George Zimmerman /Trayvon Martin General Discussion #14 Friday July 12

[DEPUTYDAWG]

It was also raining that night. A little blood can look a lot more serious when water gets in the mix. The bleeding doesn't look that severe to me, and is very likely watered down from the rain.

It's not the blood that bothers me as much as the knot on the side of the nose, to be honest. I know noses can bleed like a dickens for very little reason in some people. It's the swelling that is bothersome to me. Maybe just me, LOL

 

[georgiagirl]

I do respect everyone's opinion, as we all have our own rationale for reaching the conclusion that we have. One thing to note though, IMO, some seem to believe that the evidence supports GZ's account(s) of the events that day, so this presents as a clear cut case of self defense.

IMO, if that is really the case, GZ would have opted for trial by judge. Would that not have been a safer bet - a judge using the law, not emotion to determine guilt or lack of? The fact that GZ did choose a jury trial may be that the defense team was worried about George's credibility, even with a jurist alone deciding.

And you never know what a jury will do. Interesting.:twocents:

Considering how obviously bias this judge has behaved ...I thank God he didn't go that route!

 

[Kimberlyd125]

As I said earlier, it is my contention that is what happened.
I'm not interested in "most" opinions based on the eye witness who saw no " "punching" and lack of forensic evidence. You say the evidence melted away, even under his nails. I say it was never there.

TM didn't punch GZ in my opinion and I have credible reasons for believing that and would like to feel free here to discuss it.

You are certainly free to discuss what you wish.
As am I.

I find it odd that this is even an issue because, like I said, the state would have brought that up if any of their witnesses (expert or otherwise) would have thought this was even a remote possibility.

Instead, they seemed to agree, that TM punched GZ in the nose.

I find that very telling.

JMO

 

[reedus23]

It's the best explanation for his injuries, consistent with his injuries, forensics and testimony. Did I mention I thought the prosecution never wanted to prosecute for political reasons?.....

Scary to me that if found NG, GZ will continue to use this defense to kill someone else having virtually been forgiven of every violent criminal charge ever levied against him. He will always claim fear of young black youth out to kill him based on this trial...unexcusable. IMO.

And will give every person that mouths of in a bar, asking to get hit and in fact does get hit, the excuse to kill that person too. Pick a fight knowing in the back of your head that if you get your beat you can just shoot the person dead.

 

[missmazzy]

Who testified they saw TM was punching GZ?

Please read the transcripts if the trial. It was testified to. I'm not going over and over this. It's in the record. I don't mean to sound b****y, but I don't want to have this discussion again. Let the jury decide.

 

[Hopeful One]

Here's the video to see how baggy the pants are: Surveillance Video Shows Trayvon Martin At 7-Eleven On Night Of Shooting - YouTube

While certainly not as big as some I've seen it is obvious they are baggy and hanging. At :02 you get the first view of him reaching in his pocket for change and it goes nearly to his knee. At 1:02 you see him pull them back up and realize just how far they were down. You can keep watching and see it from other viewpoints. You can also look at the ankles to see how they are first sagged way down around the ankles which straightens out when he pulls them up at first.

What do saggy pants have to do with this case? :waitasec:

 

[Sweet Fox]

I hope the jury comes back with a fast no guilty verdict. A fast verdict usually favors the Defense.

Justice for Zimm

 

[JeannaT]

And will give every person that mouths of in a bar, asking to get hit and in fact does get hit, the excuse to kill that person too. Pick a fight knowing in the back of your head that if you get your beat you can just shoot the person dead.

that's why you can't bring guns into a place where alcohol is served.

iMHO

 

[Inobu]

BBM

She was not credible, because her account was not consistent to a truthful narrative. First, she failed to call TM back over the next two days when she was so concerned for him and he was supposedly in fear according to her testimony. She acted like a mind reader of TM's fighting propensity, like when she would know how serious he would fight or when he would fight, as one example. In addition, her testimony was created with the assistance of Mr. Crump weeks after the incident, when it could be contaminated by outside knowledge of the case. It would have been much more credible if she had been contacted by the LE before many facts of the case were public knowledge. It is impossible not to question the accuracy and veracity of her testimony considering how long after the fact it came, even if she had valid (in her mind) reasons not to contact LE immediately.

IMO

What would you consider truthful narrative? GZ narrative?

Once again the usage of words in the streets is very descriptive.

For example:
An imminent fight - I gonna have to beat this ni**a down.
A Known Fight with anger - I gonna kick dis MF @ss.
Fight with extreme anger - I gonna stomp the MF

A few words spoken in the street tells a lot.

I'm gonna cap him. - That means the guy has a gun with the intent on shooting.

Many American are not familiar with foreign languages. Some languages describes situations with one word and makes it very difficult to interpret.

With that said.

TM comments did not speak to a serious situation.
Although RJ held up on the stand she was on the verge of breaking down. She felt as if she abandon TM as she blew the event off and now she feels guilty.

Look at it from her side. You walk to the store for a drink and candy. Who would think that someone would die. As far as she would be concerned. TM was walking around a gated community where it was safe.

 

[Kimberlyd125]

I have had blows to me, this man IMO in no way had blows.

