Gilgo Beach LISK Serial Killer, Rex Heuermann, charged with 6 murders, July 2023 #12

[dotr]

In other words, there were multiple DNA samples on the women. Wonder if JB's was the only one on both? Or did Spota just jump on it when JB's brother Timothy's DNA appeared as a familial match with one of the DNAs?

Ugh, wondering if in RH's hands, there was cross- contamination between each of the victim's remains? imo, speculation.

 

[Just K]

I think he first dumped them at Manorville area because he was worried about getting caught. Once he realized he was getting away with it, he began dropping them at Gilgo Beach, where he could look across the bay and see where they were. I think he liked that, kind of like a souvenir. Some SK's like to take photos, make drawings, re-visit dump sites so they can relive the sexual thrill of the murders. BTK did it. He re-enacted some things, kept personal possessions of his victims, etc. Ted Bundy used to re-visit the dump sites of some of his victims and "have sex". He talked about it before he died. Like BTK, confessing the details was another way to relive it.

Some also speculated that Rex could revisit his Gilgo Beach dump sites by pretending to be duck hunting, taking his boat over there.

Well, we can safely guess, he re-visited the GB4 site at least three times. Unless, as a long shot, he stored all of them elsewhere before taking them all to Gilgo.

 

[Izzylizzy]

Just a reminder.

"At the time of the death of Ms. Taylor, Ms. Ellerup was, once again, not in the jurisdiction. As we have previously stated, if Mr. Heuermann committed these homicides, he was living a double life that Ms. Ellerup was unaware of."

The attorney noted that his client still maintains Heuermann "is not capable of committing these heinous acts."

bail application in link

Accused Gilgo killer indicted in murders of 2 more women, including previously unknown victim

The New York City architect arrested last year in connection with a string of cold case bodies found on Long Island’s Gilgo Beach has been charged with murder in the deaths of two more victims, including one whose name hadn’t been publicly associated with the investigation prior to Thursday...

www.nbcnewyork.com

 

[Just K]

I think your right, but I think there is a third dump site somewhere, I just hope LE does more searches

Based on the many body dumps, both young men and women, along the Southern State Parkway, others left near a few LIE exit ramps, those found in abandoned and condemned buildings near where JT and Sugar Bear (Andre Jamal Issac) lived and a few found in LI State Parks, he could have upwards to half a dozen or more dump sites. IMO.

 

[Inthedetails]

'Additional Information'​

The New York State DNA Databank was established by law in 1994 and began operating in 1996. At that time, only offenders convicted of certain offenses were required to provide DNA samples.

The list of crimes that require a DNA sample upon conviction has been expanded five times, most recently in 2012. In addition to requiring DNA samples upon conviction for felony offenses and all Penal Law misdemeanors, the 2012 law expanded a criminal defendant’s access to pre- and post-conviction DNA testing in certain circumstances.

In addition, state regulations permit the release of partial DNA matches that meet certain criteria to law enforcement agencies for investigative purposes and allow law enforcement agencies to request a familial search of the DNA Databank in connection with unsolved, serious crimes. Information in the Databank is protected by state law and by comprehensive internal procedures. The intentional disclosure of a DNA record to an unauthorized person or agency or the intentional use or receipt of DNA records for an unauthorized purpose is a felony.

NYS DNA Databank and Combined DNA Index System (CODIS) - NY DCJS

Research the Databank law and qualifying Offenses. DNA Databank Statistics updated frequently. Learn how the DNA Databank came to be and how it is organized.

www.criminaljustice.ny.gov

Thanks for the info!

 

[Mountain_Kat]

I always wondered what the source of Bittrolff's DNA was, so thank you to whomever posted the article that stated it was seminal.

So...let's assume, for the sake of argument , that John Bittrolff isn't responsible for the murders of Tangredi and McNamee, and that he did merely engage their services. The simplest break down of that would be that he just happened to have intercourse with 2 different victims, on 2 different occasions, who also just happened to have had their services engaged by Rex Heuermann. And this was in the early 90's...way before the internet took off. I suppose it's not impossible that, back in the day, RH and JB both trolled the same areas known for prostitution, but it seems a stretch that they both just happened to choose the exact same victims on 2 different occasions.

