Found Deceased IA - Mollie Tibbetts, 20, Poweshiek County, 19 Jul 2018 *Arrest* #38

[MassGuy]

DNA is actually preserved in a decomposing body.

It can be, it just depends on the conditions the body is exposed to, and the state of decomposition.

 

[Jaclin]

I looked at the research on it and it appears that sperm degrades quite quickly. We’re talking about DNA from sperm specifically and not DNA in general.

but there could also be dna from his skin cells in that area.

 

[Rossymom]

I did notice in all of the pictures I have seen of Mollie (probably less than ten) that she was always smiling. In her obituary picture ( a beautiful picture of Mollie) she is not smiling. I like the picture because the picture is beautiful and there is no reason for a smile.
I guess I am rambling.

I noticed that too.
It is also in black and white.
A very moving photograph.

 

[sripey]

Not to be indelicate, but in the vaginal canal the DNA from any potential interaction with the penis would be there and if there were any semen it would be detectable. DNA's half life is 521 years. If you have a sample to compare it against, a month is not going to matter.

Unfortunately after a month of decomp in those conditions, all of her organs will be gone.

Otto, was Matthews' DNA found on Morgan Harrington? I thought the DNA link came from her shirt.

 

[Mom24]

That's certainly what happened with Morgan Harrington. She was little more than bones when found, but there was DNA linking her to an attempted sexual assault.

In some situations where decomp has progressed that far the maggots that have been feeding off the body can be tested for DNA. DNA is much more durable than people realize.

 

[NewYork625]

This seems rather Occam's Razorish, doesn't it?

Opportunist grabs Mollie during her evening jog to her mother's house. She is within minutes of her mother's house when she encounters a stranger who has been circling the block waiting for her, and who admits running to her and putting her in his car. He admits to finding evidence related to the attack in the front seat of his car and in the trunk. He hid her body 15 - 20 miles from where she was abducted. The day after the murder, no one noticed anything unusual about him. A suspect was arrested as soon as police identified the vehicle associated with her abduction.

After eliminating everything that is not necessary, then whatever is left, no matter how unlikely, is what happened.

That is as straight forward as it gets.
Occam's Razor.

Or would it be more likely to assume it would have been someone close to her, therefore this is less Occam's Razor?

 

[MsBetsy]

Al Hoffman provided a long, detailed and informative article on that very subject in the last thread, with pictures. It is a post with "Warning, graphic Details, if you can find it, I think you may be interested. Not sure how to bring it over but maybe someone else does. It was an excellent article and explains every stage and factors that influence rate of decomposition. I found it very helpful but then again I'm a little weird. Some may find it appalling.

Sorry too late to edit but the article I referred to does not have pictures( that would be appalling) I was thinking of the sharp force injuries article which has example of each type of cut. Sorry.

 

[gregjrichards]

It is very sad indeed Mollie’s death has been politicised and there are tensions in the community I am sure Mollie wouldn’t want either.

Thinking of Mollie’s loved ones at her funeral on Sunday.

 

[Rossymom]

Unfortunately after a month of decomp in those conditions, all of her organs will be gone.

Otto, was Matthews' DNA found on Morgan Harrington? I thought the DNA link came from her shirt.

I need to revisit this case of JM because somehow his dna was also linked to a third victim in Fairfax, VA. (I lived in Fairfax when H was missing and found).

 

[Stormy21]

Technical paper on DNA evidence recovery. Some interesting points about DNA. (from clothing, which is a primary way). Even after submersion, DNA can be recovered. The investigators found the blood or semen stains yield DNA ever after high temp and detergents. (from cells left)

An investigator would recover DNA from clothes, stains (blood and other), and victim sites (fingernails etc. It seems the DNA persistence is quite good.

Obviously investigators are looking for a weapon. And I bet they are analyzing the suspect's clothing too.

Sorry if this is too much 'in the weeds' or too technical. But DNA is not only the forensics of the future, but also the medicine of the future.

 

[otto]

Unfortunately after a month of decomp in those conditions, all of her organs will be gone.

Otto, was Matthews' DNA found on Morgan Harrington? I thought the DNA link came from her shirt.

Good point! I don't remember, but I do know that her t-shirt was found close to the time that she went missing.

I guess we'll have to wait and see. It's reasonable to believe that she was not a skeleton, so hopefully DNA will remove all doubt about guilt.

Laci Peterson was rolling around at the bottom of the shipping channel for four months and the one part of her body that was protected was her unborn baby.

