, they could have been set there recently. Moreover, judging by all the footage from the 3 searches, IMO, the materials first appeared on Monday Sept 9. In which case, I conclude they were taken from the barn on the morning of Sep 9th or they were brought in by one of the LE teams, the latter of which seems increasingly unlikely.
 
Murphys_Law said:
A large pile of materials behind the barn (that seemed to have first appeared on the morning of September 9th) has me baffled. (see thumbnail - closeup).
The objects appear to be new as opposed to used materials, although I can't be certain.

Questions:
1. Did one of the support teams (UCRT perhaps?) bring these objects in support of the search, or were they always present and taken out of the barn on Monday Sep 9th?

2. Can you identify any of the objects?

I have one theory I am working on, but I will withhold those thoughts to avoid biasing the discussion.

Background Information

This CTVNews video clip taken Monday Sep 9th between 8:00am and noon.
http://www.ctvnews.ca/video?clipId=999641
It shows an aerial view of the pile of materials in question. Look in the top right hand corner of the first few seconds of footage.
The provincial UCRT (Urban Chemical Response Team) does not appear to have been on the scene when this specific clip was taped. As far as I know, Toronto police were on the scene first and then later joined by forces from Waterloo and the OPP's UCRT.

There was a lot of activity behind the barn on the third day, even though most news coverage focused on what was happening at the front of the barn: a second blue forensic ID tent was set up behind the barn, the UCRT had parked their 3 trucks behind the barn and close to a dozen forensic officers were busy working behind the scene.

This CTVNews clip of the pile of materials taken on Wednesday Sep 11th after the OPP's UCRT arrived.
See 1:47 secs and beyond. The attached thumbnail below was a frame from this footage.
http://london.ctvnews.ca/video?clipId=1002986


BTW, I discovered a video clip that states that Hamilton police were also assisting ("working in partnership") on the third search:
http://www.theloop.ca/news/ctvnews/...ck-disappearance-Farm-search-enters-third-day around 25 secs.
Click to expand...

Yes I see what you're pointing out ML. This image is from the first search when TB's body was discovered in May. That pile of stuff is not present. Could someone be doing clean up then at Millardair? If that is the case, looks like there is no plans to sell the farmland for some time being as it's being treated as a disposal storage site. I tried to find pictures of Millard from the outside to see if there was a pile of I beams on the property but no luck yet. Unless of course they were inside. Maybe getting Millardair ready to put it on the market for sale? Or as you suggested, they came from within the barn. Interesting and great catch.

https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/...o-BQOJ3BtVlshMb5580eP9uSxfBNjJf5ylTrMlUOo6VkV
 
JMO..and it was probably mentioned....I feel those barrels were crucial....and maybe that fuel to cause the fire...it is my guess the inciderator did not work as several feel >>>and PANIC hit...OMG we have a body that we must get rid of...my opinion ..>>>quickest way is to BURN evidence..I am guessing that TB was killed in his TRUCK...and than put in the barrel and burned.

I think they went back to the farm from the evidence they found led them back..forensic evidence told them more details...On first search they did not have that info....Le did not know the story YET...forensic filled in more clues...JMO robynhood
 
(SNIPPED FOR SPACE)

Murphys_Law said:
.
I have read but can't find a link reporting that police had entered the barn albeit for less than 1 hour on at least one of the two previous searches.

Regardless of their original location, and whether they were hidden or in plain sight, IMO, the subsequent care and attention given those barrels was unprecedented - handled with multiple hazmat units, catalogued, photographed etc.
Click to expand...

(BBM)
Yes I recall one report specifically said 20 minutes.
Great sleuthing ML!
 
swedie said:
Yes, or one of these Eldee. :seeya: Second link you can see DM's tattoo on his wrist but cannot make out the word "ambition".

https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/...uYnSqROm10ZEVP_hnHOgkF-hUl5wb4F-oIkC-fmkSMuFR

http://storage.canoe.ca/v1/dynamic_...97416850973_ORIGINAL.jpg?quality=80&size=650x

http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Crime/2013/05/28/millard248.jpg
Click to expand...

I am pretty sure these three pictures plus Eldee's photo depict DM with one and the same canvas army surplus bag. Soldiers and many travellers use them as day packs. I've seen bikers and cyclists wear them as well. They're pretty rugged so they aren't typically referred to as 'man-purses'.

In any event, I am not sure that it would stay intact if burned.
 
sillybilly said:
Sheesh, I can't remember what I had for supper last nite, but I recall 25 minutes from a crime journal, LOL:

from:
https://twitter.com/justinatthespec/status/334333258399625216/photo/1
Click to expand...

Oh I posted that info. It was in a tweet. Here's the link. HTH.

Justin Robertson @justinatthespec
A police officer has been searching in the barn for 25 minutes. There are still police on horses on the property.
11:43 AM - 14 May 2013

And a couple other tweets from JR I thought interesting also. So yes LE were cutting weeds and according to JR the bush is visible from the neighbour's yard. Pictures also.

Conditions are foggy. Police are cutting a section of grass near the barn using a weed wacker. 1:41 PM - 28 May 2013

No-one is home next door, but the property where Bosma's body could be is visible.The helicopter is still circling.
12:05 PM - 14 May 2013
 
For what its worth , the Old Hangar was wood frame & wood rafters , so the steel I-beams are from something else .... they are worth $thousands to buy so maybe DM saved them for a future work shop or big garage.
 

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Murphys_Law said:
Yes, I do agree there is grass growing between the piles...but the grass is long in all the surrounding area. In which case, they could have been set there recently. Moreover, judging by all the footage from the 3 searches, IMO, the materials first appeared on Monday Sept 9. In which case, I conclude they were taken from the barn on the morning of Sep 9th or they were brought in by one of the LE teams, the latter of which seems increasingly unlikely.
Click to expand...


Check out this video at 36 seconds where it shows LE walking to the property behind the barn. There you can see those beams or whatever they are piled up. Maybe this view is more telling. HTH and MOO.

Also at 2:00 the reporter SU said whatever is clear however, is that "It’s clear however, that they did find something significant, which somehow had been overlooked, more than three months ago."

So does that mean they did search the barn back then but overlooked evidence they didn't believe was connected to TB or they didn't search the barn and this time found something relevant to TB's murder? :moo:

http://www.chch.com/police-searching-millard-farm/
 
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