JMO

 

[Just K]

Would he have taken the pictures, transferred them to web sites of his choosing, then destroy the pictures after?

That seems highly likely, to me.

 

[SkylarSid]

Perhaps I am overestimating the police's abilities, but don't they have people for cybercrimes? I guess it would be like finding a specific grain of sand at the beach, though .. .

They have teams working in cybercrimes and they work on tracing IP addresses though, though there are some ways to hide them. Seems he would have gotten caught much quicker if he was sharing images!

 

[Mountain_Kat]

That seems highly likely, to me.

Why is that, JK ?

 

[SkylarSid]

Would push pins actually support the weight of drop clothes?? Looking online: Push pin holds up to 1 lb.
Looking... Trimaco SuperTuff Canvas drop cloths are available in four weights – 6oz, 8oz, 10oz and 12oz.

Okay, so that's looking like a yes, but I'm sort of picturing this, and those cloths would have to create a huge drape if what's being considered here actually occurred (which it looks to me like it may have, too).

He says sound travels, mentions bird outside. He says to control the amount of air in and out to control the noise made. ?? Where would he be able to control amount of air in and out?? In and out of what? That sounds like a bunker atmosphere from Doomsday Preppers. If you're talking about a house, you'd say close windows, not control air flow. That sounds like some makeshift, specialized structure.

He says get sleep before hunt. Makes me wonder if he IS literally talking about a spot out in the woods.
Notes "Spur of the moment," "Cover?" "Stockholm Syndrome" Okay, without seeing it in full context, I thought AE for Stockholm, but if he needs "cover," he's been caught on the "spur of the moment," I would think? So how would "Stockholm Syndrome" give him cover?? Like one of the victims if he's holding her captive is going to "cover" for RH, nooo way. But if caught, when the victim starts telling LE about RH, he'd implicate someone else, maybe? And claim victim has Stockholm Syndrome and victim feels sorry for the someone else, and is trying to pin it on (somehow) innocent RH. Which would be the creepiest version of "Some Other Dude" ever created. Maybe this is why he gets so much info on his targets, so he can find someone to blame. Or maybe he already has someone himself he knows he can blame. It's a stretch, I have no idea what to make of this "Cover?" "Stockholm Syndrome." But it would seem like there's a "him" behind it all to blame, "some other" abusive "him."

I know it's crazy, but the whole thing is deranged.

I think controlling the air meant something around throat of victim. Just enough air to sustain life, but tight enough to prevent screaming. If he controlled air in a room that would affect him too. Remember, according to his checklist, he needed more sleep so he could play more. If he reduced his own air, he would be drowsy.

 

[NicMed329]

And yet, apparently Bittrolff did:
"
At the 2017 trial, Bittrolff's lawyer conceded it was possible his client had sex with the two women but said that didn't mean he killed them. Multiple sperm samples were found on the two women.

Prosecutors relied on the testimony of Suffolk County Medical Examiner Dr. Michael Caplan, who said he analyzed the density of the sperm to conclude Bittrolff had sex with them shortly before their deaths.

Defense lawyers did not call an expert to rebut that. But in an appeal motion, they cited DNA analyst and molecular biologist Dr. Karl Reich, who described sperm density analysis as 'pure junk science.'"

New charges for alleged Gilgo Beach serial killer cast scrutiny on another man's murder conviction

New charges brought against the man accused of a string of killings on New York's Long Island are raising questions about another man’s murder conviction

abcnews.go.com

In other words, there were multiple DNA samples on the women. Wonder if JB's was the only one on both? Or did Spota just jump on it when JB's brother Timothy's DNA appeared as a familial match with one of the DNAs?

Yes of course. I was speaking of Rex. I go back and forth if he does or not.

 

[NicMed329]

Then why 'WASH BODY INSIDE AND ALL CAVITIES '?

MOO

Very true. I go back and forth. Probably both intercourse and sex substitution. MOO

 

[NicMed329]

From LI too and I agree. One nice or soothing fact though I learned about the Oak Beach area if you visit during the early Fall, like in September, you can watch and listen to a bunch of baby seals and their parents while reflecting on the rocks. They are also hoping to place a memorial dedicated to all those found on Ocean Parkway too for the families and those who want to pay their respects or remember.

