IA IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, & Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #26

[kellbabs]

I don't remember this one. Does the RSO have a page on an Iowa offenders site that you can share?
EDT: Also, what was the address of River Forest Road address of RSO and Meth bust?

Yes, I'll post the links on here if that is ok??

 

[MNDad]

I don't remember this one. Does the RSO have a page on an Iowa offenders site that you can share?
EDT: Also, what was the address of River Forest Road address of RSO and Meth bust?

Wow. Google is fast. I posted the above and then immediately decided to look for the address myself. The post I just posted was already indexed by Google.

I found the address, but still would like to know the RSO you were thinking about.

http://wcfcourier.com/news/local/up...cle_df669052-7359-11e0-918a-001cc4c03286.html

 

[MNDad]

Yes, I'll post the links on here if that is ok??

I'm not a moderator, so I can't give definitive permission, but I have seen other RSO links here, so I assume it is ok.

 

[GrainneDhu]

I find it odd, though, that the reward is offered for info only leading to an arrest - usually rewards are offered for information leading to the arrest and conviction of a perp.

You're right, I doubt any arrest would be made without solid evidence, so the reward question probably isn't relevant in this case.

Makes me wonder if someone in LE thinks that the perp may be likely to suicide if arrested.

 

[georger]

Been trying to keep up on this case and cannot believe how little there is to go off of! The one thing I keep thinking about, and hopefully someone can tell me what the general consensus is on it, is the RSO who lived on River Forest Rd at the time of the abduction who seemed to suddenly up & move on July 25th. Also noticed that there was a meth lab bust in the same apartment building around May 2011. Seems very odd to me. If this was a place the girls had been taken to maybe they felt comfortable with other tenants? If they rode bikes past this address they may have chatted with him? Has this been discussed yet? I've tried to go back thru all the threads but wow there is so much info! I did see where someone brought up the RSO, but that was before I realized he moved to St. Olaf, IA.

Thats what bothers me about this case - there isnt one twig out of place.
Not one scuff mark on sidewalk, pavement, or grass to indicate something
out of order, much less 'something' (anything!) happening. Another
pleasant day in the neighborhood. How do you go from that to 2 bodies at
7-Bridges? Unless the girls got on the bus voluntarily.

 

[carbuff]

I believe that TG sincerely saw what he says he saw, and is being honest about it, but I wonder if the bikes he saw belonged to the people who were fishing and not to the girls at all?

 

[iamnotagolem]

SS says he saw two people fishing at the lake after he swerved around the bikes. Is it possible those bikes were there bikes? I believe Lyric was riding a mountain bike, I can't remember what Elizabeth was riding. But maybe TG didn't see the girls bikes and that is why police have never used that time.

SS said upthread that LE never confirmed if the bikes matched the description of the girls bikes.

 

[GrainneDhu]

If LE could tell from that surveillance video that it was Elizabeth and Lyric on bicycles then they must have seen better visual of it then what has been posted in the media. I've never been convinced that anyone saw the two girls that day anywhere. There's too many inconsistencies and too many time lines that don't add up. There's lots of people that were questioned about their where-abouts that day and their stories don't even add up, so how can they remember where anybody else was or what they were doing or what they were supposed to be doing?!

O/T...My grandma taught my four brothers and I many important lessons while growing up, but one thing that has always proved to be valuable is....if you tell the truth ALL the time, then you don't have to remember which story and/or which person you told what to because the truth doesn't change!

However, it is absolutely normal for eyewitnesses to the same event to have differences, sometimes significant ones, in what they report.

Research shows that we are not like VCRs, we don't record every detail of every event we experience. To save on processing and memory space, we fill in a lot of the details of any event from our database of general knowledge. For instance, in describing a speeding car, people don't usually recall that particular car's wheels going around, they usually fill in that detail from their general knowledge that a speeding car has wheels that are rolling. Most of the time, we're not even aware we're filling in details that way.

Research also shows that memory degrades over time to a significant degree. There's also an interesting effect where a witness who is somewhat certain of their recall at the time they are first interviewed tends to become more certain of their own recall as time goes on, even though their actual memory is degrading.

 

[kellbabs]

Wow. Google is fast. I posted the above and then immediately decided to look for the address myself. The post I just posted was already indexed by Google.

I found the address, but still would like to know the RSO you were thinking about.

http://wcfcourier.com/news/local/up...cle_df669052-7359-11e0-918a-001cc4c03286.html

Yes that is the article! (RSO #107020) And there is another article I found and the RSO actually commented on the article if you scroll down.. it is posted from his Facebook acct as well. You can see he is into hunting and biking if you look around. Let me get the link:

http://www.kcrg.com/news/local/Five-Arrested-In-Black-Hawk-County-For-Making-Meth-121024924.html

 

[SapphireSteel]

However, it is absolutely normal for eyewitnesses to the same event to have differences, sometimes significant ones, in what they report.

Research shows that we are not like VCRs, we don't record every detail of every event we experience. To save on processing and memory space, we fill in a lot of the details of any event from our database of general knowledge. For instance, in describing a speeding car, people don't usually recall that particular car's wheels going around, they usually fill in that detail from their general knowledge that a speeding car has wheels that are rolling. Most of the time, we're not even aware we're filling in details that way.