I (and the expert witnesses we heard from at the trial) disagree with you.
To each their own.

JMO

 

[MeeBee]

This question is a little tangential, but does it bother any female supporters of GZ that he sexually molested his relative and that he once picked up and threw a drunken woman, resulting in a broken ankle? Or that his ex-fiance reported him for domestic violence? Sure he did the same to her, he knows his laws! He also worked as a bouncer for illegal parties, and had a fight with LE about his friend serving alcohol to minors. I still go with the evidence, but I think GZ is *NOT* a law-abiding gentleman, IMO.

To me, that GZ was just a standup guy who helped children and never hurt anyone and was just trying to help his neighbors that night and GOD BLESS HIM! I would love to have a neighbor like GZ is just as much a hyperbole as TM was an innocent little kid with nothing but skittles and tea that night. You can be on one side or that other but come on...it's a little eyeroll inducing.

 

[RR0004]

If the feds decided to go that route it would take some very high up influencer to push them.

I don't see it happening. A whole lot of people already think Zimmerman was railroaded and this whole trial was a sham. If the feds drummed up more charges for another trial many folks will become utterly furious.

IMO.

I don't think the Feds would need to drum up any charge. When you speak of folks thinking that GZ was railroaded...are you talking Federal attorneys? Overall, I've seen very little media coverage of the case...just an occassional segment on HLN (which really isn't my idea of "news") and what I read here. So not sure if there was talk about TM's civil rights being violated. TIA

 

[Colt46]

Ah, I kinda agree with every thing you wrote...but wasn't the SYG defense tossed?

I wasn't aware of that. Isn't the entire case based on self-defense and GZ's imminent fear of losing his life. Or is it only 'self-defense'? I'm confused.

 

[RR0004]

Way to misread the point, IMO. I work full time, I go to school and I still go to protests. I've never been paid to protest. No one I know has been paid to protest. Every activist I know either works fulltime or part time if they are a student. I'm not defending the RCP because I don't like them but they certainly have a right to be there and I think they are there because they believe Zimmerman is guilty.

JMO

Thanks!

 

[defense101]

Here's the video to see how baggy the pants are: Surveillance Video Shows Trayvon Martin At 7-Eleven On Night Of Shooting - YouTube

While certainly not as big as some I've seen it is obvious they are baggy and hanging. At :02 you get the first view of him reaching in his pocket for change and it goes nearly to his knee. At 1:02 you see him pull them back up and realize just how far they were down. You can keep watching and see it from other viewpoints. You can also look at the ankles to see how they are first sagged way down around the ankles which straightens out when he pulls them up at first.

OMG we have just been in Cocoa FL renovating rental homes in areas where real estate agents told us not to buy and would go to the corner store and have coffee, virtually every male that came into that store black or white had their pants around the butt, do I like it no, and my 5'3" british husband would tell them to pull up their pants lol what does his baggy pants prove?

 

[gramcracker]

IMOO I think what he was referring to (and I've seen it many times so I understand why he describes it as skipping) is when these teens try to walk/jog a little fast but their pants are too baggy and hanging around their hips. They can't full out run and they grab their pants in the front and the movement they make does kind of look like what I would describe as a skipping motion, not like children playing skip to my lou though.

JMOO

I don't know if there's a link to it. I've actually seen what I believe he's talking about. I can see it in my head but it's difficult to describe. The closest thing you may have seen is how college basketball players sometimes "skip" back down the court after a basket is made.

There are videos on youtube that refer to it as the crip skip, but they're exaggerated versions of the actual movement. I'll see if I can find a good example.

jmo

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IR6m4Ion5SE"]OG Crip Walk - YouTube[/ame]

IMO, someone not "in the know" could describe this as skipping (for lack of a better term)

 

[Maryann123]

What really floors me, is MSM showing protesters and commenting on them. If anybody is injured it will be on their heads. Snipping the 911 call to make it look racist, and claiming GZ used a racial slur that he never said. They stirred it up, the lied about what was said, and they have kept it going and going. A lot of people have no idea they retracted their story, and axed a few people just to make it look good on their part. Too late....the damage was done, and it's never been repaired. Selling their souls to the devil for ratings.

 

[Duni_girl]

Then how did TM get GZ's gun to shoot himself?
IMO

There were four minutes in between where we dont know exactly what happened. Maybe TM came back to start an altercation with GZ, maybe GZ continue walking. The burden was on the State to prove it, and they did not. The duty of the jury is to reach a verdict beyond a reasonable doubt. There is reasonable doubt there. I dont think anyone is suggestion TM shoot himself, what we can reasonably conclude from the evidence presented at trial is that there was an altercation between the two in the last couple of minutes before the gun was fired and that TM was on top of GZ beating him.

 

[mom23gr8kids]

What do saggy pants have to do with this case? :waitasec:

If you've been following this thread there was a discussion about the "skipping/running" movement George described and it was discussed that many teens with the big baggy pants run in a more skipping type style do to their large pants.

 

[reedus23]

that's why you can't bring guns into a place where alcohol is served.

iMHO

The bar fight analogy was just figurative. It could be at Sunday service.