And he was spot on in the Killing Season, IMO. It is really weird how the timelines and geographic locations overlap between Rifkin (1989-1993), Bittrolff (1993) and RH. Tragically, not all of Rifkins victims have been identified or had their names restored to them yet.

There was also another predator, Robert Shulman, who unfortunately robbed three women of their lives in his home Hicksville between 1994-1995. I only just learned about him. It all is probably just a coincidence but still it stood out to me when you mentioned the Killing Season.

Another for you:

Richard Angelo (1987)

The police corruption alone on Long Island could scare you with that alone.

 

[Just K]

I'm not convinced they are both serial killers. What I do know is that there were 3 woman murdered and posed in exactly the same fashion and that Bittrolff was convicted in the murder of 2 of those women and Heuerman is charged with the murder of the 3rd woman.

Oh, and I also know that both men were hunters and both had professions in the field of construction.

Curious coincidences if you ask me. But what do I know ?

I’ve alluded to this a few times but I’ll be more specific. Maybe RH stalked clients of the escorts and SWs as well as his intended and ultimate victims. This suspect seems to have been motivated by torture. I have no problem envisioning him following behind particular clients and killing their regular providers. Knowing that the last client might have left DNA and other evidence on RH’s targets might have given him cover if the victims were to be discovered. He also might have gotten sick pleasure from knowing that the other person/client would become a suspect.

 

[NicMed329]

I've said it before and am thinking it again, with all of RHs planning, preparing, fantasizing, scoping, meeting, and doing, I don't know how he had any time left over for any kind of living at all, or being present in any way, shape or form. It's difficult to comprehend. I've wondered about his work computers / devices too! LE hasn't mentioned anything found specifically from his work, but who knows! I get the impression he was constantly on the hunt of some kind. MOO.

I think it’s not unusual for people of Long Island who commute back and forth to manhattan to have less time with families friends or social things. It’s kind of a weird Long Island cultural thing here. Long nights at the office isn’t that unusual and offers up a great excuse for being away or distracted from family ( easy to skip out on family trips). NYC is very fast paced mentality and very individualistic at times of work work work. I could see him leaning on his career as a front to continue to stalk prey and kill. MOO

 

[NicMed329]

I always wondered what the source of Bittrolff's DNA was, so thank you to whomever posted the article that stated it was seminal.

So...let's assume, for the sake of argument , that John Bittrolff isn't responsible for the murders of Tangredi and McNamee, and that he did merely engage their services. The simplest break down of that would be that he just happened to have intercourse with 2 different victims, on 2 different occasions, who also just happened to have had their services engaged by Rex Heuermann. And this was in the early 90's...way before the internet took off. I suppose it's not impossible that, back in the day, RH and JB both trolled the same areas known for prostitution, but it seems a stretch that they both just happened to choose the exact same victims on 2 different occasions.

JMO

I still believe personally that there were oak beach sex parties. Some kind of sick snuff p orn trafficking club or something. But that is also moo and my mind running away with me.

 

[Vaderman]

I'm pretty sure they still made polaroid instant cameras into the 2000's.

They absolutely did. I got one as a birthday gift around that time and remember buying the film refills at Walmart.

I may be in the minority here, but I don't think he was sharing any possible pictures with anyone else. That seems like something he would want to keep for himself.

 

[jessr927]

I still believe personally that there were oak beach sex parties. Some kind of sick snuff p orn trafficking club or something. But that is also moo and my mind running away with me.

I agree with you and I believe that's how Shannan was killed. But I don't think RH had any involvement with parties or Oak Beach.

 

[Vaderman]

So, basically, the adult kids' attorney is suggesting that because this blueprint is "too neat", then it was planted by LE??? Unbelievable! MOO.

Playing Devil's Advocate here, but hasn't the investigation into the murders been marred by police misconduct and interference? Would it be a stretch of the imagination that it was still going on?

 

[NicMed329]

They absolutely did. I got one as a birthday gift around that time and remember buying the film refills at Walmart.

I may be in the minority here, but I don't think he was sharing any possible pictures with anyone else. That seems like something he would want to keep for himself.

They are still made , I have 2 of them.