Research also shows that memory degrades over time to a significant degree. There's also an interesting effect where a witness who is somewhat certain of their recall at the time they are first interviewed tends to become more certain of their own recall as time goes on, even though their actual memory is degrading.

That's all true, but the events of a day that is remarkable tend to stay in the memory.

The entire town knew the girls were missing by 5pm the same evening.

Everyone in that town will be able to tell you what they were doing when they heard.

In TG's case, he reported what he saw almost straight away. His memory did not have time to rewrite or lose detail.

ETA: I would guess he feels very strongly about being doubted, as he has taken the time and trouble to get verified to post on here.

 

[kellbabs]

Thats what bothers me about this case - there isnt one twig out of place.
Not one scuff mark on sidewalk, pavement, or grass to indicate something
out of order, much less 'something' (anything!) happening. Another
pleasant day in the neighborhood. How do you go from that to 2 bodies at
7-Bridges? Unless the girls got on the bus voluntarily.

That's my thought as well. There shoukd be SOME sort of "scuff" like you put it! But, if te girls were familiar with the perp/perps then that would explain why no signs of struggle. I believe the bikes were placed there to lure LE away as well, and that is why they were almost delicately placed with the other items gently tossed, because they were sneaking and rushing to dump the items. But, my gut says it was someone familiar with the girls at least... and the plan was already in place... maybe it was just pulled off even better than they could have hoped it would be. It just seems like the perfect crime at this point, unless there are several details that are being withheld for obvious reasons... its a shame because those details might break this wide open if they were shared? Someone somewhere knows something... they just might need something that would trigger a memory. Praying it's solved fast before the next child

 

[superbee]

Someone would have heard a truck - SierraShelby would have, I'm sure.

Or someone would have seen it parked down there I believe. Or noticed one on the side of the road, or just flat out where it shouldn't be.

This was so silent it ruled out any noisy abduction vehicles from the get-go...my opinion only of course.

Noise echoes around bodies of water.

:cow:

ETA: this just got me to thinking.

Every truck and van I've seen around here has a reversing alarm.

If a truck/van was used, it must've gone in one end and out the other...no reversing. Someone would have heard it most likely, especially if it was a company van. It suggests a driveby snatch NOT a "waiting in the bushes" snatch.

Alternatively, a car was used...this suggests either more than one perp, or the girls jumped in voluntarily.

I don't know about the pickup trucks and family vans around Iowa, but here our pickup trucks and family vans do not have an alarm that goes off when put into reverse gear. New as well as old.

 

[superbee]

I've never seen a cell phone that doesn't have a clock. Even the early models had a clock. We know that Elizabeth could make 911 calls with her phone, so she could also have checked the time.

If one can call 911 and has a working clock on their cell phone, would the phone not ping from nearby towers?

 

[keyleigh]

It's possible that it may not have been too difficult for the perp/perps to subdue the 2 girls if he/she/they were someone the girls were familiar with. Maybe it's possible more than one vehicle was used which would allow one perp to take girls and the other perp to stage/dispose of the bicycles. My gut feeling from the beginning about the bicycles being at Meyers Lake has been that the ONLY reason they were put there was to deter/delay the search for the girls elsewhere, and it obviously worked. JMO

That's the scenario I've been thinking about. Two perps. One takes the girls, the other stages the bikes and meets up with perp 1 after.

I hate to even write it, but the way the bodies were found apart from each other, they could have been meant for an individual each.

 

[GrainneDhu]

I don't know about the pickup trucks and family vans around Iowa, but here our pickup trucks and family vans do not have an alarm that goes off when put into reverse gear. New as well as old.

I have a full sized van, a model which is often used as a company van by various businesses. My van does not beep when in reverse gear. All my neighbours have pickup trucks and I've never heard any of them beep in reverse either.

I think the beeping in reverse thing is mostly with commercial vehicles.

Four adult sized bicycles fit into my van with enough room left for 6 passengers.

 

[GrainneDhu]

If one can call 911 and has a working clock on their cell phone, would the phone not ping from nearby towers?

Such phones don't have a unique identifying number (telephone number). As I understand it, there are hundreds of thousands of unidentified cell phones pinging off towers across the US and no way to differentiate which is which.

 

[georger]

SS says he saw two people fishing at the lake after he swerved around the bikes. Is it possible those bikes were there bikes? I believe Lyric was riding a mountain bike, I can't remember what Elizabeth was riding. But maybe TG didn't see the girls bikes and that is why police have never used that time.

SS said upthread that LE never confirmed if the bikes matched the description of the girls bikes.

Did LE or the family ever confirm those are the girl's bikes? !!! If they aren't then we have been on a wild goose chase with this! The bikes are the ONLY link to being at the Park.

 

[SapphireSteel]

Did LE or the family ever confirm those are the girl's bikes? !!! If they aren't then we have been on a wild goose chase with this! The bikes are the ONLY link to being at the Park.

Drew confirmed that they were.

Also, the dogs located their scent.

 

[georger]

Drew confirmed that they were.

Also, the dogs located their scent.

Thanks. Just confirming it.

 

[superbee]

Such phones don't have a unique identifying number (telephone number). As I understand it, there are hundreds of thousands of unidentified cell phones pinging off towers across the US and no way to differentiate which is which.

Thank you. Makes sense. I don't have a cell phone, we are around the corner of a mountain from the tower, so in a dead zone.