 

[Charliegizmo49]

In reference to how ME came to the preliminary conclusion of sharp force trauma as COD even though her body was most likely in the final stages of decomp: Of course, X-rays and just observing wounds/knicks on her bones... Especially, if he wounded her in the chest, the breast bone is a rather flat surface, so, identifying damage in that area may be obvious, in some cases.

Also, maybe she was still clothed, so, the fabric could have been cut in some way creating a wound pattern to trace back to her body.

This is just a preliminary report as more evidence may come from her autopsy after a more thorough investigation: People can theoretically die in multiple ways at the same time: Meaning there could be other types of trauma to her body that has yet to be discovered; the sharp wounds were apparently the most lethal and obvious during the preliminary autopsy.

I disagree. The prelim would include all that was completed Wednesday. Including internal and external findings. The ME is now waiting results from fluids, swabs, DNA , and other outside lab tests ordered. I would expect the remains have been released to the Local funeral home.

 

[Ilovemy3boys]

It is very sad indeed Mollie’s death has been politicised and there are tensions in the community I am sure Mollie wouldn’t want either.

Thinking of Mollie’s loved ones at her funeral on Sunday.

Agreed.

Details Continue to Emerge in Mollie Tibbetts Murder Case – Rolling Stone


However, while the media’ coverage has largely reported Rivera was undocumented as a fact, that allegation has been in dispute. For the last four years, Rivera was employed at Yarrabee Farms, a dairy farm owned by the family of former Iowa GOP official Craig Lang, which initially claimed that Rivera had been vetted as legal to work through the government’s e-Verify system. On Wednesday, Rivera’s attorney, Allan Richards, cited their assurances in his motion for a gag order, saying media reports and Trump’s statement about his client’s alleged “illegal” status have impeded his right to a fair trial.

 

[Stormy21]

Does anyone think maybe her body didn't decompose super fast due to the corn stalks covering her body? Isn't it actually hard to make corn stalks decompose? Or would the heat/rain make none of this matter?

Unless a body were frozen, decomposition will occur. The first few stages are due to internal factors - enzymes etc. Then micro-organism contributions.

There are a host of other factors -- insects, wounds, and heat/humidity. So i would think that environmental factors would affect things, but the course is generally set.

 

[Stormy21]

Only at this point voluntarily or by court order.

On booking. SCOTUS has determined DNA swabs are like fingerprints.

 

[MassGuy]

I disagree. The prelim would include all that was completed Wednesday. Including internal and external findings. The ME is now waiting results from fluids, swabs, DNA , and other outside lab tests ordered. I would expect the remains have been released to the Local funeral home.

They talked about hiring experts to include a forensic anthropologist, so I don’t think the remains would be released until that part is complete.

“State medical examiner Dennis Klein said in an interview the finding means a sharp-edged or pointed object such as a knife was used to attack Tibbetts. He declined comment on the details of her injuries, and said his office would hire consultants, including forensic anthropologists, to analyze her remains further and make additional findings.”

 

[Charliegizmo49]

Agreed.

Details Continue to Emerge in Mollie Tibbetts Murder Case – Rolling Stone


However, while the media’ coverage has largely reported Rivera was undocumented as a fact, that allegation has been in dispute. For the last four years, Rivera was employed at Yarrabee Farms, a dairy farm owned by the family of former Iowa GOP official Craig Lang, which initially claimed that Rivera had been vetted as legal to work through the government’s e-Verify system. On Wednesday, Rivera’s attorney, Allan Richards, cited their assurances in his motion for a gag order, saying media reports and Trump’s statement about his client’s alleged “illegal” status have impeded his right to a fair trial.

Even lawyers have to try.

 

[JnRyan]

Unfortunately after a month of decomp in those conditions, all of her organs will be gone.

Otto, was Matthews' DNA found on Morgan Harrington? I thought the DNA link came from her shirt.

I thought his DNA came from Morgan Harrington's shirt, too. Supposedly found nearby where she was last seen.

 

[Stormy21]

In some situations where decomp has progressed that far the maggots that have been feeding off the body can be tested for DNA. DNA is much more durable than people realize.

That's right. DNA is going to be recovered in almost all situations. The extraction and amplification techniques are getting pretty powerful now.

 

[Jaclin]

How fast do you think LE would have been on him when one of the residents of this small town decides to just up and leave randomly while they are investigating a huge missing person's case being watched by the nation?

especially after working on the farm for 4 years. definitely him leaving overnight would qualify as strange behavior. At first, they might think maybe he was abducted, too. But, after looking at the car it would have become clear.